Devin McCourty

[McClusky]

OK. Then we simply have a fundamental disagreement, both on your assessment of McCourty's impact, and on your relative greatness yet solid and unspectacular impact formulation. On the latter, I really only see this applying (to any appreciable extent) with skill position players, or where players are forced into positions and/or schemes that are mismatched to their skill set. I don't see either applying in McCourty's case:



http://nesn.com/2014/11/patriots-film-review-patrick-chung-devin-mccourty-being-used-perfectly/



http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1848925-devin-mccourty-developing-into-premier-nfl-safety

On impact:



http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/1/...atriots-defense-darelle-revis-brandon-browner

So, not only is McCourty elite relative to his peers, but he's a perfect fit for the Patriots defense, as BB and Brady have acknowledged. He's got elite ball skills, he's versatile, he's durable, he's a leader of the defense, and, I would argue (contra your argument above) that surrounding defenders benefit more from playing around him (I'm looking at you, Patrick Chung).



Maybe. But since I don't buy your McCourty arguments, I don't/wouldn't buy your Mayo arguments either.

A fair opinion to have no doubt. I shared a lot of the same opinions as you guys about 12 months ago. It was kind of eye opening to me to just see what McCourty's actual impact was from a game to game/play by play basis. To be honest from my junior evaluators chair at home, I was like "Is that it?". Maybe BB values different things than I do, maybe I'm right on the money, maybe we'll see.

Purchasing Rewind has allowed me to form a lot of my own opinions independent of what is typically written. I'm sure there is a lot I'm wrong about, but it makes watching NFL football for me seem a lot more like scouting for the draft. The McCourty topic is one that I'm fairly passionate about. Maybe I'm right, but who knows.

 

[JackBauer]

A fair opinion to have no doubt. I shared a lot of the same opinions as you guys about 12 months ago. It was kind of eye opening to me to just see what McCourty's actual impact was from a game to game/play by play basis. To be honest from my junior evaluators chair at home, I was like "Is that it?". Maybe BB values different things than I do, maybe I'm right on the money, maybe we'll see.

Purchasing Rewind has allowed me to form a lot of my own opinions independent of what is typically written. I'm sure there is a lot I'm wrong about, but it makes watching NFL football for me seem a lot more like scouting for the draft. The McCourty topic is one that I'm fairly passionate about. Maybe I'm right, but who knows.

No worries - I appreciate that you've put time and effort into forming your opinions. I'm sorry if I came off as dismissive as that wasn't my intent. I, like you, am pretty passionate on this topic.

 

[ausbacker]

A fair opinion to have no doubt. I shared a lot of the same opinions as you guys about 12 months ago. It was kind of eye opening to me to just see what McCourty's actual impact was from a game to game/play by play basis. To be honest from my junior evaluators chair at home, I was like "Is that it?". Maybe BB values different things than I do, maybe I'm right on the money, maybe we'll see.

Purchasing Rewind has allowed me to form a lot of my own opinions independent of what is typically written. I'm sure there is a lot I'm wrong about, but it makes watching NFL football for me seem a lot more like scouting for the draft. The McCourty topic is one that I'm fairly passionate about. Maybe I'm right, but who knows.

By purchasing Rewind you should know it's not about making plays but also preventing them. McCourty's range allows him to take away options from opposing Quarterbacks. Some angles he takes are questionable (yes, I too watch the All 22 film) but by and large, he patrols the Secondary and combines (especially with Revis) the other DBs well.

The problem when appraising McCourty is people are fond of a direct comparison with Earl Thomas. Thomas may be one of the best 10 players in the NFL. To hang his brilliance over McCourty is unfair to him. McCourty is significant better than most, if not all Free Safeties in the NFL not named Earl Thomas.

I was of the opinion then and I am of the opinion now that the Patriots made the right pick taking McCourty over Bryant.

 

[mgteich]

Typo alert: You meant something like "cap charges".

noted and fixed

 

[mgteich]

I think that we have a 2-part decision. Everyone agrees that we should try to sign McCourty to a long-term contract. We might argue details of such a contracts, presumably for 4-5 years. Such a contract would have a 2015 cap hit of $5M or perhaps $6M and solidify the safety position for many years.
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In a tight cap situation (one in which we sign Revis to a deal), the franchising of McCourty is another type of decision entirely.

Some would argue that we must franchise for $9.5M and make the necessary cuts to meet the cap requirements. This is basically a one-year, all-in approach. Under this scenario, we would look for a replacement corner in 2016 and hope for the best.

Others would argue that franchising McCourty is a one-year fix and doesn't add $9M off additional value to the team, given that this would be a one-year deal. This argument would rather use the $9M on other players, perhaps on those who might be here more than one year.
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I strongly support signing a long-term deal, even at a relatively high cost. However, if Revis is extended, I do not support the franchising of McCourty. I don't think he is worth $9.5M as a one-year fix.

 

[BelizePats]

You agree with the chap who calls McCourty both "great" and "solid, but unspectacular"?

Correct! I do. Make no mistake, I really like McCourty's play. But with resources at a premium, I don't see him at $9 million per, especially if it means we don't resign Revis long term. I'm starting to get the feeling that it will be one or the other, particularly if McCourty is looking for 8- 9 per year. And of the two if the team can only have one, I'd much prefer Revis. And after all the truly wretched safety play we have had to watch over the past 5-7 years, it hurts me to say this.

Resource allocation is a tough part of the game and I'm glad in BB who is making the call.

 

[supafly]

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I strongly signing a long-term deal, even at a relatively high cost. However, if Revis is extended, I do not support the franchising of McCourty. I don't think he is worth $9.5M as a one-year fix.

But what if they're able to come to an eventual agreement, much the same way that Mankins and Wilfork eventually agreed on longer term deals? Wouldn't it be worth it then?

 

[supafly]

I'm starting to get the feeling that it will be one or the other, particularly if McCourty is looking for 8- 9 per year.

I'm trying to remain optimistic, but I've often wondered how they can afford to keep both.

 

[mgteich]

But what if they're able to come to an eventual agreement, much the same way that Mankins and Wilfork eventually agreed on longer term deals? Wouldn't it be worth it then?

Yes, long-term deals with both would be great and also manageable.

2015 cap room would now work. In fact, we would need to be careful not to push to much money into 2016.

2016 would be solved by Wilfork not being there, and Amendola's large salary not being there. Long-term deals with Hightower and Jones would be needed.

 

[Bobsyouruncle]

I don't think Welker was ever a Captain, always found that odd. The guys that got big contracts always seem to be Captains. I think Bill values these guys more than just for on field reasons.

 

[ausbacker]

I'm trying to remain optimistic, but I've often wondered how they can afford to keep both.

If keeping Revis means losing McCourty then personally, I would keep Revis.

Hopefully the Patriots FO is creative enough to get both deals done.

 

[mgteich]

If keeping Revis means losing McCourty then personally, I would keep Revis.

Hopefully the Patriots FO is creative enough to get both deals done.

I don't think that the choice is about creativity with regard to structure. I'm just not sure that the team is ready to pay $22M or more a year for two defensive backs. And the two decisions do work together. If we didn't re-sign Revis for whatever reason, Belichick would be much more likely to pay McCourty 9 or 10 million a year AAV.

 

[supafly]

I don't think that the choice is about creativity with regard to structure. I'm just not sure that the team is ready to pay $22M or more a year for two defensive backs. And the two decisions do work together. If we didn't re-sign Revis for whatever reason, Belichick would be much more likely to pay McCourty 9 or 10 million a year AAV.

No doubt the 2 decisions do work together, as do all of the free agent decisions.

But, you referenced the franchise tag window as an important date to try and extend Darrelle Revis, and I was simply pointing out that they could realistically still get Revis' done since it would either free up money via cut or extension by March 9th. In other words, going down -16 million or -46 million isn't going to matter if they still are fine by the deadline.

If we're seriously waiting for long-term deals to be reached for BOTH Revis and McCourty in the next 14 days, we may be in for one long wait. Of course it's possible that they could still extend one or both once other offers are fielded in free agency.

 

[mgteich]

If we're seriously waiting for long-term deals to be reached for BOTH Revis and McCourty in the next 14 days, we may be in for one long wait.

I expect that both will be signed to long-term deals before march 10th or not at all. While possible, I think that the likelihood of a long-term deal being signed with either after March 10th is unlikely, although I could see McCourty being franchised and then signed to a long term deal (wasting the tag unless Gostkowski is also signed to a long-term deal). As I said, I can't see Belichick signing a long-term deal with Revis and then franchising McCourty.