Welcome to PatsFans.com

BB thoughts on franchising Adam, free agency, draft

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by PatsRI, Feb 23, 2006.

  1. PatsRI

    PatsRI PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2004
    Messages:
    1,618
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    http://www.patriots.com/news/index.cfm?ac=latestnewsdetail&pid=15553&pcid=41

    “We didn’t feel like it was the right thing to do,†Belichick said .....“If we don’t have a deal done with him then he will be a free agent. We’ve had players in free agency before and we’ll have them again. So has everybody else. That’s part of the system.


    "I don’t think you can do much of anything,†he said with the new league year just a week away. “I mean I don’t know what we are working with. So until that’s defined it seems like an exercise in futility. And in a way, we’ve tried to put more of our time and energy into football and the draft and kind of known quantities rather than trying to work on contracts in a system that you don’t know what the system is.â€

    -----

    For Bill this seems down right chatty.:)
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2006
  2. fisticuffs

    fisticuffs Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2004
    Messages:
    29
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    As much as I want Adam to resign, I respect not applying the franchise tag on him. He honored his contract, it's only far to allow him to explore his last chance of free agency. Same goes with other free agents, it's messed up when players honor their contract and tell their teams they want to explore free agency, only to get slapped with the 'tag and be trapped with your former team.
  3. Bill's Girl

    Bill's Girl Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2005
    Messages:
    1,207
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    Classy move by Coach Bill, but I have to tell you it will KILL me to see Adam in a Cowboy uniform.... I get the dry heaves just picturing that in my head!

    Does not using the tag put the Patriots at a disadvantage?
  4. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    31,421
    Likes Received:
    148
    Ratings:
    +304 / 9 / -9

    #24 Jersey

    I don't think Belichick did this for Adam. He's used the tag on him twice before, he would do it again. He obviously thinks it's in the best interest of the team, whether that's getting a less costly kicker or because they are close to an agreement with Adam.
  5. hwc

    hwc Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    1,592
    Likes Received:
    81
    Ratings:
    +129 / 2 / -1

    Fisticuffs:

    Cry me a river. I hardly think that Vinatieri was trapped by the franchise tag. Playing for the two time defending SuperBowl champion at a guaranteed $2.5 million -- the highest for his position in the NFL? Yeah, he's really been mistreated by the New England Patriots.
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2006
  6. Patriot Missile

    Patriot Missile Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2005
    Messages:
    5,409
    Likes Received:
    33
    Ratings:
    +64 / 4 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    If he goes so be it. Regardless of where he goes we will all look back when we are old men and women and be thankful this guy wore a Pat's uniform. We all know he's going into the hall as a Pat and I'm sure Adam will have nothing but good memories of his time here in NE. Not to many kickers can claim to be a human highlight reel,but he sure can.
  7. fgssand

    fgssand PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2004
    Messages:
    4,774
    Likes Received:
    23
    Ratings:
    +28 / 0 / -1

    #17 Jersey

    8 days to UFA for AV

    Is Adam maximizing his worth by refusing to sign or negotiate in good faith with the patriots because he knows (or thinks) he can command a better deal elsewhere as in Dallas?

    Is the value and contract offered AV reasonable and fair or are they looking for him to take the home town discount to play here?

    Who is the villan here and who is playing hardball here. Or, is an agreement iminent and we will have a win win deal in place within a week?
  8. rookBoston

    rookBoston Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    1,466
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    Looks like Adam is going elsewhere. From BB, this sounds like "fare thee well". He wouldn't be this profuse with his comments if negotiations still showed promise.

    The only likely upside is that we'll probably get a 3rd round Compensatory Pick for AV in 2007.
  9. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2005
    Messages:
    23,100
    Likes Received:
    379
    Ratings:
    +850 / 8 / -10

    Disable Jersey

    Adam's gotta leave for financial reasons. He's only made maybe $10-14 million with the Pats. If he stayed, he'd only get say a 5 year contract worth another $10M, plus endorsements. How can you support your family on that?
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2006
  10. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    9,858
    Likes Received:
    27
    Ratings:
    +50 / 2 / -0

    Its a trade off for both the team and Vinatieri - more so for Vinatieri.

    Adam was, is, will be, and should be among the highest paid kickers, if not THE highest paid kicker. So franchising him locked him in at his market value - BUT FOR ONE YEAR ONLY.

    What Adam craves is the long term guraranteed contract the team gave him for his last contract - not JUST one year.

    It seems like there's disagreement over the number of years and the amount to guarantee.

    Personally I would have had no problem paying him $3 million for this season, and I hope they re-sign him.

    (But unlike others, I really hope he doesn't resign)
  11. dryheat44

    dryheat44 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Messages:
    6,369
    Likes Received:
    33
    Ratings:
    +78 / 2 / -0

    #75 Jersey

    Yeah, I don't get it. I don't live in New England anymore, but didn't he have ads for New England Ford and Dunkin' Donuts? Maybe some others that I didn't see? I'd love to find out how much he made from those, because he's not going to get them in Dallas.
  12. Fanfrom1960

    Fanfrom1960 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2005
    Messages:
    3,179
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    I read that three times and still don't see how that isn't a contradiction. Oh, maybe re-sign means sign with the Patriots again, and resign means, like, quit? :wha:
  13. spacecrime

    spacecrime Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    8,329
    Likes Received:
    17
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    Why is it always villain and hardball with us? If a player or team has a positon beyond which they will not go, why is it hardball, and not a sense of self-worth or policy or just plain negotiating. Remember all the rhetoric surrounding Brady's contract?

    Why is it always the Pats trying to screw a player? Why aren't they allowed to set values based on thier corporate model?

    We fans are soooo weird about favorite players. When it looks like they may leave (in recent history Milloy, Law, Washington, AV), they suddenly become greater than thr greatest. The become the heart and soul of the team. The team cannot win without them. Losing seasons were predicted when Milloy and Washington left, and we won the SB both years. It was widely acknoweledged that we could not win it all if Law did not return to the lineup when he was hurt, and yet we did (and by then people had already forgotten that we were supposed to to 6-10 that year with Ted W gone to the Raiders).

    Now it's AV. We won be becasue he kicked. Without him we cannot win. The dynasty is over. He cannot be replaced.

    The fact is that he can be replaced. The Patriots will not go for years with losing seasons because we changed kickers. We will find a new kicker.

    If he does poorly, it will prove that AV was needed, and the "I told you so's" will fill the board. If he does well and kicks a couple game winners, AV will be disparaged as being "not so great - who needed him?"

    The fact is that A is AV no matter if he is replaced by a dud or a superstar. If a poor player is picked as a replacement, it does not mean AV is better somehow or that the decision was wrong. Ditto if the new guy is the next Stenenrud or Anderson.

    Adam put in some great years here, and his pleasant personality and work ethic added to his legend. Good for him. But that has nothing to do with whether he should be in a Pats uniform next year. That is based on his expected contribution and the price he feels he is worth.

    Personally, I don't see all this adulation for Vinatieri. It isn't like he every gave something back to the team. He ALWAYS put himself and his paycheck first.

    I was glad they brought Troy Brown. He took pay cuts and played out of position (hurting his stats and WRs get paid by stats), and it was nice to see him get taken care of. I was sorry to see Ted Johnson retire. He took a lot of paycuts to stay here. WMG, also.

    AV is more like Henry Thomas, or Chad Eaton, or Brandon Mitchell, or Woody, or Ted Washington, or any of a number of players who who refused to take
    pay cut for the team. I do not have a problem with that. it is a personal decision with them what they do. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it.

    But see it for what it is: a decision by a player to prefer money to a career with a given team. No one requures them to take less, and no one should. But please acknowledge that not doing so does NOT move you up in the annals of the team history.

    Lawyer Milloy will always have a palce in my heart. But it isn'[t the same place that he would have had had he remeined a part of the Patriot organization.

    I feel high regard for those who were cut for business reasons. Much higher that for those who left for money.

    AV has done well for the Patriots. He may or may not do well again for us. But he isn't the heart and soul of hte team and he isn't necessary for us to go back to the superbowl.

    It will be interesting to see how he fares compared to the horrible careers posted by those spurned by BB over the years.
  14. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    9,858
    Likes Received:
    27
    Ratings:
    +50 / 2 / -0



    Yes - resign means retire. Re-sign means to... well, re-sign.

    Surprisingly many Patriots fans apparently want Adam to resign. ;)
  15. Fanfrom1960

    Fanfrom1960 Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2005
    Messages:
    3,179
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    OK, gotcha, Adam must either be a Patriot for the rest of his career, or please show up at halftime of a future game for some remembrances. I don't think so, I'm with you, a lot of money would be left on the table for the guy.
  16. borg

    borg Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2004
    Messages:
    3,829
    Likes Received:
    51
    Ratings:
    +104 / 3 / -11

    Good kickers have long careers and it is unrealistic to think that AV will be a Pat for life. And frankly, AV does not deserve to be the highest paid kicker in the NFL. Contracts are determined by forward expectations. AV was an 80% kicker in 2005. If you factor in the long field goal attempts that BB NEVER let AV attempt, the Pats may feel that his skills are not worthy of such a high salary. No question the guy has been clutch, but he has his limitations.
  17. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2005
    Messages:
    23,100
    Likes Received:
    379
    Ratings:
    +850 / 8 / -10

    Disable Jersey

    All kidding aside, I doubt it's anything like a megabuck per year. But certainly enough to alone support a very comfortable life style.

    Maybe I'm a closet socialist, but once you have basic financial security for the family, I have little desire for any more money. I'd unquestionably go for quality of life over a few million more dollars any day.
  18. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2005
    Messages:
    20,451
    Likes Received:
    117
    Ratings:
    +213 / 4 / -5

    True.

    That's part of what makes the Pats' silence so frustrating: we simply don't know what--if anything--is holding up the deal. It could be that the Pats aren't offering enough $$, or perhaps they simply don't want to sign a long enough contract. Or maybe AV's wife doesn't want him playing in New England. Or, perhaps, they've already worked out the basic terms of a deal, but the CBA issue is holding it up somehow.

    And, BTW, a compensatory pick--even if it is a third-rounder--won't be much of a consolation to a lot of folks on this board (myself included) for losing Vinatieri.
  19. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    31,421
    Likes Received:
    148
    Ratings:
    +304 / 9 / -9

    #24 Jersey

    I doubt Adam will sign a big enough contract for a major comp pick but I would be happy with cap savings and a #4 comp pick for him - however I expect us to be bigger players than most do in FA this year which would cancel out the likely losses of Adam, Neal and Givens.
  20. Pats67

    Pats67 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2005
    Messages:
    638
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Personally, I find their silence golden. Its an organizational philosophy that I think has worked well for them over the years. We want a bunch of negotiating in the papers just to keep us entertained while we wait for the games to return? I think any of us with any common sense understands the dynamics at work here, and in a week or so, we'll know whether Adam has decided that he wants his shot at FA and the big bonus payout. We don't need agents and lower level front office leakers to ratchet crap up in the same manner that's done elsewhere. I say thank God they handle these things in this way. Its one of the things I admire most about them.

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>