OT: Larry Fitzgerald does not expect to be back with the Cardinals next season

[TBR]

Would rather take the risk on Gordon and his cheap contract

 

[supafly]

Obviously revis and dmac won't be let go because of this but we badly need help at wide out. Its a pile of crap after edelman and lafell.

The only real debate should be exactly "where" the need for WR falls in the priority list.

It's definitely in the top 5, I think we can all agree on that. Personally, I think it's probably after the trenches. I can't see any other position that is as much in need--maybe safety?

 

[supafly]

5m of Revis' contract will hit the cap no matter what. If he gets a contract with lets say 14m per year and it is not specifically structured differently this means that instead of 25m we will pay him 19m.. that is not a huge save..

I doubt that we will see any of the Hernandez money (if he is found guilty) before 2016 if not 2017. I think you are underestimating how tight the cap situation really is (if we resign most of our FA)..

You'd have to cut someone big to have some space for a WR that gets more than 5m+..

I highly doubt that Revis would have a year one cap hit of 19 million dollars on an extension. That's really stretching things in my opinion.

There's no reason we couldn't be 25-30 million dollars under the cap with the right moves, and if Belichick had the opportunity to sign a player that he felt was important, I'm sure he'd consider it.

As I've said about 5x now, I doubt that Fitzgerald comes here, but it's worth pondering due to his professionalism and reputation.

 

[supafly]

I think you are underestimating how tight the cap situation really is (if we resign most of our FA)

As usual, some of our own will be retained, and some will not. This is why most of these debates are futile in the month of January.

 

[Jackson 2]

Before we talk pass rushers...we need to talk Revis and Mccourty along with Ayers and Branch. Then all else falls in

And Fitz is a lot more then a deep threat...

Fantasy freaks.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Fantasy freaks.

huh?

 

[Froob]

The only real debate should be exactly "where" the need for WR falls in the priority list.

It's definitely in the top 5, I think we can all agree on that. Personally, I think it's probably after the trenches. I can't see any other position that is as much in need--maybe safety?

Its funny, apparently we 're fantasy football idiots because we don't think brian tyms and aaron dobson are stars in the making. OL is definitely #1 but wide out is one of the biggest needs like you said. We're one injury away from being in serious trouble.

 

[luuked]

There's no reason we couldn't be 25-30 million dollars under the cap with the right moves, and if Belichick had the opportunity to sign a player that he felt was important, I'm sure he'd consider it.

I think we had this discussion already a few months back and I still remain convinced that, after resigning all key FAs and accounting for the usual operating budget & the rookie pool, there is no way we have more than 10m in cap space.


Anyway, you are right.. lets wait for the end of this season and see how FA will go.. I'd be happy if you are right and we can keep the core players on D and have a healthy amount of cap dollars to spent..

 

[Froob]

Few will agree but I think BB would take back Welker if Welker wanted to come back. Law, Seymour, and Mankind all talked crap and were re-signed, except for Law who BB tried to bring him back multiple times. Unfortunately I doubt Wes would want to come back. He'd be a Nice cheap veteran wide out.

 

[cupofjoe1962]

Receiver is not as glaring a need as resigning Revis and DMac, reinforcing the offensive line and defensive front seven, running back, and tight end IMHO.
.

I believe resigning Revis is our top
Priority. I also know that a lot of people on the board feel McCourty Needs to be a top priority too.

I know McCourty rates high as a safety with Cold Hard Football Facts, but I can't help but remember how many years out secondary got lit up with McCourty at corner & Safety.

Through the years we have had a few game changing defensive players. You know the guy who makes the interception or fumble recovery when it matters most.

Teddy Bruschi, Ty Law, Asanti Samuels, Rodney Harrison were guys who made game changing defensive plays when it mattered most.

Yes, I know Samuel dropped the interception on the Giants final drive in 2007 & left Tyree who made the helmet catch. He also made a lot of key interceptions including the pick six against the Colts in the 2006 AFC Championship game.

Out of our current defense the best two big play difference makers are
Ninkovich & Collins. Vince made a few in the past, but he is not the same player, he use to be.

Revis is also a huge difference maker, although he is yet to get a signature turnover single play in the patriots uniform that I can recall.
With Revis we need to hang our hat on the fact he had turned around our secondary and has allowed us to scheme other players because he is a shutdown corner.

We do have a couple guys on our defense who rate high but are not game changers. They don't make the key turnover when you need it most.

The two guys I am talking about are Mayo & McCourty.

They are good players, but they are not game changers.

I am all for resigning McCourty, but I would never let Revis walk to resign McCourty.

On the other hand I would let McCourty walk to resign Revis.

 

[sevengables_2207]

I think, though am not certain, that the money freed up from the Brady restructure could be used to resign both Revis and McCourty.

 

[supafly]

I think we had this discussion already a few months back and I still remain convinced that, after resigning all key FAs and accounting for the usual operating budget & the rookie pool, there is no way we have more than 10m in cap space.


Anyway, you are right.. lets wait for the end of this season and see how FA will go.. I'd be happy if you are right and we can keep the core players on D and have a healthy amount of cap dollars to spent..

@luuked --if we already had this discussion, then I apologize.

I'm not sure which FAs will be back, and which won't, so I definitely agree that it's difficult to try and project one way or another which positions may be ranked as higher priorities.

I think the best way to go would be to hope for either (or both) a draft pick or another mid/lower type of free agent signing at WR, which would represent better value. On the other hand, if Belichick is really enamored as much as some feel he is with Fitzgerald, then it's possible that something could get accomplished, even with lower odds.

Just think of an offense with Fitzgerald, Edelman, and LaFell (as a WR3), with Gronkowski as the TE. There's no way that Amendola will be back with a 5.7m dollar cap hit, so we could save almost 2 million dollars by releasing him alone.

 

[supafly]

I think, though am not certain, that the money freed up from the Brady restructure could be used to resign both Revis and McCourty.

Not cap-wise. It doesn't change anything cap-wise.

It could free up more cash for Kraft to use though.

 

[Fencer]

If his complaint is that he doesn't get enough balls thrown to him, I really doubt he'd want to come here.

If it's specifically that he's getting murdered in the slot and wants to be back outside, that's a different matter.

HOWEVER, we already have 3 well-paid receivers who are producing, by whom I mean Edelman, LaFell and Gronk. We also have Wright and a variety of young WRs. So even if Amendola leaves, why would we invest in another good and well-paid receiver?

 

[sevengables_2207]

Not cap-wise. It doesn't change anything cap-wise.

It could free up more cash for Kraft to use though.

So the money was to be put into escrow to be paid out to Brady, but now will not, so it could be spent on resigning players like Revis and/or McCourty. This would explain why it will not alter the cap, because the money will be spent by the team in another capacity.

 

[BTTA]

This would explain why it will not alter the cap, because the money will be spent by the team in another capacity.

No, that's not it. The cap isn't lowered by the Brady restructure. There isn't any more cap room now than there was before the restructure. There is just less cash in escrow. It is an entirely different accounting system being affected.

 

[sevengables_2207]

No, that's not it. The cap isn't lowered by the Brady restructure. There isn't any more cap room now than there was before the restructure. There is just less cash in escrow. It is an entirely different accounting system being affected.

I think you may have misread my post. I basically said that the cap is not altered, just the money in escrow. Or, at least I thought I worded it that way. Apologies if not. I have had a bit too much champagne tonight.

 

[chasa]

Fitz has really dropped off with such bad qb play, id be curious to see if his desire to play with a hall of famer out weighs his desire to maintain being one of the highest paid wr's

Denver probably cant afford him with DT and JT needing new contracts, so would Fitzgerald be willing to play with brady for 6-7 million per yer?

who knows.

 

[patfanken]

As much as I fully agree with you that bringing in someone like that does NOT provide good value, there are actually some very decent arguments for an attempt at making it happen:

1)--Fitzgerald would not have a problem picking things up, so he falls into a very small group who'd be practically "guaranteed" to work well with Brady

2)--He's one of those savvy vets with experience, who take every single snap seriously--even if they occur during the off-season and/or practice situations. Think an offensive version of Darrelle Revis. The ultimate professional who is going to give his all on every snap

3)--The lack of outside receiver needs to be addressed one way or another. The problem with paying someone 10 million dollars per year is that you just don't know if they're going to be able to pick up the offense here. (See first reason) That does not apply with Larry Fitzgerald

4)--He's obviously extremely talented, and would allow us to have 3 solid receivers + Gronk at TE. It'd basically be Super Bowl or bust, and that kind of offense could seriously set records. Edelman as the shorter/timing route receiver, LaFell as a possession-type of receiver + YACs, and Fitzgerald as the outside weapon who would likely catch a good 4-5 balls every game

Ultimately, I still feel as though it would be a waste of resources unless Fitzgerald wanted to play with a pro bowl QB and have a shot at a SB so much that he'd be willing to accept a lesser deal. If that's the case, it suddenly becomes a no-brainer in my opinion. I'd still be extremely tempted to give him a call, one way or another, though.

I don't disagree with anything you said. I have nothing but respect for the talent and professionalism of Larry Fitzgerald, even at this late stage of his career. He'd have made a great Patriot. But the fact is he's going to leave AZ because he a has a huge cap number that is impossible to justify.

The problem the WR nazis have with me is the preoccupation with ANY WR that happens to come on the market, let alone the Larry Fitz's of the world. Tell you what though, for all the reason's you give, if you could convince Larry to come to the Pats for $6MM next year and replace DA's cap number, I'd be all for it.

Here's the problem. How are you going to get Larry to come for relatively short money, when his major problem with the Cardinals is not being a main focus of the passing game. If he came to NE he'd have have to be sharing balls with Gronk, Edelman, and LaFell, all 3 1000 yd receivers already. I don't think anyone really thinks Fitzpatrick would take short money to come to the NE to be just one piece of a 4 headed piece of the puzzle. Certainly not when he can go so many places and still be the focus of the offense.....and make more money.

OK that takes care of Fitzgerald, possibility one down and several dozen to go.

 

[varjao]

I like Fitz but I don't see why would he take the pay cut we need him to take when dozens of teams will pay more. I for sure want BB to bring another receiver like Lafell, maybe in the 5 Mi neighborhood and spend the money improving the offensive line. I would rather spend a little more in a good left tackle than That 7 Mi on Solder.