Bethal Johnson, Marquies Hill and Dan Klecko

[Sean Pa Patriot]

Better be having the off seasons and summers of thier lives, or else they are gone... Bethal its time to put up or shut up, the klecko fad is over, and Marquies Hill , what has he done in 2 yrs?? Last yr it was Rohan Davey, this yr Bethal Johnson, better start perfoming.. He would be a great number 4 or 5 reciever, but Bam Childress could push him hard...

 

[RayClay]

Better be having the off seasons and summers of thier lives, or else they are gone... Bethal its time to put up or shut up, the klecko fad is over, and Marquies Hill , what has he done in 2 yrs?? Last yr it was Rohan Davey, this yr Bethal Johnson, better start perfoming.. He would be a great number 4 or 5 reciever, but Bam Childress could push him hard...

Bethel's going to stick based on special teams.

No indication they have faith in him as receiver, but he was one of the top KR when healthy and played on defensive kicking teams also.

Surprised he stuck last year since he wasn't at full speed. Maybe he'll challenge as PR too.

If he excels on special teams, that buys him time to improve his prospects as a receiver.

 

[maverick4]

re

Bethel and Hill will stay. Bethel has shown flashes of potential on some great plays, and this year he will get his chance for more time. Hill will also stick, even though he is playing behind 4 quality players.

Klecko is dead weight. He has no value in any defensive or offensive package or play.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Bethel and Hill will stay. Bethel has shown flashes of potential on some great plays, and this year he will get his chance for more time. Hill will also stick, even though he is playing behind 4 quality players.

Klecko is dead weight. He has no value in any defensive or offensive package or play.

Wonder what Hill's measurables are in terms of speed... here's one we didn't think of (and probably for good reason...) The Pats love to send undersized DE back into the linebacking corps... wonder if they'd throw big ol' Hill back there so he could double as a backup LB. Probably too slow. Almost certainly too slow... forget I mentioned it (unless it happens.) I agree he stays though, even as a D Line backup - they thought in 04 if there was a Seymour problem, he'd be Seymour Junior with a little work. With healthier bodies in the secondary, I could see him getting rotation this year, based on the fact that they no longer need whatever unit is healthy to be dead-on perfect to compensate for those that are not.

Klecko? Only if someone comes up with a package of plays that virtually revolves around his non-stop motor and heart. Uh, wait, can you do that, without natural talent? You have to think Klecko's just been out of his league all along. Maybe Canada.

In terms of KR duties making Bethel a keeper - ehhhh mebbe. You may have noticed that Kool-Aid is being thought of as a return guy, at least for now. I don't think Bethel stays if he can't run a freaking route. He's like Zoolander out there, unable to turn left (or right either, in his case.) Maybe one day the Pats will casually let slip information on a horrific injury that it took him a couple years' work to battle back from, which impeded his ability to cut. Maybe in my dreams. Seriously, I would love to see Bethel show up running tighter routes, realizing it's a priviledge, not a burden, to play under Belichick. Not sure that will happen. Once you're in a doghouse, things can deteriorate. I would not be surprised to see him gone in a year.

Just my two cents,

PFnV

 

[Remix 6]

hill is 6"6 297 and ran a 4.87 few years ago and i have a question..why doesnt Johnson just practice with Brady when he has the chance..he should be taking some time if Brady is avaible to learn from him and WRs like Branch and Brown

 

[pats1]

Why would Hill be dumped? In favor of whom? Santonio Thomas?

He's great depth. When he was drafted, Seymour hadn't been extended, Warren had only started a handful of games, and Wilfork had just been drafted hours earlier. Yes, now we can see that starting line is phenomenal, so let's lay off Hill. What's he supposed to do? Beat Seymour out of his starting job? He's great depth. He has a roster spot with next-to-nothing for competition (Santonio Thomas or Klecko, at best.)

Bethel will make the team regardless, because of the lack of depth at WR. He had nagging injuries last year and missed most of training camp, and we all can recall what he did before then in the return game (2003 - Colts game, 2004 - Browns game). With Andre Davis and Tim Dwight gone, he can start to step back into an increased role.

Klecko will be hardpressed to make the team. He'll have to show he can stay on the field (2004 injury) or perform well at whatever he plays. He may be that 53rd player who can backup the FB position as well as the DL position.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Klecko will be hardpressed to make the team. He'll have to show he can stay on the field (2004 injury) or perform well at whatever he plays. He may be that 53rd player who can backup the FB position as well as the DL position.

Oh heck no, they don't dump Hill, agreed. I see him as needing time on field. Jarvis Green is a starter on a weaker team, same deal. I personally think the ability of those 3 guys up front to take the responsibility for eating up a five-man O-line's attention, and still applying some pressure to the QB, is under-appreciated. Maybe we'll see more 4-3 sets this year (see other thread,) but probably not by an appreciable margin. I do think Hill gets some rotation this year.

But think about how confidence in both Hill and Green affects Klecko. Oh yeah, I forgot - we're stacked at D-line. Can't hurt to be more stacked, but they cut you off after 53 guys. I also do not believe Bethel makes it in 07based on returns alone, unless he turns into the Patriots' Dante Hall. This year, yeah, he's a warm body who plays receiver. And a fast one at that. But once Gator Aid has some playing time under his belt, if Caldwell produces at all, and if Bam is already pushing him... do we really want Bethel sulking around acting like he's doing us a favor by attempting to run routes everybody picks up in a year's time?

Show me something, Bethel. It's getting old.

PFnV

 

[pats1]

Oh heck no, they don't dump Hill, agreed. I see him as needing time on field. Jarvis Green is a starter on a weaker team, same deal. I personally think the ability of those 3 guys up front to take the responsibility for eating up a five-man O-line's attention, and still applying some pressure to the QB, is under-appreciated. Maybe we'll see more 4-3 sets this year (see other thread,) but probably not by an appreciable margin. I do think Hill gets some rotation this year.

But think about how confidence in both Hill and Green affects Klecko. Oh yeah, I forgot - we're stacked at D-line. Can't hurt to be more stacked, but they cut you off after 53 guys. I also do not believe Bethel makes it in 07based on returns alone, unless he turns into the Patriots' Dante Hall. This year, yeah, he's a warm body who plays receiver. And a fast one at that. But once Gator Aid has some playing time under his belt, if Caldwell produces at all, and if Bam is already pushing him... do we really want Bethel sulking around acting like he's doing us a favor by attempting to run routes everybody picks up in a year's time?

Show me something, Bethel. It's getting old.

PFnV

Again - he was injured, and stuck behind Brown, Branch, and Givens in 2003, Branch, Givens, Brown, and Patten in 2004, and then Branch, Givens, Brown, Dwight, and Davis in 2005. Now, he'll have the #5 spot to himself and Bam will probably get the much existent #6 spot on the Pats' offense.

 

[oldrover]

Just rewatched the SB38 DVD... interesting to see Bethel in the Indy game. He can win a foot race. However, he is not terribly elusive, and somewhat easy to tackle. I agree he'll be on ST. Beyond that depends really on his route running and his ability to stay healthy... neither of which I am terribly confident in.

Lovle Klecko, but he's too small for the D-line and too slow at LB. He showed glimpses out of the backfield two years ago, but there are too many others in front of him there. He's most likely to be cut.

Hill will definitely stay... I think he'll improve measurably this year; just a hunch.

 

[pats1]

Hill will definitely stay... I think he'll improve measurably this year; just a hunch.

By "improve" do you mean get on the field more? I think the Pats' are pretty fixed on having Seymour out there every possible down. Green will come in periodically for either Warren or Seymour, as well as a 3rd down rusher in a 2-man line with Seymour.

Hill is the same style player Green is. It's harder to notice, but Hill was in on every goal line set during the season.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Pats1, this is just another time I want you to be right. I'll be heartened by hearing that he's staying late running the tree by himself repeatedly or something, or working one on one with Brady, begging for time with him.

Do either of these seem like likely occurences? Does it seem by his route running that Bethel's ever done either of these things or anything like them?

See, that's my issue. Maybe you are right, maybe everybody says things like that often enough, and it's a self-fulfilling prophecy... but Bethel seems really wanting in the route-running to me. Maybe he belongs just beneath the starter level... I just don't think so.

But one more maybe - maybe he's been parked behind these guys so long, and injured all that time affecting his cutting etc., and now is his year to shine.

Oh yeah, I do want you to be right.

We'll talk in, say, 10 months

PFnV

 

[Digger44]

By "improve" do you mean get on the field more? I think the Pats' are pretty fixed on having Seymour out there every possible down. Green will come in periodically for either Warren or Seymour, as well as a 3rd down rusher in a 2-man line with Seymour.

Hill is the same style player Green is. It's harder to notice, but Hill was in on every goal line set during the season.

We talked about Hill a few weeks ago on the board. I think the majority understands that he was very young when drafted and was expected to be a great project. The DE position is so solid here in NE that he can't get the playing time. He should show good signs this season when he gets the chance to play. He makes for excellent depth & is going nowhere for this year.

 

[Julius]

Hill is too sluggish to play linebacker. He is a 3-4 DE or possibly a nose.

 

[DaBruinz]

Hill is too sluggish to play linebacker. He is a 3-4 DE or possibly a nose.

During the 2004 draft, I thought that Hill could have the size to be a NT if he put on 20 lbs. At 6'6, he is the only marginally taller than Ted Washington. At 320 lbs, I think he could be a very capable back-up to Wilfork.

 

[Mike the Brit]

Pats1, this is just another time I want you to be right. I'll be heartened by hearing that he's staying late running the tree by himself repeatedly or something, or working one on one with Brady, begging for time with him.

Do either of these seem like likely occurences? Does it seem by his route running that Bethel's ever done either of these things or anything like them?

See, that's my issue. Maybe you are right, maybe everybody says things like that often enough, and it's a self-fulfilling prophecy... but Bethel seems really wanting in the route-running to me. Maybe he belongs just beneath the starter level... I just don't think so.

But one more maybe - maybe he's been parked behind these guys so long, and injured all that time affecting his cutting etc., and now is his year to shine.

Oh yeah, I do want you to be right.

We'll talk in, say, 10 months

PFnV

That's a great post -- I feel just the same way.

But there's one further fact: Mike Reiss (who is as reliable a source as we have for Pats info) says that Bethel was being shopped around. That wouldn't have been the case if there were some mystery injury reducing his performance, would it?

 

[spacecrime]

Better be having the off seasons and summers of thier lives, or else they are gone... Bethal its time to put up or shut up, the klecko fad is over, and Marquies Hill , what has he done in 2 yrs?? Last yr it was Rohan Davey, this yr Bethal Johnson, better start perfoming.. He would be a great number 4 or 5 reciever, but Bam Childress could push him hard...

Usually rookies take a year. Hill was a project, meaning he would take longer than a usual rookie. So there is nothing wrong with him taking two years.

We may want them to have the year of their lives, but BB only wants them to improve. He as said this often. THey need to be making progress.As long as they are making progress you don'tknow how good they can be. When they stop making progress is when a decision has to be made.

We give players one year of two years, but I don't think the coaches do. I think the coachesdo. I cannot imagine a Patriots coach having an arbitrary date or time by which players must be ready. It makes not sense.

My two cents

 

[dhamz]

I think Hill is safe for another year. This year he will need to contribute or he won't be here in 2007.

Klecko would need an injury barage to make the team. He has almost no shot as of right now.

Bethel is a question. He has shown nothing the last 2 years as a WR. He has shown little as a kick returner. He was 25th in the NFL in 2005. He wasn't even the best Patriot - Hobbs was better.

He is firmly on the bubble. If he has a good camp he can make the team. If he doesn't, he won't.

 

[PatsSteve1]

Hill is the same style player Green is. It's harder to notice, but Hill was in on every goal line set during the season.[/QUOTE]

* How'd he do that if he was only active for 2 games last year?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=6822

 

[pats1]

Hill is the same style player Green is. It's harder to notice, but Hill was in on every goal line set during the season.

How'd he do that if he was only active for 2 games last year?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=6822

He was actually active for 9:

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/492960/gamelogs/2005

He was in every goal line set I saw in those games. I should have been more specific.

 

[pats1]

I think Hill is safe for another year. This year he will need to contribute or he won't be here in 2007.

In what capacity do you expect him to contribute? There simply are BETTER PLAYERS AHEAD OF HIM!