Welcome to PatsFans.com

Looking back on the 2011 draft...I still think it sucked

Discussion in 'Patriots Draft Talk' started by FredFromDartmouth, Jul 15, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. FredFromDartmouth

    FredFromDartmouth Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,982
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +4 / 5 / -0

    Check the posts last year; after the 2010 draft I was elated. After this year's draft I feel deflated. Can someone cheer me up and tell me it was a great draft? Ok how about a good draft?

    Seems like we drafted a couple of JAGs (at least at RB) and future insurance (Solder and Mallet) but not much in the way of impact players for this season.

    Supposedly Solder cannot stop a bull rush; I can see defenses put an NT on him and driving him into Bradys' face

    Is Ras-I the answer to the tall WRs that the Patriots face or was he overdrafted because of his super high Boy Scout credentials?

    Markell seems like a good pick but is it enough to improve the pass rush?

    Lee Smith sounds great but there is a logjam at TE.
  2. Sciz

    Sciz PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2009
    Messages:
    7,224
    Likes Received:
    88
    Ratings:
    +205 / 1 / -0

    I've done this before. Name anybody else you would've rather had and I can tell you why that doesn't make sense.
  3. CanadianPat'sFan

    CanadianPat'sFan Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2009
    Messages:
    1,025
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    BB I am sure knew that the lockout would last into the summer and he would not have much time with many rookies. I really think he was looking more for 2012 out of many of these guys or at least the second half of the season in 2011. I really think that BB will use one of the high 2012 picks to get an impact player who will help us in 2011 not a rookie. Just my opinion.
  4. TealSox

    TealSox Guest

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    The 2011 draft class was nothing to write about, including those drafted by the Patriots. I think the Patriots knew this going into the draft, so they used what picks they had to pick up players that had some upside and couple contribute to the team, in terms of depth.

    I don't think the Pats deceived themselves into thinking that they reeled in a class to match the previous year, but the upside is there.

    - OT, Marcus Cannon could come back a year from now and earn himself a starting spot. No pressure on him to come in after chemo treatments and wear him down in 2011.

    - QB, Ryan Mallett was a "why not" pick. He has most all the tools and the Pats could use depth at QB, especial talented depth. I still like what Ron Wolf said about drafting QBs, you can never have too many of them.

    - OT, Solder is the one that intrigues me. Taken so high instead of seeing the pick traded, he might be the one player that the Pats expect to be a starter, if not Pro Bowler.

    - Both RBs are intriguing. Not that the Pats need one in 2011, but now they have two and they'll be there when/if BJGE hits free agency.

    - TE, Lee Smith will be a tough player to see cut and I don't think the lock out helped him much to prove his worth to the team. At the same time, other teams will want to retain players and may allow Smith to slip into the practice squad.
  5. Don Kipines

    Don Kipines Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2007
    Messages:
    418
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +6 / 0 / -0

    With any draft it's always a guessing game -- if the guys turn out to be decent players, you have a good draft, and if they turn out to be Laurence Maroney, you don't. The problem that most people have with this draft is that the team didn't address perceived needs and also appeared to aim for depth when the team already had good depth, and really seemed instead to need just a few difference-makers on both sides of the ball. Having all those extra picks should have given them the luxury of taking big swings with each draft pick, but they appeared to spend most of the draft trying to hit singles.

    So instead of investing in one Mark Ingram, who might have given them a historically great offense, they invested in Vereen and Ridley, who might be good players but don't really excite fans. And instead of taking a flier on a Greg Romeus late in the draft, they picked a fourth tight end who runs a 4.9 40, which was sort of a bummer.

    That's one way of looking at it. After having a few months to think about it, I now see it differently. I think they did a good job of mixing high-risk/high-reward players with solid-all-around types. Solder, Dowling, Cannon and Mallet were all swing-for-the-fences picks. They all have elite tools and can be physically dominating contributors at their positions. The Solder and Cannon picks in particular were very aggressive. If they re-sign Mankins, you're looking at a line with Solder, Cannon, Mankins and Vollmer, which potentially is devastating, especially when you factor in Gronkkowski and/or Crumpler or Smith as inline blockers at tight end. If those guys pan out, this team will look like the late-seventies Pats with Hannah and Gray, only with a Hall of Fame quarterback under center -- and it's not hard to imagine Ridley and Vereen being the next Cunningham and Calhoun, good running backs who thrived behind a great line. That's a pretty exciting prospect.
  6. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2005
    Messages:
    20,441
    Likes Received:
    116
    Ratings:
    +209 / 4 / -5

    No pressure, perhaps, but according to recent articles, the chemo hasn't slowed Cannon down much if it all.

    They might put him on PUP to start camp, but I wouldn't be in the least surprised if he was on the 53 come opening day. [Not guaranteeing it, either, but it's a good possibility.]
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2011
  7. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2005
    Messages:
    20,441
    Likes Received:
    116
    Ratings:
    +209 / 4 / -5

    And those fans would be ignoring the fact that the Patriots' depth at RB going into the draft was illusory, because they only had one experienced RB under contract (Woodhead) when the draft began.

    As a minor point, the Patriots don't go for high-risk in the first round, which is why they've never taken a first-round DE/OLB-type player and passed on a lot of them in the second round, too.
  8. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    24,098
    Likes Received:
    144
    Ratings:
    +234 / 18 / -38

    #50 Jersey

    Unless and until you decide to stop looking at everything in a "It didn't go my way so I don't like it" frame of mind and start looking at it from a viewpoint of "What needs/issues did the Pats address", you'll never be happy.

    Solder, Vereen, Ridley, Cannon, Smith and Dowling should all see playing time this year. Carter and Williams are long shots at best and could end up on the practice squad.

    Even the best OTs have a bad play or two. Solder handled the bull rush pretty well. And if he does have problems with it as a rookie, the Pats will probably have a TE on his side to help out.

    Also, Solder was drafted in the event that Matt Light signs somewhere else. Light has rebuffed the Pats attempts to sign him to an extension saying that he wants to go to free agency and see what the market brings him. Drafting Solder prevents Light from having the Pats over a barrel or leaving the Pats without someone to plug in at LT going forward.

    Dowling was drafted to play free safety in 2 years. The Pats have handled "tall" WRs pretty well. And the return of Bodden should continue to help that.

    There isn't a log jam at TE if you consider the Pats use a lot of 2 TE sets. This has lowered the number of multi-wr sets they use.

    As for Carter, he'll be a factor on Special teams if he makes the team. Anything beyond that is gravy.
  9. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2007
    Messages:
    5,175
    Likes Received:
    65
    Ratings:
    +113 / 12 / -9

    - Regarding Solder, people talk about how overly conservative BB is, how he gets JAGs but never takes a chance on a player with real BOOM potential, Solder IS that guy. He has tremendous athleticism and has Patriots-character all the way.

    I've been very critical of Solder, but even many top evaluators admit that he is RAW, which fits into my criticisms of him, with the right coaching/training he could be a beast. I'm a HUGE fan of Jake Long and would LOVE to see him protect TFB for the remainder of his career, I think Solder has Jake Long potential. Also, as for reasons mentioned by DaBruinz, it was the strategically smart move considering Light's status, and added benefit to the Solder pick is that the Colts and Giants don't get their hands on him, which can help our pass-rush when playing them:D

    - As far as Dowling goes, many on this board HATE Bang-Clock and would love to see him go, count me in that group. If Dowling can give us a solid FS I'm all for it.

    - Shane Vereen looks like a poor man's Marshall Faulk with the potential to dramatically improve his wealth. He can help provide match-up issues for defenses because they simply don't know what we're going to do with him. While he might not directly be a superstar I think his impact will be tremendous, allowing for a lot more flexibility in our offense.

    - I think Mallett is already an impact player, after we drafted Mallett TFB publically said that he wants to play another 10yrs, I don't think there would have been the same reaction if we drafted Pat Devlin or Greg McElroy in the later rounds, I think BB's selection of Mallett was from a page out of Bill Walsh's book, perhaps BB will use Mallett to light a bit of a fire under TFB's behind. Many people, including myself, have found Brady to have gone to far into celebrity-world, I think the threat of Mallett will bring him back.

    That being said, the guy was the top rated passer in this class. He will serve as depth for THE most critical position on the team, he's a potential heir, and we can likely trade him for big loot down the road in an always QB-needy league. In the future this might go down as one of BB's best picks.

    - Marcus Cannon, the guy was rated by many as a 1st round talent who fell because of his cancer, which apparently is now gone. This was an absolute STEAL of a pick, he will be a BEAST on the O-line for the next decade.

    - Lee Smith, a potential heir to Crumpler, who I adore and wonder why we didnt grab him years ago.

    - As for Carter, picks that late don't really have high expectations attached to them, if he pans out, great, otherwise, he's camp fodder.

    If we can just find a way to get Michael Jasper and Jason McCourty I'll be in hog-heaven. Jasper is one of the most intriguing prospects I've seen in a LONG time. One of the biggest/fattest Guards I've seen but with phenomenal athleticism, I shudder to think of what he's capable of slimmed down, which he's been doing.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyWFh3Lp5u8

    I can't believe he completely slipped under my radar, take a look at this clip and tell me you're not awed by his physical skills.

    - Jason McCourty has become on official binkie of mine, I'd trade Butler and picks for him in a heartbeat. It's tough not to like corners that can actually tackle, and seeing how he's the physical twin of our emerging stud corner I'd say he's a very solid risk depending on the cost.



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6poqraQr08I
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2011
  10. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    24,098
    Likes Received:
    144
    Ratings:
    +234 / 18 / -38

    #50 Jersey

    Jasper was drafted in the 7th round by the Bills.

    Jasper is HUGE.. He was 394 at his Pro Day after losing 73 lbs since January. Yes, you read that right..

    He's extremely raw as he only played OG when he got to his 3rd college stop, Bethel. I would like to know how big the foot prints were that he left after making that 28 inch vertical jump..
  11. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2005
    Messages:
    20,441
    Likes Received:
    116
    Ratings:
    +209 / 4 / -5

    [​IMG]

    :eek:
  12. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2007
    Messages:
    5,175
    Likes Received:
    65
    Ratings:
    +113 / 12 / -9

    In that youtube video he gets up to around 32 inchs on the vertical jump:eek:

    Get him down to a muscular 325lbs and I wouldnt be surprised he he gets up to nearly 40 inches. If BB & Scar can get Stephen Neal, who was a wrestler in college with no football experience to become a starting Guard I think they can make Jasper into a multiple pro-bowler.

    I pray the Bills cut him because his 40 time isn't good enough and we grab him.
  13. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    24,098
    Likes Received:
    144
    Ratings:
    +234 / 18 / -38

    #50 Jersey

    He actually got to 33, but who's counting ;):p

    He needs to be careful about loosing too much weight too quickly. Also, I don't know if he could get down to 325. Looking at him, I'd say he's probably in the 15% body fat range during that video.. Even at 20% and him weighing in at 395 (just to round the number) That's only 79 lbs of fat.. :eek:

    But anyways, If he gets cut, it would be interesting to see if the Pats would be willing to bring him in for a workout..
  14. TealSox

    TealSox Guest

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    If Cannon can come in, learn and avoid the PUP list in 2011, the prospects of having a successful 2011 draft gets a huge boost.

    Fingers crossed!
  15. jeffbiologist

    jeffbiologist Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2007
    Messages:
    1,433
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Not trying to throw ice water on the situation but Cannon is unlike any G we have ever had. If you think of why we liked Neal it was because of strength and athleticizm...not exactly Cannon's strong suits. In some systems he may be a great G but I have a funny feeling he more likely be the G/T backup tweener here.
  16. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2007
    Messages:
    5,175
    Likes Received:
    65
    Ratings:
    +113 / 12 / -9

    What makes you say that? Cannon had 33 reps on the bench press and has been described by many as having the agility and quickness of a much smaller man.
  17. Sciz

    Sciz PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2009
    Messages:
    7,224
    Likes Received:
    88
    Ratings:
    +205 / 1 / -0

    Compared to the rest of the Pats' interior lineman, Cannon tested right around average for straight-line speed and explosiveness, despite being 40-60 pounds heavier than them. His biggest relative weakness was the short shuttle, shows below average change of direction ability. He's going to be able to get to the 2nd level and get out ahead on screens and such, but he's not the guy you want pulling to the other side of the offensive line. He'll have his physical limitations, but it's not like the Pats have never dealt with that before. See Nick Kaczur.

    And I never ever thought I'd see someone call Cannon's strength a weakness, considering he's the heaviest player Belichick has drafted since 2000, and had the most bench reps of any post-2000 Pats draft pick other than Wilfork and Watson. And at least in college, it showed on the field. On 4th and 1, the Pats have a new offensive lineman to run behind once Cannon gets on the field. I'm excited.
  18. NEGoldenAge

    NEGoldenAge Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2007
    Messages:
    2,025
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    If this was posted by almost anyone else, I'd think that it was sarcasm.
  19. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2010
    Messages:
    6,623
    Likes Received:
    75
    Ratings:
    +129 / 5 / -0

    #3 Jersey

    Nice!! [​IMG]
  20. SunnyDenmark

    SunnyDenmark Rookie

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    522
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Strength IS certainly a strong suit of Cannon:
    Former TCU standout refusing to let cancer delay NFL career | NFL | Latest news and video on ...

    "Cannon is one of the strongest players ever to play at TCU. He holds almost every one of the school's weight-room records, including the power clean (500 pounds), the squat (870), the bench press (575) and the incline press (565)."

    And while I am no means a combine expert - I believe his combine numbers were quite good for a man his size / weight.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>