UFA Glenn Dorsey

[DW Toys]

at 6'1 1/2" tall, I don't see Dorsey being a fit here.

Have to agree Cousin. We had that guy the last few years with Myron Pryor. When healthy , not bad. Just not the stuffer /pass rush type. The sleeper at DT might be FA Lions Sammie Lee Hill.6'4" 329. Can't move up in front of Suh. The feeling on him is a very good interior rusher for a big man.17 QB hurries in a limited role. He is only 26. 4.97 40!!!

DW Toys

 

[ATippett56]

Chung and Gregory will not be starting.

Patrick Chung has become irrelevant, so I'm not sure why you even mention him. Chung only played one snap against the Houston Texans and two snaps against the Baltimore Ravens in the 2012 AFC Playoffs. It's time to move on from Patrick Chung, who will be an unrestricted free agent anyways.

McCourty will be at FS for the duration of the year. We will continue the progression of Wilson as a high pick who's been given reps at different roles, and both he and Gregory will be in backup support/role bits. We can continue to add depth if both a FA/draft pick are chosen, not to mention all of the other various ways to improve upon the position.

I have no problem with Devin McCourty playing free safety, just that he remain there so other defensive positions can be solidified in the process. Gregory is nothing more than a thirty year old backup free safety who incidentally has the third highest cap hit of any defensive player currently on the roster for the 2013 NFL Season. That is misuse of salary cap dollars that incidentally could be utilized for the re-signing of any number of pending mid-level unrestricted free agents:

Danny Woodhead
Julian Edelman
Kyle Arrington

It's obviously not ideal, but a nice draft pick and/or a bigger FA signing (which would not necessarily break the bank) would be a HUGE step in a positive direction. I'm not saying that solves everything, but it's a damn good start.

I think that one of our bigger FA needs this year, if not the biggest, is signing one of those guys who can immediately step in and add to the progression of the secondary.

I currently view safety as the third highest priority with regards to the 2013 NFL Draft:

Priority One: Cornerback
Priority Two: Wide Receiver
Priority Three: Safety

 

[DW Toys]

JAGS? You want to talk about JAGS? I list you a whole slew of JAGS:

Patrick Chung
Steve Gregory
Kyle Arrington
Derrick Martin
Marquice Cole
Malcolm Williams

I don't know what the love is for McCourty at S. Please fill me in Cousins. We were again one of the worst in pass completions, passing TD's against and passing yardage. Am I the first to see "bust" on this guy? This guy was our best safety? Gregory is mediocre but did he not make bigger plays than McCourty?
DW Toys

 

[supafly]

Patrick Chung has become irrelevant, so I'm not sure why you even mention him.

It's relatively obvious that Chung has become irrelevant, but I mention him under the "biggest factors" of improvement area because he was one of our two starting safeties for at least 1/2 of the year!!

That's the entire point...that Chung will not be here. That is certainly an area of improvement in and of itself.

The other more obvious factor in that area is that McCourty will be playing FS for the entire season, which certainly did not happen.

Those are 2 enormous reasons for the improvement of the secondary down the stretch, and they certainly give us reason for optimism at the position moving forward.

They are really either a bigger FA signing or a higher round draft pick away from fielding a much better group of safeties as starters, backups/role players, and depth guys than in 2012. One could even make a very strong case that they are already in much better position than in the past 2 years, as we will now have improvement at both starters and depth.

 

[supafly]

I don't know what the love is for McCourty at S. Please fill me in Cousins. We were again one of the worst in pass completions, passing TD's against and passing yardage. Am I the first to see "bust" on this guy? This guy was our best safety? Gregory is mediocre but did he not make bigger plays than McCourty?
DW Toys

It's nice to hear from you DWToys, but I can't reasonably justify a response to this inquiry with a straight face...

If you did not see McCourty as a very decent FS down the stretch then you must be watching the wrong team.

He has great speed, tackles well, is extremely rangy, and makes the QB'ing calls of the secondary himself. He brings a terrific young presence back there to solidify the position, but also brings a 4th year experience to the table.

As a matter of fact, both Bedard and SMY reported during the summer that Belichick wanted him to return to FS for the entire season, but did not think that we had enough adequate depth at CB to do so.

To top it off, McCourty actually even played the position of CB much better when compared to last year too. The stats show it.

 

[ATippett56]

Those are 2 enormous reasons for the improvement of the secondary down the stretch, and they certainly give us reason for optimism at the position moving forward.

The two enormous reasons for optimism going forward are McCourty starting at free safety and Dennard starting at left/right cornerback. At least three roles were defined in the New England Patriots defensive secondary during the second half of the 2012 NFL Season:

Free Safety: Devin McCourty
Left/Right Cornerback: Alfonzo Dennard
Dime Back: Tavon Wilson

Going forward, three more defensive roles need to be defined:

Strong Safety:
Left/Right Cornerback (opposite of Dennard):
Nickel Back:

 

[supafly]

I have no problem with Devin McCourty playing free safety, just that he remain there so other defensive positions can be solidified in the process. Gregory is nothing more than a thirty year old backup free safety who incidentally has the third highest cap hit of any defensive player currently on the roster for the 2013 NFL Season. That is misuse of salary cap dollars that incidentally could be utilized for the re-signing of any number of pending mid-level unrestricted free agents:

Danny Woodhead
Julian Edelman
Kyle Arrington

I currently view safety as the third highest priority with regards to the 2013 NFL Draft:

Priority One: Cornerback
Priority Two: Wide Receiver
Priority Three: Safety

The priority list would depend on many factors, one of the biggest would be whether or not Belichick would want the experience of a proven NFL player in free agency, or whether or not he'd want to take another flier in the draft to save money.

Another huge factor in the priority list would be whether or not he re-signs Talib or makes any kind of other move in terms of free agency.

The last would be whether or not we retain Wes Welker. That goes a long way in determining how the position of WR is addressed moving forward, not just due to cap dollars but also for talent.

Belichick may not feel that choosing a developmental WR (because that's basically what they are in this system) for the first year would necessarily do too much for us at the moment, so he may decide to address it via free agency on a lower/middle tiered level.

No matter how you look at it though, the fact remains that we have a need at the safety position, but that should be one of the easier areas to address with a deeper crop of draft choices and some good free agents. The position itself is also not nearly as costly as CB or WR, and that's reason enough to think that it may end up being addressed via FA.

 

[Sciz]

I don't know what the love is for McCourty at S. Please fill me in Cousins. We were again one of the worst in pass completions, passing TD's against and passing yardage. Am I the first to see "bust" on this guy? This guy was our best safety? Gregory is mediocre but did he not make bigger plays than McCourty?
DW Toys

Well I can give you one stat that matters.
30 yard passes down the middle without McCourty at FS: 7
30 yard passes down the middle with McCourty at FS: 1

 

[supafly]

At least three roles were defined in the New England Patriots defensive secondary during the second half of the 2012 NFL Season:

Free Safety: Devin McCourty
Left/Right Cornerback: Alfonzo Dennard
Dime Back: Tavon Wilson

The fourth role which was easily defined was Arrington at the star, where he plays much, much better.

We will have to see how Belichick feels about him staying there + his potential to play outside still in a pinch, as he certainly has experience in doing both.

I also do not imagine him to cost that much in the big picture either.

 

[DocHoliday]

It's nice to hear from you DWToys, but I can't reasonably justify a response to this inquiry with a straight face...

If you did not see McCourty as a very decent FS down the stretch then you must be watching the wrong team.

He has great speed, tackles well, is extremely rangy, and makes the QB'ing calls of the secondary himself. He brings a terrific young presence back there to solidify the position, but also brings a 4th year experience to the table.

As a matter of fact, both Bedard and SMY reported during the summer that Belichick wanted him to return to FS for the entire season, but did not think that we had enough adequate depth at CB to do so.

To top it off, McCourty actually even played the position of CB much better when compared to last year too. The stats show it.

One thing that doesn't get thrown around as much as it should:

While BB loves DMC at safety, he also very much values his ability to revert to CB extremely effectively.

This allows for some exotic CB-S switching schemes like the Patriots pulled against Manning many years ago.

I would think that Bill would pull this trick with DMC and Tavon Wilson, switching the safety spot and the TE responsibilities, or a DMC and Dowling move (if healthy) since Dowling has often been described as being a fit for safety physically.

 

[ATippett56]

The priority list would depend on many factors, one of the biggest would be whether or not Belichick would want the experience of a proven NFL player in free agency, or whether or not he'd want to take another flier in the draft to save money.

You're smarter than that. Currently, the New England Patriots only have two cornerbacks under contract for the 2013 NFL Season: Dennard and Dowling. Are you seriously relying on Dowling to provide meaningful snaps next season?

As for free agency, I fully understand that the New England Patriots may explore that venue. However, in this aerial circus age, a NFL franchise needs five cornerbacks on the roster. I seriously doubt the New England Patriots would expend salary cap dollars in unrestricted free agency for the four other cornerbacks.

 

[supafly]

You're smarter than that. Currently, the New England Patriots only have two cornerbacks under contract for the 2013 NFL Season: Dennard and Dowling. Are you seriously relying on Dowling to provide meaningful snaps next season?

As for free agency, I fully understand that the New England Patriots may explore that venue. However, in this aerial circus age, a NFL franchise needs five cornerbacks on the roster. I seriously doubt the New England Patriots would expend salary cap dollars in unrestricted free agency for the four other cornerbacks.

The statement that you are quoting was referring more to the safeties specifically. We may pursue the avenue of going after a proven vet who can step in immediately, which would instantly give us a much better safety grouping right off the bat, and would not necessarily be out of the price range like many other positions.

The CB position is entirely different due to the fact that we should sign at least ONE of Talib/Arrington, which instantly gives us 3 (and McCourty as a 4th depending upon what they want to do at the position of safety, as there are options). If you're saying that we'll likely draft a CB, I would certainly agree with you, but it very well may be explored via FA also. I have no idea where you are getting "4 other CB's" from?

As far as Dowling goes, he's still on the roster and he's still a high pick with potential. We have no idea if he can play or be dependable, so no we shouldn't "count on him." We also should not forget about him either, as he will once again be in the mix for a spot. It would help if he could stay healthy.

SAFETIES

1.McCourty

2. (W.Moore, Byrd, Delmas, Reed, Phillips, Hope, Clements, Crocker, Quin, Demps, Harris, L.Landry, Goldson, McBath, Bell, Clemons, Mundy, Jackson, Williams)---all free agents possibilities at a position that is affordable, is in need, and has been explored in the past couple/few seasons this way

3.Wilson

4.Gregory

5. Still leaves room for either a draft pick or other depth moves via the usual options


CORNERS

1. Dennard

2. Dowling

3. Probable retainment of ONE of either Talib/Arrington

4. (Grimes, S.Smith, Porter, Cason, Jammer, M.Trufant, C.Houston, DRC, Jenkins, S.Brown, K.Lewis, C.Williams, R.Mathis, Powers, Cox, Coe, Witherspoon, C.Griffen, Mouton)--all free agent possibilities

5. Still leaves room for a draft pick or other depth moves via the usual options

 

[1%er]

It's relatively obvious that Chung has become irrelevant, but I mention him under the "biggest factors" of improvement area because he was one of our two starting safeties for at least 1/2 of the year!!

That's the entire point...that Chung will not be here. That is certainly an area of improvement in and of itself.

The other more obvious factor in that area is that McCourty will be playing FS for the entire season, which certainly did not happen.

Those are 2 enormous reasons for the improvement of the secondary down the stretch, and they certainly give us reason for optimism at the position moving forward.

They are really either a bigger FA signing or a higher round draft pick away from fielding a much better group of safeties as starters, backups/role players, and depth guys than in 2012. One could even make a very strong case that they are already in much better position than in the past 2 years, as we will now have improvement at both starters and depth.

I obviously am in the minority but I haven't completely ruled out Chung being back on a 1 year prove it deal. I think BB had some issues with him this season and he ended up in the dog house but there is talent and when he is right and can stay healthy he is a difference maker. BB is one to give a second chance. I also don't think Chung will see a lot of interest in this FA class.

 

[Sciz]

I obviously am in the minority but I haven't completely ruled out Chung being back on a 1 year prove it deal. I think BB had some issues with him this season and he ended up in the dog house but there is talent and when he is right and can stay healthy he is a difference maker. BB is one to give a second chance. I also don't think Chung will see a lot of interest in this FA class.

I think that if he were offered two low-money deals, Chung would rather go to Philadelphia and play for Chip Kelly. Maybe I'm reading too much into that one Tweet, but Chung seemed to be awfully upset when he found out he was going to be inactive another game, and that was before he got healthy and still sat behind Gregory.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

I obviously am in the minority but I haven't completely ruled out Chung being back on a 1 year prove it deal. I think BB had some issues with him this season and he ended up in the dog house but there is talent and when he is right and can stay healthy he is a difference maker. BB is one to give a second chance. I also don't think Chung will see a lot of interest in this FA class.

Chung was healthy for the last several games. I missed him making any noteworthy difference the snaps he payed.

If he took vet minimum to stay here (doubt it) I'd keep him to compete in camp because others could get injured. But face it, he does not have the NFL level ability to cover any above JAG NFL player. Maybe not even a JAG. That's why he sat once healthy.