The Brady Vs Manning thing isn't fair at all.

[Flatout]

Oh yeah, the stats on both Brady and Manning's Super Bowl winning runs:

Brady:
2001- 60-97 (61.9%), 1 TD, 1 Interception
2003- 75-126 (59.5%), 5 TD’s, 2 Interceptions
2004- 55-81 (67.9%), 5 TD’s, 0 Interceptions

Manning:

2006- 97-153 (63.4%), 3 TD’s, 7 Interceptions

See a difference?

 

[ColtFreaks...Scotty]

Oh yeah, the stats on both Brady and Manning's Super Bowl winning runs:

Brady:
2001- 60-97 (61.9%), 1 TD, 1 Interception
2003- 75-126 (59.5%), 5 TD’s, 2 Interceptions
2004- 55-81 (67.9%), 5 TD’s, 0 Interceptions

Manning:

2006- 97-153 (63.4%), 3 TD’s, 7 Interceptions

See a difference?

Whatever gets you through the night big guy.

 

[chrisfx811]

It's funny for me to see Pats/Brady fans convincing themselves that they have the best QB in the league. Colts fans don't usually debate the topic. We already know that Manning is better. It's just understood. We dont have to dig up every imaginable stat dating back to his college years to convince ourselves.

Exactly, Patriots fans not only feel confident in supporting their guy, but they have all the numbers to back it up.

Colt's fans just put blinders on, and rock themselves to bed at night, hoping that one day Manning will be half the winner that Brady is.

 

[chrisfx811]

Whatever gets you through the night big guy.

How does it feel to know that Manning has had one of the most complete offenses, for nearly his entire career, yet time after time, manages to choke away the team's chances in the playoffs?
Then he has the audacity to throw his teammates under the bus and whine about injuries.
All those years the Colts were losing and fans were blaming the defense, they should have looked at Peyton's stats.

 

[ColtinIraq]

See - here's the deal. Patsland was all over Manning his MVP year because of all his weapons. So it would be logical to assume that you would agree Brady cannot be the MVP this year because of all the weapons he has.

 

[bradmahn]

See - here's the deal. Patsland was all over Manning his MVP year because of all his weapons. So it would be logical to assume that you would agree Brady cannot be the MVP this year because of all the weapons he has.

In year's that Brady absolutely should have won the Most Valuable Player Award (see '05 and '06) he was shafted for players with better statistical seasons. You ask for "consistency," we ask for consistency.

Is Brady the Most Valuable Player in the truest sense of the award? Probably not. Does he deserve the MVP award that has been given out for the last God knows how long? The one that has gone to the player with the best stats. Yes.

 

[ColtinIraq]

In year's that Brady absolutely should have won the Most Valuable Player Award (see '05 and '06) he was shafted for players with better statistical seasons. You ask for "consistency," we ask for consistency.

Is Brady the Most Valuable Player in the truest sense of the award? Probably not. Does he deserve the MVP award that has been given out for the last God knows how long? The one that has gone to the player with the best stats. Yes.

I am consistent. I believe he will be the MVP this year and deserves it. I believe Manning deserved it when he got it. My post was to point out typical thinking of Pats fans.

 

[Flatout]

Oh, Brady had his bad games in college, especially his first 2 games and the loss against Illinois his senior year. The difference is that Brady actually played out of his mind in most of those losses (see MSU story) albeit NOT ALL while Manning seemed to play his worse (See Florida games and 97 NC game). It has little to do with stats, you don't win them all.

The defense excuse? Is it the Indy defense's fault when they hold the opponent to 20 points and the best offense "in history" gets held to 3 points? Is it the Indy D's fault that Manning throws for 4 interceptions? Its different to lose BECAUSE of your D (courtesy of Cold Hard Facts)-

Brady certainly has the support of a better defense than Manning. But they have hardly been suffocating defenses like those that have carried certain other teams to Super Bowl championships. In fact, New England’s 2001 defensive unit ranked just 24th in total defense, making it the lowest rated defense ever to win a Super Bowl. The 2001 unit did rank sixth in scoring defense, surrendering 17.0 points per game. But 31 of the 39 teams to win a Super Bowl had a better scoring defense that the one Brady played with in 2001.

New England’s 2003 defense was markedly better. It ranked sixth in total defense and No. 1 in scoring defense, surrendering 14.9 points per game. That puts New England’s 2003 unit smack-dab in the middle of the championship pack: 18 Super Bowl winners boasted a better scoring defense than the 2003 Patriots.

Meanwhile, Indy has had at least one Super Bowl caliber defense during the Manning era. In 2002, the Colts fielded a defensive unit that ranked 7th in scoring and 8th in total defense. It was, in other words, a unit that was statistically superior to New England’s 2001 Super Bowl winning defense, which ranked 6th in scoring and 24th in total defense – which, as we mentioned, was the lowest rated defense ever to win a Super Bowl.

 

[chrisfx811]

But thats it you moron. His stats were good enough to win, the defense sucked. My god, you guys had the 2nd ranked defense last year and we had the 28th or something. You should have throttled us, but Brady choked a big Manning Burger in the 2nd half. Dude - it happens to them all. The difference is that you guys always have an excuse to cover for Brady....

His stats in the games he lost to the Pats weren't that good.
Our 2nd ranked defense was how healthy again?
Brady had a subpar game against the Colts last year, no doubt. Throwing to guys who couldn't crack the starting lineup compared to what Manning has had since day 1.
Manning had a pathetic postseason last year. Luckily, he squared off against Rex Grossman for it all.

Manning finally plays a tough game w/o his #1 guy, and rather than give credit to those guys he had out there with him, he whines about getting guys back in there.

 

[Deus Irae]

But thats it you moron. His stats were good enough to win, the defense sucked. My god, you guys had the 2nd ranked defense last year and we had the 28th or something. You should have throttled us, but Brady choked a big Manning Burger in the 2nd half. Dude - it happens to them all. The difference is that you guys always have an excuse to cover for Brady....

Actually, the difference is that the Patriots fans very rarely need to find 'an excuse to cover for Brady', whereas Manning supporters have to do it almost every year. They usually blame the defense. I'm sure, for example, that it was all the defense's fault when Manning put up that whopping 0 points in the playoffs against the Jets (2002), or only 14 points against New England after putting up 447 during the season (2003), or scoring 522 points during the regular season and putting up a tremendous 3 against the Patriots in the playoffs (2004). But, they DID manage to put up 18 against the Steelers, losing 21-18 after being #2 in the league in scoring and going 14-2 (2005) a before finally scoring a victory last season.

So, Manning's glorious playoff losses since Brady became the New England starter produce point totals of:
0
14
3
18

4 games with an average of fewer than 9 points per game out of Manning and his offense. How, exactly, is that somehow on the defense?

 

[Deus Irae]

Again I am not implying that he has not choked once or twice, but regardless, he has been on less talented "TEAMS", than Brady has. Yes, we have the best offense for several season, but as the Raven proved a few years ago, defense wins superbowls.

The point totals for the losing teams in the Super Bowls, since that Ravens team surrendered only 7:

17
21
29
21
10

and the 5 years prior to that Ravens team:

16
19
24
21
17


It seems pretty clear that the Colts offense simply put up losing numbers for a playoff offense. Here are the winning offense totals in those Super Bowls:

21
24
32
48
20
34 (Baltimore)
23
34
31
35
27

Here's what becomes abundantly clear. Winning teams in the Super Bowl have scored a minimum of 20 points in the past 11 matchups, so it's not all been about the defenses, and Manning has failed to reach that point 4 times in his playoff losses since Brady became the NE starter. Quit crying about the defense when it's been the Colts offense, with those Pro Bowl and Hall of Fame players, that's been the weakness of the Indianapolis teams in the playoffs.

 

[ColtinIraq]

And, and, and Brady bangs more models . . . . and, and, and - Good God!

 

[jman924]

And, and, and Brady bangs more models . . . . and, and, and - Good God!

No really. That was a good comeback.
Good God indeed.

 

[Gumby]

Yes, we have the best offense for several season, but as the Raven proved a few years ago, defense wins superbowls.

Ravens "PROVED" that before Polian stuck his sticky fingers into the NFL rule-book and jury-rigged it to favor the offense.

That is why BB built an offensive juggernaut this year to react to the changing rule situation.

(maybe too why the Patriots defense has appeared more pedestrian the last several years.)

 

[ColtinIraq]

Yes, we have the best offense for several season, but as the Raven proved a few years ago, defense wins superbowls.[\quote]

Ravens "PROVED" that before Polian stuck his sticky fingers into the NFL rule-book and jury-rigged it to favor the offense.

That is why BB built an offensive juggernaut this year to react to the changing rule situation.

(maybe too why the Patriots defense has appeared more pedestrian the last several years.)

Guess he waited a couple of years too late to react didn't he.

 

[chrisfx811]

Guess he waited a couple of years too late to react didn't he.

2005 was a rough year.
2006, with Gaffney, Caldwell, and Troy Brown they go to the AFCCG. Nothing went their way from injuries, to officiating, to sickness, and they were 4 points away.

Manning has never faced adversity on the offensive side of the ball throughout his career, yet he still manages to wet himself on the biggest stages.

It's so funny to watch Colt's fans squirm as Brady's onslaught of the record books continues now that he's got big time receivers. That was Manning's sacred territory in this debate, and it's slowly getting taken away and Colt's fans can't stand it.
Just like Marino fans who clung to all those records, while Montana piled up hardware.

 

[SoCalPatsfan90]

You guys are not giving the Pats much credit then if your going to continue to say that the Colts choked there last game, I mean if you think about it what your saying is that the Colts should have won easily

Not so much that Indy should have won easily... the Refs were a bigger threat in that game then Indy. You do realize that Indy drove down the field into NE territory only 1x in 10 possessions. That one time ended in the missed field goal by AV. The rest was gifted field position by bad calls, an amazing INT by Brackett, and a bumbling band of buffoons that were wearing Patriots jerseys when Addai caught that check down pass. Your team didn't do anything that game, it was only close because of 3 plays (2 of which were BS calls, one of which was good running after the catch)...

2/10 possessions had Indy on NE's side of the 50 that night. Yup, you guys should have won easily. Don't take this as arrogance, because I totally respect your team. I just don't respect the way the game was reff'd and feel that was the only reason your team was able to hang in there and almost win.

 

[He Ban Me]

Not so much that Indy should have won easily... the Refs were a bigger threat in that game then Indy. You do realize that Indy drove down the field into NE territory only 1x in 10 possessions. That one time ended in the missed field goal by AV. The rest was gifted field position by bad calls, an amazing INT by Brackett, and a bumbling band of buffoons that were wearing Patriots jerseys when Addai caught that check down pass. Your team didn't do anything that game, it was only close because of 3 plays (2 of which were BS calls, one of which was good running after the catch)...

2/10 possessions had Indy on NE's side of the 50 that night. Yup, you guys should have won easily. Don't take this as arrogance, because I totally respect your team. I just don't respect the way the game was reff'd and feel that was the only reason your team was able to hang in there and almost win.

LOL, dude, you guys won, but were smoked for the better part of 50 minutes. Brady had less than a 50 rating into the 4th quarter, and what, about 100 yards passing?? His 19 yard run? Should have been negated by a hold on Klecko.

That 2nd drive, Colts went from the 9 to the 42 in three plays. Manning looked around and says hell, this is easy.

On the third drive, you realize Indy went from theor own 25, to the NE 49 (meaning your territory) with no third down play right? You guys were really getting gashed. Again, Manning goes deep, and Gonzalez gets raped by your beaten man. Turns out it was a good play, might have prevented a td.

On the 4th drive, HGHarrison clips his own man out of the play, and WHOOP, off he goes. We have gashed you for big play after big play the last several times we have played. Only a matter of time before they broke one.

You realize that each team benefitted from a pick, where they were able to start the drive in the opponents territory?

3rd and 15, Manning eludes the rush (yes, Ugohs replacement gets beat again) and hits Clark for a first down.

Last drive, sadly, Morehead drops the friggin' football, but we still moved it. Great individual efforts by your defense, they came up with the plays when they had to have it. Brady made some sharp throws when needed, and Hayden let him off the hook with the dropped pick. Jump balls to Moss won't (IMO) cut it down the stretch. Again, great win, but you stole one.

 

[Deus Irae]

LOL, dude, you guys won, but were smoked for the better part of 50 minutes. Brady had less than a 50 rating into the 4th quarter, and what, about 100 yards passing?? His 19 yard run? Should have been negated by a hold on Klecko.

That 2nd drive, Colts went from the 9 to the 42 in three plays. Manning looked around and says hell, this is easy.

On the third drive, you realize Indy went from theor own 25, to the NE 49 (meaning your territory) with no third down play right? You guys were really getting gashed. Again, Manning goes deep, and Gonzalez gets raped by your beaten man. Turns out it was a good play, might have prevented a td.

On the 4th drive, HGHarrison clips his own man out of the play, and WHOOP, off he goes. We have gashed you for big play after big play the last several times we have played. Only a matter of time before they broke one.

You realize that each team benefitted from a pick, where they were able to start the drive in the opponents territory?

3rd and 15, Manning eludes the rush (yes, Ugohs replacement gets beat again) and hits Clark for a first down.

Last drive, sadly, Morehead drops the friggin' football, but we still moved it. Great individual efforts by your defense, they came up with the plays when they had to have it. Brady made some sharp throws when needed, and Hayden let him off the hook with the dropped pick. Jump balls to Moss won't (IMO) cut it down the stretch. Again, great win, but you stole one.

Here you go again, acting as if the ridiculous calls had no impact. Without the terrible calls, the Patriots would have won by 20+ points. You can keep the fantasy alive until the playoffs if you want to, but it will all end there if the Colts even make it to the AFCCG.

 

[He Ban Me]

Here you go again, acting as if the ridiculous calls had no impact. Without the terrible calls, the Patriots would have won by 20+ points. You can keep the fantasy alive until the playoffs if you want to, but it will all end there if the Colts even make it to the AFCCG.

Okay, Nostradomus. Pretty much NO call affected Brady and his woeful 52 minute performance. 10 points is 10 points. 73 yard run, and a pick to set us up in NE territory makes it 14.


Your guys did squat for 52 minutes. Our guys forgot it was a 60 minute game