A Partial History of Tony Dungy "Running It Up"

[indycolts685]

Then why are you still responding ?

because I can and because I feel like it, it was about us running it up and not NE so I responded..whats it to you?

 

[indycolts685]

Sorry to correct you but ALL CAPS is shouting, larger font size is also shouting. Using bold or red ink can be for emphasis (where a less agressive color would be appreciated), but combining both is going the extra yard, ie yelling. If you want to distinguish your comments from the original poster either preface them with chevrons <<< or >>>, use italics or use the quote button. I have been using e-mail for close to 30 years, so please be so kind as not to lecture me!

anybody with half a brain can tell what I was doing, why don't you try and respond to the actual football talk that we were trying to have instead of being the Message board police. anybody and everybody knows that when you use all caps its yelling changing font color to make my text stand out from his by changing color is also a common practice, sorry this is not email its a message board things run a little different, I don't care if you have been using email for 30 years..So you were using the internet back in 1977?

 

[tombonneau]

By any chance, does anyone watch Keith Olberman? This left-wing freak is now somehow mixing Belichick/Pats with politics(one of his guests threw in Belicheck when talking about Bush's ongoing lies and manipulation).

Anyhow-like I said before, I went through it with Dallas in the 90's-we were one of the biggest dynasties, but somehow, the rest of the world did their best to spit in our faces(making life miserable). 10 years later-the national sports media(and even our most hated enemies then) are giving us our due, and all that happened in the 90's at us has been forgotten.

Just keep your heads up-this will go away a few years from now.

Exactly. The ephemeral media is written on the wind. Makes for great conversation as it's blowing past you, but after that it's gone and forgotten.

10 years from now no one will be reading today's web columns or watching yesterday's NFL Live . They will however still be taking trips to the Hall of Fame and leafing through record books.

 

[PatsFaninAZ]

The object of football is to score points and to keep your opponent from doing the same.

Those of you who feel that anyone is "running up the score" should perhaps root for something else.

The freaking object of football is to run up the score.

I always thought football was a sport of men. It seems like some of the fans are decidedly little girls.

 

[njpatsfan]

Anyone who says this doesn't actually watch his show. He's one of the few media-types who is telling the truth and actually EXHAUSTIVELY researches his programs. Forgive me for choosing him over folks who backed the wrong horse. TWICE.

So Olbermann likening Belichick and the Patriots to the "lies and manipulation of the Bush administration" is your idea of "exhaustively researched" and "telling the truth" ? Why isn't the "few media-types who tell the truth" quoting the facts in this thread ? Can you answer that ?

I find it especially interesting that two of the largest detractors of the Pats (Easterbrook and now Olbermann) are also two of the biggest leftwingnuts in the political world. I'm sure there's an abnormal psychology thesis in there somewhere. You can also see that it's giving people like patsox burning ulcers . It reminds me of the Star Trek episode where Kirk smokes the leader robot's brain with illogic by telling him: "I am lying". You can almost hear the brainpans fry .... "If hes telling the truth about Bush then he's telling the truth about Belichick .... no ... but if he's telling a lie about Belichick, then he must be lying about .... illogical .... illogical ..... ZZZZZZZZZ".

In fact, patsox, you have been posting kneepad stuff like this on Olbermann on this board so long that I think a new approach is in order. I know ! You can make a home made video about the injustices done to Keith Olbermann. You can call it "Leave Keith Olbermann alone !".

If you post it on youtube, people will HAVE to start taking you seriously.


Really.

R

 

[AdamJT13]

2000 Week 2 (with Tampa Bay): Up 34-0 vs. Chicago in the 4th Quarter, Pro Bowl starting RB Mike Alstott is still in the game and scores Tampa's final TD to make the score 41-0.

There were 11 minutes left in the game, the backup quarterback was in the game, Alstott got the ball on third-and-1 at the 20, the Bears missed a tackle at the line of scrimmage and Alstott went 20 yards for the touchdown. What are you supposed to do if you're trying to run out the clock and the opponent doesn't tackle you? Also, Alstott didn't start that game.

2000 Week 9 (with Tampa Bay): Up 34-13 with 5 minutes to go vs. Minnesota, Dungy has starting QB Shaun King throw a 16 yard TD pass to starting WR Reidel Anthony to make the score 41-13.

Nobody would complain if the Patriots were 3-4 and threw a TD pass when leading by 21 with more than 5 minutes remaining against a division team that was undefeated going into the game.

2001 Week 10 (with Tampa Bay): Up 33-14 with less than 10 minutes to go, has starting QB Brad Johnson throw a TD to make the score 40-14. Later, Ronde Barber intercepts a pass and returns it for a TD right at the two minute warning. That makes the score 46-21 BEFORE THE CONVERSION. At the two minute warning, Dungy GOES FOR TWO and gets it to make the final 48-21.

Scoring when you're up by only 19 with more than 9 minutes left against the team you're tied with in the playoff race (in Week 15, not Week 10) is not running up the score. And Martin Gramatica got hurt during the game and couldn't kick. John Lynch squibbed the kickoffs after both of those scores, but they didn't have anyone else who could kick extra points.

2004 Week 13 (with Indy): Versus Tennessee in the 4th Quarter, Dungy has Peyton Manning throw a TD pass to Reggie Wayne to make the score 48-24. Later in the 4th Quarter, he kicks a field goal to make the score 51-24.

They were up by only 17 points with more than 13 minutes remaining when Manning threw the TD pass. That's not running up the score. And Jim Sorgi was in the game when they kicked the field goal with more than seven minutes to play.

2004 Playoffs (with Indy): Up 42-24 versus Denver at two minutes left, Dungy has his team punch in another TD to make the score 49-24.

Scoring when you're ahead by 18 with more than two minutes left in the playoffs isn't running up the score.

2005 Week 5 (with Indy): Up 21-3 with less than 6 minutes left vs. San Francisco (who ended up with less than 200 yard offense for the day), Dungy has Manning throw a TD pass from 18 yards out to make the score 28-3.

Scoring when you're ahead by 18 with six minutes left isn't running up the score.

2004 Week 9 (with Indy): Versus the Patriots and up 40-21 with under 6 minutes to play, Dungy goes for 2 after the final Indy TD. They don't get it.

It was 2005, and trying to get a 21-point lead with six minutes left against the defending Super Bowl champs isn't running up the score.

2006 Week 2 (with Indy): Up 36-17 with 2:38 left in the game, Dungy has the Colts punch in another TD to make the score 43-17

They were up by 20, and the Texans had scored on their previous two possessions. Ran Carthon scored the TD.

Are you noticing anything here? Almost every case involves less than a three-touchdown lead with time enough for the opponent to rally, or else it was still very early in the fourth quarter.

2007 Week 1 (with Indy): Up 27-10 with 10 minutes left, has Manning throw a 45 yard TD versus New Orleans to Reggie Wayne to make the score 34-10.

Again -- a lead of only 17 points with more than 10 minutes to play against an NFC favorite.

2007 Week 7 (with Indy): Up 22-7 with under 4 minutes to play, Manning throws a 35 yard TD pass to Dallas Clark to make the score 29-7.

Again -- up by 15 with more than four minutes left.

I don't have a problem with most of this (though going for 2 up 46-21 at the 2 minute warning seemed a bit excessive)

It's not excessive when you don't have a kicker.

but the point is the media has crucified Belichick and the Patriots while acting as if other teams/coaches haven't done similar things.

Did anyone in the media claim anything about the Pats "running up the score" in any of their first five games this season? I certainly don't remember it, if it happened. Nobody said anything until Eckel scored on fourth down with less than 20 seconds to play against Dallas. The next week, the Patriots pulled Brady in the fourth quarter, then put him back in to throw another TD pass against the winless Dolphins after Miami had pulled within 21 after trailing 42-7. And last week, of course, the Patriots went for it on fourth down while leading 38-0 in the fourth quarter, had their starting QB throw a TD pass while leading 38-0, went for it again on fourth down while leading 45-0 with seven minutes to play, and called pass plays on four of their last five plays on the TD drive that made it 52-0.

Even if you don't think the Patriots have been running up the score, you at least have to see the difference between what Dungy's teams did and what the Patriots have been doing.

 

[Buchanty]

anybody with half a brain can tell what I was doing, why don't you try and respond to the actual football talk that we were trying to have instead of being the Message board police. anybody and everybody knows that when you use all caps its yelling changing font color to make my text stand out from his by changing color is also a common practice, sorry this is not email its a message board things run a little different, I don't care if you have been using email for 30 years..So you were using the internet back in 1977?

The yelling comment was based on the size of font more than the color, and your comments were confrontational, in other words Dungy never ran up the score. By inference you were saying that BB and the Pats did. Your large red sentences emphasized your disagreement with the original poster. I did address football content in my original reply (its only context, common practice etc), but you have chosen to select from that only that I criticized your use of color and nothing else. Please stop arguing the toss, I apologize if I have been patronizing or dictatorial, I have no aspirations to police the board, I am only looking for simple courtesies. A simple 'sorry it wasnt my intention...." would have sufficed.

By the way I worked for DEC on Networks and Communications back in 1978 and yes we were using phone and mail-like messaging between PDPs and VAXes back then. They weren't commercially available but you could communicate with others on the arpanet. You chose to tackle a veteran of the medium

 

[PF1996]

There were 11 minutes left in the game, the backup quarterback was in the game, Alstott got the ball on third-and-1 at the 20, the Bears missed a tackle at the line of scrimmage and Alstott went 20 yards for the touchdown. What are you supposed to do if you're trying to run out the clock and the opponent doesn't tackle you? Also, Alstott didn't start that game.




Nobody would complain if the Patriots were 3-4 and threw a TD pass when leading by 21 with more than 5 minutes remaining against a division team that was undefeated going into the game.




Scoring when you're up by only 19 with more than 9 minutes left against the team you're tied with in the playoff race (in Week 15, not Week 10) is not running up the score. And Martin Gramatica got hurt during the game and couldn't kick. John Lynch squibbed the kickoffs after both of those scores, but they didn't have anyone else who could kick extra points.



They were up by only 17 points with more than 13 minutes remaining when Manning threw the TD pass. That's not running up the score. And Jim Sorgi was in the game when they kicked the field goal with more than seven minutes to play.



Scoring when you're ahead by 18 with more than two minutes left in the playoffs isn't running up the score.



Scoring when you're ahead by 18 with six minutes left isn't running up the score.



It was 2005, and trying to get a 21-point lead with six minutes left against the defending Super Bowl champs isn't running up the score.



They were up by 20, and the Texans had scored on their previous two possessions. Ran Carthon scored the TD.

Are you noticing anything here? Almost every case involves less than a three-touchdown lead with time enough for the opponent to rally, or else it was still very early in the fourth quarter.



Again -- a lead of only 17 points with more than 10 minutes to play against an NFC favorite.



Again -- up by 15 with more than four minutes left.




It's not excessive when you don't have a kicker.



Did anyone in the media claim anything about the Pats "running up the score" in any of their first five games this season? I certainly don't remember it, if it happened. Nobody said anything until Eckel scored on fourth down with less than 20 seconds to play against Dallas. The next week, the Patriots pulled Brady in the fourth quarter, then put him back in to throw another TD pass against the winless Dolphins after Miami had pulled within 21 after trailing 42-7. And last week, of course, the Patriots went for it on fourth down while leading 38-0 in the fourth quarter, had their starting QB throw a TD pass while leading 38-0, went for it again on fourth down while leading 45-0 with seven minutes to play, and called pass plays on four of their last five plays on the TD drive that made it 52-0.

Even if you don't think the Patriots have been running up the score, you at least have to see the difference between what Dungy's teams did and what the Patriots have been doing.

Well, the only difference is that YOU claim that it's different or qualify it somehow (i.e. it's okay to "run up the score" if you're a team with a sub .500 record )

It's telling that those who claim the Pats are "running up the score" cannot use actual/all facts to demonstrate this but simply distort or ignore facts to make their claim. It's telling because it shows that the facts do not support the claim the the Pats are "running up the score".

Dallas game - the Pats' last TD was scored on a drive that consisted of FIVE RUNS BY BACKUP RUNNING BACKS and 2 passing plays. The TD RUN was scored on a FOURTH DOWN PLAY. Had the Pats wanted POINTS, the easiest way to get them would have been to kick a FG or throw a pass. Instead they ran into a stacked line and scored. Kinda like Alsott did for Dungy, instead Eckel's score didn't come from 20 yards out and Eckel isn't a Pro-Bowl fullback who was out in the game in garbage time. You're right, it's definitely different.


Miami game - Nice to see you distorting the facts, just like most of the media. Brady was FIRST PULLED IN THE THIRD QTR. He only came back into the game after Miami had scored 14 POINTS IN 6 MINUTES (the last off an interception by the BACKUP QB) to cut the lead to 21 with 10 mins left in the game. On the same day, Houston after being DOMINATED to the point of being down 32-7 in the 4th qtr, scored 28 POINTS with their BACKUP QB in less than 14 minutes. ANYTHING is possible in a football game. While I'm sure Pats haters would have liked to see Brady remain on the bench and Cassel throw a few more interceptions, Belichick's job is to make sure the team gets a win. That's why Brady was PUT BACK into the game. Had Belichick wanted to run up the score or get Brady TDs, he would NEVER have pulled Brady from the game in the third qtr.


Washington - so if the Pats had kicked a FG and gone ahead 41/0 rather than 45/0, it would NOT have been "running up the score"? WE GAVE the Redskins a chance to stop us, JUST like we went for it on 4th down leading 38-7 against the Buffalo Bills. The Bills stopped us and NO points were added. Washington didn't stop us so points were added. Tough for them but not "running up the score" for us. By the way, Brady was in the game because that was the continuation of a series that started with more than 2 mins left in the 3rd qtr. Not surprising that you conveniently leave out the fact that Cassel was the QB on the last scoring drive.

We run pass plays because our backup running back is hurt, as is our two starting TEs, and our starting rb is coming back from an injury. Again, Belichick isn't going to further jeopardize the health of a position that's already thin due to injury. Why should we run plays to go 3/out and punt with more than a full qtr of football remaining? To give Washington an opportunity to get back into the game? I'll use one of your excuses for Dungy, "it's not excessive when you have injuries to your rbs and TEs".


The irony of all this is had Belichick really wanted to "run up the score", Brady would have 40 TDs right now and the Pats margin of victory would be 30 pts.

Another irony, amidst all the complaining about the Pats "passing" and "running up the score", the Pats has a higher RAPG than the Colts, throw less than one more pass per game than the Colts and lead the league in rushing attempts DESPITE having injuries to their RBs and TEs. The Pats passing/running percentage split is the SAME as the Colts. Yeah, Belichick is really trying to "run up the score" with all that excessive passing.

 

[indycolts685]

The yelling comment was based on the size of font more than the color, and your comments were confrontational, in other words Dungy never ran up the score. By inference you were saying that BB and the Pats did. Your large red sentences emphasized your disagreement with the original poster. I did address football content in my original reply (its only context, common practice etc), but you have chosen to select from that only that I criticized your use of color and nothing else. Please stop arguing the toss, I apologize if I have been patronizing or dictatorial, I have no aspirations to police the board, I am only looking for simple courtesies. A simple 'sorry it wasnt my intention...." would have sufficed.

By the way I worked for DEC on Networks and Communications back in 1978 and yes we were using phone and mail-like messaging between PDPs and VAXes back then. They weren't commercially available but you could communicate with others on the arpanet. You chose to tackle a veteran of the medium

Well to be honest I didn't notice the font size being any different in size, to me they look the same size, if thats a big issue I am sorry and I really didn't have any intention of making a point by yelling as that really wasn't my intention, I just wanted it to be easier for people to be able to see the text that was mine and his easier. I just wanted to make some points as some of the games he pointed out was not running up the score as the games were still pretty close by NFL standards, I even agreed on some of his points of Dungy running up the score, I think both the Pats and Colts can be considered guilty of doing it I have said that I have no problem with what the Pats are doing. I wasn't trying to doubt you about using the net back in 77 either, I have heard the internet has been around for alot longer but not available to just anybody like it is now..I would be interested in hearing on some of the gadgets used back in the 70's :eat3: