Hype Pre-Draft Thread

[Sciz]

Learn from past mistakes

That means both on and off the field. If we need a receiver, pick a damn receiver. If we need a pass rusher, pick one. Not going after those positions early and not having the quality on the field in those positions has cost us rings. Fact.

Drafting for need rather than value is a terrible long term plan. You don't make a really good team by picking players to fill whatever needs you have at the time. You're better off picking the players that you're confident can fill a spot in the long term rather than a guy who fills a hole for the upcoming year.

 

[Kontradiction]

If they take a CB in the 1st? Yes. If their first pick is in the second and is a corner then its another matter entirely.

If a depth CB is taken before both WR, DE, and even S, then Belichick needs to have his ass kicked all over the war room.

 

[signbabybrady]

If the team selects a CB with their first pick, I might honestly put my fist through my TV.

Why?

You dont think this team still needs one more good CB?

I think our starters look pretty good in Talib and Dennard. I like Arrington out of the Slot. But I worry that Talib is only on a one year deal and I worry that Dennard is only going into his second year.

I think some insurance and someone else to develope would be a good thing.

My preference in the first round would be DE or WR but if took a CB that would be OK. IMO any position in the first round is fine except QB, RB, TE, T and Safety. I put Safety in the not need group because we invested in Tavon last year and Adrian this FAency and with McCourty staying there and Ebner as the 4th for STs I think the position is set.

CB would be wise for the above reasons.

DE would be my preference for the pass rush.

WR IMO is the teams biggest need.

If an interior OL were the best available at 29 and we took him would anyone really be upset about that? We certainly need depth their and the last one we took that high was Mankins and it worked.

LB is not a top priority but we all want a better coverage backer and I think part of the defensive overhall should be trying to add to the LB group that was 5-6 deep with solid talent in our glory years and right now is 3-4 deep.

DT again not a top priorty but big talented DL arent easy to find outside of the first and if one were there at 29 take him.

 

[Kontradiction]

Drafting for need rather than value is a terrible long term plan. You don't make a really good team by picking players to fill whatever needs you have at the time. You're better off picking the players that you're confident can fill a spot in the long term rather than a guy who fills a hole for the upcoming year.

You are aware that the Pats have essentially drafted based on need while still taking the player(s) at the top of their board for the past few years, correct?

 

[Get it shawtaay]

If a depth CB is taken before both WR, DE, and even S, then Belichick needs to have his ass kicked all over the war room.

Talib is a free agent in a year, so corner is clearly a need at a certain level. If a good one is available in the 2nd, and there's no good defensive ends or wide receivers on the board, why not?

 

[BritPat]

Drafting for need rather than value is a terrible long term plan. You don't make a really good team by picking players to fill whatever needs you have at the time. You're better off picking the players that you're confident can fill a spot in the long term rather than a guy who fills a hole for the upcoming year.

The Pats have always drafted for need, coupled with value though.

 

[ATippett56]

Worst case scenario, if the New England Patriots are unable to trade down from the 29th overall selection:

DeAndre Hopkins, WR - Clemson

Need and value all in one.

"Molasses Mike" .... see ya!

 

[BritPat]

Worst case scenario, if the New England Patriots are unable to trade down from the 29th overall selection:

DeAndre Hopkins, WR - Clemson

Need and value all in one.

"Molasses Mike" .... see ya!

Said it elsewhere just the other day - the best fit for offense by some distance.

 

[Get it shawtaay]

Brace, Butler, Cunningham were all drafted to fill needs. What determines a player's contribution is whether or not he's good at football.

Once you get to pick #59, there's a handful of players left, maybe more, who will actually be good. You have to go BPA or you'll just end up with a bad player at a position you need.

 

[TruthSeeker]

I don't think BB drafts for need. I think he has his board, rated by best available athlete, as well as who best fits HIS system. That's why people were baffled by picks like Logan Mankins in the first round, who was rated a 3rd round pick by most pundits/experts, and Deion Branch in the 2nd round, who was rated by some pundits/experts, as a 7th round pick. Why did BB reach for these guys ? He didn't, that's who he had on his board when the Pats pick was next. By the way, sitting there with my trusty Pro Football Weekly Draft guide, I HATED both picks.

BB's picks will always baffle the pundits/experts/fans. Don't be surprised if BB picks an O-Lineman in the first round. Now I just use my draft guides for information about who we pick.

 

[Kontradiction]

Talib is a free agent in a year, so corner is clearly a need at a certain level. If a good one is available in the 2nd, and there's no good defensive ends or wide receivers on the board, why not?

Thing is, it's a very good draft for WR's and DE's.

 

[Kontradiction]

The Pats have always drafted for need, coupled with value though.

They haven't always drafted for need. But if you take a look at their last few drafts, you'll see that drafting for need, particularly early, has been the case.

 

[tonyto3690]

You are aware that the Pats have essentially drafted based on need while still taking the player(s) at the top of their board for the past few years, correct?

That's not completely true.

The Patriots have their big board. They obviously spend much more time scouting positions of need (ie I don't expect a lot of serious RB, QB, TE, or T scouting went on beyond checking a guy out who they think may have a chance of substantially dropping). So to begin with they are of course looking at some areas more than others.

However you're suggesting that they are drafting based on position which isn't true. They draft who is available at where they think they are at a good value position in the draft, and if no one is available they simply trade back/to the future. The Patriots don't say "oh it's our turn to pick, there isn't anyone we value at this spot, so lets just pick the best player left at a need position".

They have guys they want and they manipulate the draft to try to spend the least amount of resources possible to get those players while balancing that with acquiring resources for the future.


The closest thing I can see to being a "need" pick was the Wilson pick last year where he came out of no where. Besides then the Patriots have shown very little in terms of forcing a pick that I can remember in the BB era.

 

[New England Expat]

It’s almost time for the NFL Draft and I’m excited. Like many other NFL fans, I’m starving. All the grandiose trades and free agency acquisitions that our minds have concocted ever since our favorite teams were eliminated from the playoffs never came to reality. That’s alright, we still have the draft to feed our starving minds something exciting.

This will at least carry us until August ,when we can at least get follow the hourly updates of training camp. So we turn on ESPN, our eyes glued to the screen and the scrolling ticker below patiently waiting for our team to finally come up like an investor waiting for his companies’ stock prices. When a representative from our team finally takes the podium and announces your team’s draft selection, there is probably a good chance he’s a player you’ve never heard of the guy. Not to be discouraged, this provides you with at least a good hour of research activities, scouring the internet for any bit of information on the newly acquired player. If you’re lucky, some obsessive college student from the player’s alma mater has already posted a highlight reel of the player on youtube accompanied by AC/DC or some rap song.

After a while of doing some research, you call your fellow fans and confidently talk about these new players as if you had scouted them yourself. You might even scroll the blogosphere for other fan’s opinions of the players, it doesn’t matter that half the comments from these bloggers will be regurgitated tidbits or even verbatim quotes from ESPN articles. The dialogue and discussions created in days following the Draft are the dessert to the previously starving NFL fans. We know it’s going to be a long football-less Summer, especially for the non-baseball fans amongst us, and we’ll take what we can get for now, and the draft is enough to occupy our minds. It’s enough time to fantacize about how the cornerback from Oregon will somehow miraculously transform our last in the league ranked pass defense into an unstoppable force. We fantasize despite our rational brains telling us there’s a good chance he won’t even be a starter until next year. However, there’s always a chance, and this chance only leads an attentive tracking of his progress during training camp.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Werner only posted a 4.83 40 yard dash. That definitely dropped his stock.
He is also only 6'3 with 33 1/4 inch arms. When you add up the size/speed concerns for the DE position, that drops him to the 20s. If he had elite speed/size combo we are talking a top 5-10 pick.

What I don't get. Virtually every draft book I have seen written prior to the Combine have Werner as the #1 DE on the board. Now everyone have him going in the late 20s. Did he really do that bad at the Combine? He isn't a guy who was going to do well in the Combines anyway since he is not known for his speed.

He seems like a perfect fit for the Pats to start opposite Jones on the LDE spot. Hopefully he is still there at 29, but the Broncos might draft him at 28.

Personally, I think d-line is the pick in the first round. The WR position is too deep and there isn't a huge difference between what you can get in the first and the second at that position.

 

[Kontradiction]

That's not completely true.

The Patriots have their big board. They obviously spend much more time scouting positions of need (ie I don't expect a lot of serious RB, QB, TE, or T scouting went on beyond checking a guy out who they think may have a chance of substantially dropping). So to begin with they are of course looking at some areas more than others.

However you're suggesting that they are drafting based on position which isn't true. They draft who is available at where they think they are at a good value position in the draft, and if no one is available they simply trade back/to the future. The Patriots don't say "oh it's our turn to pick, there isn't anyone we value at this spot, so lets just pick the best player left at a need position".

They have guys they want and they manipulate the draft to try to spend the least amount of resources possible to get those players while balancing that with acquiring resources for the future.


The closest thing I can see to being a "need" pick was the Wilson pick last year where he came out of no where. Besides then the Patriots have shown very little in terms of forcing a pick that I can remember in the BB era.

...and Gronk, and Hernandez, and McCourty, and Chung...

 

[patsinthesnow]

This may come of as whining but....

I have CBS, ABC, NBC, CNN, FOX, FOXNEWS, MSNBC, to hear about the week long bombing attack/successful hunt.

We have Patsfans political forum to discuss it.

I come to Patsfans to talk football, I watch ESPN to watch sports (even ESPN was doing breaking news during sportscenter, comeon...).

It's time to lock all the threads up and prepare for the draft.

 

[BelichickFan]

This may come of as whining but....

I have CBS, ABC, NBC, CNN, FOX, FOXNEWS, MSNBC, to hear about the week long bombing attack/successful hunt.

No kidding. Enough already.

Honestly with this draft I want to get back on track. Back on track to me means getting an extra #1 next year. This reminds me of, I think, 2006 when we made a "bad trade" for a #1 next year because it was a weak draft. I would trade #29 for a #3 or #4 this year and a #1 next year to a team with a shot to not be a a playoff team. In 2006 we took a #4 and SF #1 and got Mayo out of it.

If we had a 2,3,4,4 I think we could draft an interesting WR, still get a CB and LB, DL call it good with a longshot WR in the 7th and get back on track with two #1 next year.

 

[BelichickFan]

If we had a 2,3,4,4 I think we could draft an interesting WR, still get a CB and LB, DL call it good with a longshot WR in the 7th and get back on track with two #1 next year.

To put a few names to it I think we could get something like :

David Amerson
Steadman Bailey
Sio Moore
Sam Montgomery
Kenny Stills
Bill's favorite rugby player

if we had a 2,3,4,4,7,7

Argue about the names if you like (I know the issues with Montgomery, he'd be worth a shot mid draft) but these are supposed to go around where I have them.

That group plus re-setting to two #1s next year would make me very happy.

 

[Dragda]

Well, considering the front page has become the political forum and football news has died down, why not have a draft thread on the main forum one week before the event.

This is the second year in a row the Pats have gone into the draft with a massive hole (last year, safety), will we meet WR in the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, not at all?

Who do you find more annoying, Kiper or McShay? Or do you just watch NFLN during the draft instead?

Who will be the next Jets bust at #9?

Discuss anything draft related to get our minds back on football and off these tragedies.

I watch both ESPN and NFLN by using DirectTv DVR recording each channel then pressing the PREV button on the remote to switch between recordings. I FF during Keyshawn Johnson or anyone else that is unwatchable like commercials.

I have a draft party. People that don't have DVR get all twitchy. "Are we live?"

The weekday draft has really cut down on the excitement of the draft party. Now people come mainly to eat my wife's delicious food.