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Do we overvalue Givens?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Boston Boxer, Feb 10, 2006.

  1. Boston Boxer

    Boston Boxer U.S. Air Force Retired PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    here is a remark i read this morning...

    "David Givens, New England: He and Troy Brown are solid if unspectacular Patriot receivers available this offseason. In today's NFL, Givens is the type of player not exciting enough to warrant a long look from other teams, who will end up signing with his previous team for a reasonable amount."

    I hope everyone in the league thinks this way, then he can re sign with the Pats
     
  2. oldrover

    oldrover 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #50 Jersey

    I think that there will be enough coveters of Givens, esp. Mangini, Saban, and Crennel, that he won't come back. Hope I'm wrong.
     
  3. CrazyDave

    CrazyDave In the Starting Line-Up

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    I for one, think we may indeed overvalue him. While he has come up with some big plays, I question his route running ability. I'm no expert, but it seem he's "in the wrong place" quite a bit. Just my take. Does anyone else feel that often times he and Brady just are'nt on the same page?
     
  4. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Just check out any list of available free agent wide receivers. Givens is always in the top 5.
     
  5. shatch62

    shatch62 Practice Squad Player

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    We value him correctly

    I don’t think we over value him because I have not heard one person say we need to re-sign him at any cost. Most posts I have seen have him getting a pretty small deal from the Pats. I do think SOME OTHER TEAM will over pay to get him. Look at the teams out there that desperately need a WR.

    Receptions
    WR #1 WR#2
    Falcons 50 36
    Panthers 103 25
    Bears 64 31
    Eagles* 48 43 *Owens had 47 receptions be he will be gone
    Bucs 83 32
    Redskins 84 22

    Panthers, Bucs and Redskins all have #1 WR but all could use an upgrade at #2. Falcons, Bears and Eagles all lack a #1 (which Givens isn’t) but it only takes one of these teams to make a big offer for him to leave.
     
  6. TeamPats

    TeamPats On the Game Day Roster

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    I think some of the fans do overvalue him a bit, especially the ones suggesting we franchise him. Paying Given $5 mill so we can stall one year just to set a precedent for Branch would be a terrible idea. The beauitful thing about cheering for the New England Patriots is knowing that Bill Belicheck has the inside scoop on every player and he will always make the best judgement when it comes to value. David, I love you, but I just don't know if the "next" Joe Jureviscious couldn't replace you at a bargain.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2006
  7. FreeTedWilliams

    FreeTedWilliams pfadmins PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    The guy has caught a touchdown pass in what 5 straight postseason games, that's a pretty good stat.

    He is dependable and clutch.
     
  8. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I think he's a good #2 at best that plays like a 1 in the clutch. If he was the #1 I think all that focus would shut his production down. But I'm not complaining at all.

    I'd love to see what Brady could do with a real true #1 receiver...I don't believe we've had that since Terry Glenn....when he was on he was good for a few victories. Branch and Givens are great but they are great in a spread out offense...not sure either one would be this productive if they were the featured receivers in a passing attack.

    If Belichick takes a WR in round 1 or 2...I don't think he will, but if he does and we keep Givens...I for one will not ask for another thing all season long...except for a CB and OG LOL.

    I'm hoping for at least Todd Watkins as the 2nd 4th round pick....give him a year and he's going to be very good. If BB takes Holmes, Jackson, or Smith I will go nuts along with Brady.
     
  9. Miguel

    Miguel Patriots Salary Cap Guru PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    If Givens was going to accept a pretty small deal from the Pats, why not do it in 2005 and get the signing bonus a year earlier?

    I am not saying that the Pats should resign him at any cost. I am saying that the Pats can not afford to give Givens 4 million a year contract with Branch waiting in the wings.
     
  10. Fanfrom1960

    Fanfrom1960 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Six: Givens has now caught a TD pass in six straight postseason games, which is the second longest streak in playoff history and trails only John Stallworth's string of eight consecutive games with a receiving score.

    http://www.news4jax.com/nfl090/5918491/detail.html
     
  11. dhamz

    dhamz In the Starting Line-Up

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    Actually it is 7. That report is from the Jax game. He scored the Pats TD against Denver the next week for 7.
     
  12. Fanfrom1960

    Fanfrom1960 In the Starting Line-Up

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    I stand corrected!
     
  13. shatch62

    shatch62 Practice Squad Player

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    A little Misleading

    While it is true Givens has scored a TD in 7 straight playoff games he has not exactly been “great†over those games. Not to down play the TDs as scoring is the point of the offense, in 8 playoff games he has never had more than 69 receiving yards and in 4 of the games he had 4 or less receptions for 26 or less yards. Below are his playoff stats.

    I like the guy and he has been a hell of a value for the Pats, I just don’t think they should break the bank for him.

    Year Opp Result | RSH YD TD | REC YD TD
    ---------------------+-----------------+-----------------
    2003 ten W,17-14 | 0 0 0 | 4 26 0
    2003 ind W,24-14 | 0 0 0 | 8 68 1
    *2003 car W,32-29 | 0 0 0 | 5 69 1
    2004 ind W,20-3 | 0 0 0 | 4 26 1
    2004 pit W,41-27 | 1 -2 0 | 5 59 1
    *2004 phi W,24-21 | 0 0 0 | 3 19 1
    2005 jax W,28-3 | 0 0 0 | 1 3 1
    2005 den L,13-27 | 0 0 0 | 5 54 1
    ---------------------+-----------------+-----------------
    TOTAL | 1 -2 0 | 35 324 7
     
  14. CrazyDave

    CrazyDave In the Starting Line-Up

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    Agreed. The td's in consecutive games does'nt say much imo.
     
  15. patpatriot

    patpatriot Banned

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    Givens by default

    Givens is a very solid # 2 reciever. Not in Reggie Wayne's class but still solid. The problem is that there is no one we can afford in FA that is better and I haven't seen any draftable WR that is as good. There are some guys you could take a flyer on (Demetrious Williams or for a real wager Brandon Marshall but can't miss 1 rounders? nyet?). So if we let Givens get away, we will have to replace him with someone like Koren Robinson (he's finally sober). That is a step backward at an already shaky position.

    If we can get DG for around 2 mill a year, I say we go for it.
     
  16. CT_Pats_Fan

    CT_Pats_Fan Practice Squad Player

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    I don't think its the Pats org will overvalue. They are going to offer him what they think he is worth on the field. Givens is the one to make a choice:

    Less money and play with a hall of fame qb in the prime of his career, win games, possibly championships.

    More money, likely play with some chooch of a qb and probably not win another championship.

    Playing with a chooch qb will certainly hurt his productivity. Nobody ever talks about this, but Brady doesn't lead his receivers into horrendous hits, like some others do.
     
  17. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There are probably at least 15 teams that would be willing to pay Givens $2M a year,

     
  18. FreeTedWilliams

    FreeTedWilliams pfadmins PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Chris Mortensen said the other day that the Colts will "Franchise" Wayne if they can not sign him. Mort is usally a pretty realible source.
     
  19. Digger44

    Digger44 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    Our offense isn't set up for a pure #1 receiver, so this is difficult to discern whether you are right about Branch and the success of a "true #1." If we picked up what is referred to as a "true #1" then he may become a Branch because of our offensive set. However if you reverse positions, I think Branch has just as much talent as a Santana Moss. The Pats had many more options at WR and the Skins did not.
     
  20. Digger44

    Digger44 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    I cannot believe that people on this board are calling for a franchise tag at 5.8 million. Ya we all love Givens, but give me a break.
     

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