Vincent Valentine: The Tape

[FredFromDartmouth]

The game tapea against Nebraska is rather disappointing. He looks slow and awkward and not as strong as you would think he should be, i.e. in other words the next Ron Brace. He got boxed out on a few plays, including one that resulted in a TD.

However the good news, sort of, is that he appears injured or tired in this tape; watch how gingerly he gets up from the ground. That is correctable so hopefully he can contribute, but this tape is not so good. BB must have seen something. Also he looks prematurely old, like he is 40, ugh.

Is he the next Ron Brace or Sugar Bear Hamilton? I am leaning toward Sugar Bear.



The second tape is way better; I suspect that this was from a game in which he was not injured.



This tape is the highlights and he appears much more spry (maybe he was not injured):

 

[jah]

What's Elandon Roberts got to do with him?

 

[NG Pats Fan]

Ugh a huge reach and possible bust in the 3rd round. There were much better college players still on the board. Sometimes I don't understand what the patriots front office is thinking. How could they see this guy as being a better NFL player than some far more productive college players that were still available at the time of the Valentine pick


A friend of mine goes to Nebraska. Here is what he told me about Valentine

"As a Nebraska fan, he'll never be good. Has a lot of natural ability and a great frame, but is very fat and lazy. Teammates challenged his work ethic in college and he didn't respond. Didn't progress at all from his freshman year to junior year"

Frustrating....

 

[Love The Drake]

Ugh a huge reach and possible bust in the 3rd round. There were much better college players still on the board. Sometimes I don't understand what the patriots front office is thinking. How could they see this guy as being a better NFL player than some far more productive college players that were still available at the time of the Valentine pick


A friend of mine goes to Nebraska. Here is what he told me about Valentine

"As a Nebraska fan, he'll never be good. Has a lot of natural ability and a great frame, but is very fat and lazy. Teammates challenged his work ethic in college and he didn't respond. Didn't progress at all from his freshman year to junior year"

Frustrating....

Maybe he will get in line for NFL money though.
He seemed motivated to prove people wrong.
Would love for him to do so.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

What's Elandon Roberts got to do with him?

Because I am sick and I messed up! Mea Culpa

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

Ugh a huge reach and possible bust in the 3rd round. There were much better college players still on the board. Sometimes I don't understand what the patriots front office is thinking. How could they see this guy as being a better NFL player than some far more productive college players that were still available at the time of the Valentine pick


A friend of mine goes to Nebraska. Here is what he told me about Valentine

"As a Nebraska fan, he'll never be good. Has a lot of natural ability and a great frame, but is very fat and lazy. Teammates challenged his work ethic in college and he didn't respond. Didn't progress at all from his freshman year to junior year"

Frustrating....

Ugh. That is surprising since with the exception of Ron Brace BB has been very good at picking defensive linemen. Frustrating if this turns out to be true.

 

[oldrover]

They're looking for fat and lazy?!?! Maybe the Pats should have drafted Pablo Sandoval.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

They're looking for fat and lazy?!?! Maybe the Pats should have drafted Pablo Sandoval.

Or any of the contributors here.

 

[TheRazorsEdge]

I have high hopes, he was essentially brought in to atleast handle Hicks snaps/duties.

A) He is incredibly athletic considering his ...B) Massive size AND the fact he is going to an established defense with amazing coaching/leaders it could be a home run hit.

It will all fall on if the coaching staff can bring it out of this kid.

Anything we get beyond a few snaps a game where he does his job would be a + .. line is already ridiculously stacked.

 

[Love The Drake]

I have high hopes, he was essentially brought in to atleast handle Hicks snaps/duties.

A) He is incredibly athletic considering his ...B) Massive size AND the fact he is going to an established defense with amazing coaching/leaders it could be a home run hit.

It will all fall on if the coaching staff can bring it out of this kid.

Anything we get beyond a few snaps a game where he does his job would be a + .. line is already ridiculously stacked.

I'll have what hes having.
I would The Chandler Jones thing made sense the thing is retaining Hicks would of made alot more sense I know they tried and maybe he didnt prefer to be here.
The money Chicago have him wasnt as high as I thought they would go.
Knighton is the wildcard if he can play like he did in Denver and we can get Grissom to give us speed in the middle on third and long that goes a long way.
Speaking of Long that is the most inportant piece having Long or Flowers or RUFUS step up goes a long way.
We know Sheard is a beast but im concerned Father time will catch up with Nink and he loses 2 steps this season.
Do you rememeber how Vrabel and Pleasant looked going after the QB?
Wasnt pretty and Nink isnt the athlete that Andre Carter was.
As far as Dwight Freeney?
Liability against the run and spin master on passing downs.
Ill pass id rather give Flowers,Grissom,RUFUS the chance to show me youth atheticism coming off the edge.
Will be very interesting and I beleive it will be ugly the first few weeks before we see huge steps.
Im completely expecting a L against Arizona and Chandler Jones to have 2.5 sacks and them the board will go crazy and the people who said we should of traded Jones I am one of those will revolt and call for BBs head.
However by week 4 we will have a good enough pass rush with sprinkles of very good.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

I have pretty high hopes for Valentine. You can see the devastating power of his bull rush when he plays with correct leverage. Maybe playing with Branch and Knighton (similar sized players who also had questions about conditioning and desire) will be just what he needs to point him in the right direction. The difference between his tape while injured and while healthy is pretty remarkable. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

 

[RayClay]

The game tapea against Nebraska is rather disappointing. He looks slow and awkward and not as strong as you would think he should be, i.e. in other words the next Ron Brace. He got boxed out on a few plays, including one that resulted in a TD.

However the good news, sort of, is that he appears injured or tired in this tape; watch how gingerly he gets up from the ground. That is correctable so hopefully he can contribute, but this tape is not so good. BB must have seen something. Also he looks prematurely old, like he is 40, ugh.

Is he the next Ron Brace or Sugar Bear Hamilton? I am leaning toward Sugar Bear.



The second tape is way better; I suspect that this was from a game in which he was not injured.



This tape is the highlights and he appears much more spry (maybe he was not injured):

I think it's obvious he was struggling with ankle or other leg injuries much of his soph and junior years.

I linked a vid from his freshman year someplace. Healthy, he should snap back, I imagine. Ankles heal.

 

[WazzuWheatfarmer]

He's a very rare athlete for a man his size. There are some technique issues, but his size/strength/athleticism is off the charts. I like his chances to be a very good player in NE.

 

[oldrover]

They're looking for fat and lazy?!?! Maybe the Pats should have drafted Pablo Sandoval.

Or any of the contributors here.

Hey!!!! I'm not...














...fat.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

His combine tape is pretty bad. His body is like mine, alas. I am not sure he got airborne in his high jump. How is he going to pass the conditioning drill in camp?

2016 Combine workout: Vincent Valentine

 

[RobertWeathers]

His combine tape is pretty bad. His body is like mine, alas. I am not sure he got airborne in his high jump. How is he going to pass the conditioning drill in camp?

2016 Combine workout: Vincent Valentine

My god. The team isn't looking for the next Jamie Collins here. The guy weighs 330lbs. There is nothing graceful about him. Put this in perspective...

The 6'3 5/8, 329 lbs Valentine offers the best broad jump and 2nd best shuttle time of any 325+ lbs defensive tackle over the past decade.

Vince Wilfork apparently had a max squat of 505 lbs when he was coming out of college. Valentine is able to squat 50% more.

According to the Patriots weight room records from 2013 courtesy of NESN's Doug Kyed, a 745 lbs squat would set the team record, surpassing offensive lineman Joe Andruzzi's squat of 725 lbs. The team record for a defensive lineman is 685 lbs fromEthan Kelley.

So Valentine is not only one of the quickest and most explosive defensive tackles in recent memory, he's also the strongest.

This does not mean he can play here. This does not mean he is a good football player. What it does mean that for a man his size his lower body strength and agility is pretty freaking good.

2016 NFL Draft: Rookie DT Vincent Valentine Might Be the Strongest Player in Patriots History

 

[TheRazorsEdge]

At worst he is depth as a run stuffer due to his massive size...at best the patriots can tap into his potential and create a disruptive monster. Team is pretty set everywhere....don't have a problem with a little reach (for once).

 

[IcyPatriot]

At worst he is depth as a run stuffer due to his massive size...at best the patriots can tap into his potential and create a disruptive monster. Team is pretty set everywhere....don't have a problem with a little reach (for once).

Exactly ... good post. I am sure there was a handful of safe picks at that spot ...
Safe does not exactly win Super Bowls ... I like this roll of the dice for it's potential.

 

[RobertWeathers]

At worst he is depth as a run stuffer due to his massive size...at best the patriots can tap into his potential and create a disruptive monster. Team is pretty set everywhere....don't have a problem with a little reach (for once).

Exactly. With these players some attributes are fixed and some are variable. Things like quickness, instincts, and intelligence are fixed. Other attributes like strength, work ethic and becoming a fundamentally solid player are variables.

Pats think that they are positioned to get the most out of him. If they didn't they wouldn't have drafted him.

We'll find out...

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

OK, I see your point. There seems to be two versions of this guy. One guy showed excellent strength and push while the other version was Ron Brace. I hope it is just an easy-to-recover-from injury issue.

As far as this statement: "best broad jump and 2nd best shuttle time of any 325+ lbs defensive tackle over the past decade", I am not so sure. He did not register in the top 15 in any category at the Combine including shuttle and broad jump; maybe he is still injured.