Colts over cap by $6M

[SoonerPatriot]

Again it has been stated that Irsay .

That stadium will serve a whole lot more purpose than just to house the colts for 10 games a year. The NCAA tourney, various conventions, the NFL combine, and whatever else Indy wants. It's part of a bigger picture. The new stadium is downtown so it can be a centerpiece of attraction for various city junctures. And Irsay even put some of his own money in to having the stadium built.

I think he's a really smart business man. While he isn't out much when it comes time to settle on outside revenue, owners like Kraft will be screwed out of their money because they paid for their own stadium and now have to split money they would have used to pay off their loans for their stadiums. It's good business sense. As a taxpayer, I'm not thrilled by it, but if I was an owner I'd rather be in Irsays shoes than Krafts, financially speaking.

Actually, I'd rather be in Kraft's shoes no matter how you slice it.....

http://espn.go.com/sportsbusiness/s/forbes.html

Plus the three rings. It's a no brainer. It's better to be Bob Kraft than Irsay.

 

[Warhorse]

That's nice and all about how much each franchise is worth but it doesn't say anywhere in there how much each team owes for their franchises.

Kraft bought his team about ten years ago. How much does he owe on it? How long ago did he foot the bill for Gilette stadium? How much does he owe on it?

Whether you like the Colts or not, Irsay has done a fantastic job of turning a bottom feeder team into one of the most consistent winners in the NFL. Irsay got the team from his dad. He got a sweet deal for a new stadium that the Colts will play in - along with various conventions, NCAA tournaments, NFL combine and anything else that Indianapolis wants to put in there - and he didn't foot the whole bill because the stadium is a central perk for the city and its development (tourism). It was stated earlier that Irsay has brought the Colts into a winning financially stable environment. Same as Kraft. The only thing that is missing in the whole scenario is that the Colts haven't won a Superbowl. i think that will come in time.

My whole point though is that between the Colts and the Patriots (two of the worst teams when each owner took over), built their teams in totally different manners but each one built consistent winners that other teams have to somehow devise new plans for. If not for the Patriots we might have won a Superbowl by now but at the time we were at the top of our game, the Pats were just better than our best.

 

[SoonerPatriot]

That's nice and all about how much each franchise is worth but it doesn't say anywhere in there how much each team owes for their franchises.

Kraft bought his team about ten years ago. How much does he owe on it? How long ago did he foot the bill for Gilette stadium? How much does he owe on it?

Whether you like the Colts or not, Irsay has done a fantastic job of turning a bottom feeder team into one of the most consistent winners in the NFL. Irsay got the team from his dad. He got a sweet deal for a new stadium that the Colts will play in - along with various conventions, NCAA tournaments, NFL combine and anything else that Indianapolis wants to put in there - and he didn't foot the whole bill because the stadium is a central perk for the city and its development (tourism). It was stated earlier that Irsay has brought the Colts into a winning financially stable environment. Same as Kraft. The only thing that is missing in the whole scenario is that the Colts haven't won a Superbowl. i think that will come in time.

My whole point though is that between the Colts and the Patriots (two of the worst teams when each owner took over), built their teams in totally different manners but each one built consistent winners that other teams have to somehow devise new plans for. If not for the Patriots we might have won a Superbowl by now but at the time we were at the top of our game, the Pats were just better than our best.

I think Kraft paid 300 to 400 million for the Patriots when he bought them. You can look it up, the figures are out there somewhere. Now they're worth nearly three times that. So yeah, he's made his money back and then some. Forbes had him at 320 on their 400 richest americans list. His net worth was around 1.1 billion. And don't forget, he was quite wealthy before he bought the team.

That's not to take away from what Irsay has done. He took a small market team and made them more respectable. I still don't think he'll ever win a super bowl. My feeling is if they couldn't get it done last year, when the planets aligned, it's not going to happen but there's always next year (sarcasm)

 

[Warhorse]

I don't think any Patriot fan can say anything about a team winning the Superbowl. The year the Pats beat the Rams, if I remember correctly, the Pats weren't picked to be anything special. The Pats overcame desolate situations that year in losing their starting franchise QB and having to start a 6th round draft choice in his place. Then the next 2 superbowls that they won, they always had problems with injuries but BB found suitable replacements for each injury and led them to another championship.

I know some of you have an aversion to placing yourselves on a pedastle because your team has made quite the turnaround, but before the Pats become something special, they were a horrible team that ranked in the bottom quarter of the league on a consistent basis. What's to say another team can't make a similar turnaround. The Colts have the talent and an owner who is doing everything he can to put a winning team on the field on a consistent basis in one of the smallest markets in the NFL. Just like Kraft did when he bought the team.

 

[PATSNUTme]

What's to say another team can't make a similar turnaround. The Colts have the talent and an owner who is doing everything he can to put a winning team on the field on a consistent basis in one of the smallest markets in the NFL. Just like Kraft did when he bought the team.

Here's a reason that the Colts won't make it to the SB.

 

[Warhorse]

How nice that you have so much to offer to intelligent football talk.

 

[PATSNUTme]

How nice that you have so much to offer to intelligent football talk.

A picture is worth a thousand words.

 

[Warhorse]

Were you this arrogant ten years ago when your team sucked?

We haven't won the Superbowl because we got put out by the championship winning team the last 3 years.

 

[PATSNUTme]

Were you this arrogant ten years ago when your team sucked?

We haven't won the Superbowl because we got put out by the championship winning team the last 3 years.

Let's see ,10 years ago? No, don't think that I was. Ten years ago we were just coming off a SB loss and Pete Carroll was the new head coach.

I actually liked the Jim Harbaugh Colts. But, after listening to 3 years of whining from Peyton and Polian the Colts have risen to 2a on my most hated team list. Tied with the Raiders. Also, the media each year proclaiming the Colts as THE team and every year they just come up short. Some would call that choking.

 

[Warhorse]

Why shouldn't they be considered a favorite? They are a consistent winner each year. Whining set aside, I won't argue a dead issue. The Colts have gone to the playoffs for 6 of the last seven years. I think any team with that kind of record should be considered a favorite to win if they don't lose primary personnel. Some times you just get beat by the better team.

If you think the Patriots are the better team, then how can the Colts have choked the two years that you guys went on to win the Superbowl?

A choke is when a TEAM is supposed to win and doesn't. In the years that we lost to the Patriots, I thought the best team in football was the Patriots, not the Colts. We had too many liabilities while the Patriots had everythng rolling even with the rash of injuries.

 

[hwc]

A choke is when a TEAM is supposed to win and doesn't.

Yep. Now, the 2005 Colts... now that was a choke! To go from the undefeated season, greatest team of all time, home field advantage, to first round playoff loss at home.

 

[PATSNUTme]

If you think the Patriots are the better team, then how can the Colts have choked the two years that you guys went on to win the Superbowl?

A choke is when a TEAM is supposed to win and doesn't. In the years that we lost to the Patriots, I thought the best team in football was the Patriots, not the Colts. We had too many liabilities while the Patriots had everythng rolling even with the rash of injuries.

It wasn't what I thought, it's what the media hyped the Colts to be.

They were the media's favorite those 2 years and each time they go in and get undressed. Didn't you think that they were the better team before those games? First it was the "chuck" excuse. Then it was the "no home field" excuse. And, last year it was the 'potection problem' excuse.

They were the favorite the last 3 years and had home field last year and still lost. That is choking.

This is not smack to you. This is the way I actually feel about the Colts now.

 

[Warhorse]

So the way you feel they choked is by how the media spun them to be the end all team of the NFL. I don't base my thoughts on a team by how the media thinks. Fans on this board alone rip into several media guys in the New England area almost every day, correct? What they say flies right into the face of what most Patriots fans think.

As far as the "excuses". I agree with the chuck rule but more than one team brought that up... although only one team gets blamed for it though.

The homefield is a crap argument because our record on the road is almost the same as at home. And I don't really remember anyone saying anything about it anyway. I believe the statement was how hard it was to have to go to Gilette and play in January.

And the Protection problem was true. Protection sucked. But as Manning stated that started with him. He was calling everyone out on it including himself. Since there are so many Manning haters out there it was immediately construed as Manning throwing his offensive line under the bus. Once the media and degenerate fans got ahold of it, it turned into a manning bashing party. The protection problem was the Colts don't know how to deal with all the problems that arrive from the 3-4 defense. Look at the teams that have beat them, the Patriots, Steelers and Chargers. Now look at the teams that they had problems scoring against, the Browns and the Ravens.

We flat out have not figured out how to consistently score on the 3-4 defense.

 

[Steelgal]

How could you not listen to what the media was saying this year about the Colts? It was nauseating at times. I was thrilled with the Chargers beat them, so we could lay to rest the perfect season scenario. That's all we heard week in and week out. Then it went into how it was the perfect fit for the Colts to go to the Superbowl this year, having homefield advantage and a Superbowl inside a dome. No other team was given a chance, especially the Steelers when they played them. I only saw one analyst picked them, Joe Thiesman. Most said it would be a blowout and the Steelers had no chance. Guess they were proven wrong :rocker: .

So yes, while I knew the Steelers had every shot of winning, in my book with all of the hype and media attention the Colts got, they choked. They didn't even win a single playoff game, after going 13-0. Don't know how you can say it any other way.

 

[Warhorse]

That's my point. Everyone bases them "choking" on how the media spun them. Not once did I here a member of the Colts say they were a definate lock to win the Superbowl. With the parity in the league, it's impossible to say that. The Colts are the best offense since "the greatest show on turf" and the "air Coryell" system. That's all the media bases their Assumptions on.

How many picked the steelers to win this year?

How many picked the Patriots to win the year after winning their second Superbowl? So if they picked against them then doesn't that show that the media doesn't have a clue and that they just look for the "sexy" pick each year?

As far as the media hype with the undefeated season... I was sick of it also. But who blew it all out of proportion? The media and to a lesser degree, the fans.

Steelgal, who was the best team this year after all was said and done and the Superbowl was over? I my view it was the Steelers. They beat the #1, #2 & #3 seeds in the AFC and then beat the #1 seed of the NFC (all away games too I might add.)

Belichick even threw a game so he would have to play the Jags instead of the Steelers.

 

[Steelgal]

I don't think you'll ever win the big game, unless you can figure out how to better defend the 3-4 defense and Peyton gives up all his playcalling. The only time you really see the 3-4 defense is in the playoffs. Maybe a game or two in the regular season, but not well enough to learn how to defend against it. Then Peyton gets upto the line and thinks he knows what he sees, so he audibles, then right before the ball gets snapped the defense changes yet again. Unless all the 3-4 teams are out of the playoffs, I honestly don't see you reaching the Superbowl. Once Peyton gets rattled, it's hard for him to recover.

As for being a great offense, that may be, but imo, defense wins championships. Ben had a horrific QB rating of 22.6 in the SB. Could you have pulled out a win if that was Peyton's rating? I doubt it. I would rather have a strong defense and good offense, than the reverse. Ben made a few plays when he had to, but the defense and special teams saved us that day.

 

[Warhorse]

We saw the 3-4 defense 6 times including the playoffs in 2005. We had trouble with each team that ran it even though we did win 4 of those games. In 2004 we played 4 games against teams that ran the 3-4 and we lost 2 of those, both to the Patriots.

Peyton is a great QB at reading defenses unless it's the 3-4. With all the shifts that the 3-4 gives, it means instead of Manning being right in picking his plays about 90% of the time, he's only right about 50% of the time. And then if the pass protection breaks down (QB, O-line, tight ends, running backs, etc.) then he has even less time than normal to get the ball to where it needs to go.

If people continue to use "choke" the way it has been used on this board, then it means that their team shouldn't have won against the Colts and that their winning is not about them being the better team, but it's about the Colts shooting themselves in the foot and the other team getting out of there with all the breaks.

I don't see it as that. The two years the Patriots beat us they were the best team on the field and in football those years. This year when the Steelers beat us they were the best team in football. **** Lebeau did a hell of a job with the defensive playcalling.

It is a pathetic attempt at putting someone's team down by saying they "choked," but moreso it says that your team wouldn't have won if not for it.

 

[hwc]

I don't think you'll ever win the big game, unless you can figure out how to better defend the 3-4 defense and Peyton gives up all his playcalling.

Hah. It's getting easier all the time for the Colts. Now all they have to do is:

a) not play the Pats in the playoffs

b) change the rules so that defenses aren't allowed to play the Colts' receivers physical

c) play all their playoff games in a dome

d) get homefield advantage and play all of their playoff games in Indianapolis

e) don't play a 3-4 team in the playoffs.

 

[Warhorse]

hwc

Find me one place where it is written in the NFL rulebook that the Colts had the the rules changed about defenses playing physical.

It's this crap being drudged up over and over again by uninformed fans that makes them sound foolish.

 

[hwc]

hwc

Find me one place where it is written in the NFL rulebook that the Colts had the the rules changed about defenses playing physical.

My bad. I should have said:

b) Have Polian pitch a hissy fit in the Rules Committee about the Pats receivers roughing up his receivers and get a new "special emphasis" enacted.