A Common Misconception: Cardinals are much more than Larry Fitzgerald

[Deus Irae]

Ah yes the drive where the rookie QB:

faced 4th and 6th and kept the drive alive with a PI call

Got another PI call that put the ball on the 13.

Had 7 shots at the endzone from the 13 yard line and still couldn't get it in. This even with the confusion caused by the refs giving Seattle an extra timeout.

PI calls against the defense should be considered as negatives when talking about that defense, so I'm not sure why you're pimping them as excuses.

Also, QBs tend to figure out red zone offense last, which is part of the significance of Wilson being a rookie in his first NFL game.

 

[ATippett56]

Just alright? Sure the Seahawks have a crappy offense but I thought the Cardinals Defense did a very good job against Seattle.

They held the Seahawks to 16 points. Now look where the Seahawks started when they scored those points:

Arizona 42 - Field Goal

Arizona 24 - TD

Arizona 34 - Field Goal

Arizona 16 - Field Goal


So all of their scoring came off of shortened fields due to Offensive turn overs and big returns from Leon Washington. The Cardinals defense had a stellar game when you consider that.

Again I'm not saying that I think the Cardinals are going to contain Brady and Gronk. In fact I'm on the record as saying I think Brady will shred the Cardinals D because they have always struggled against great TEs. I just wanted to clear up some misconceptions regarding the Cardinals defense.

Meanwhile, the Seattle Seahawks were a dropped touchdown pass from Braylon "ex-Jet" Edwards away from winning the game.

 

[MadCardDisease]

How has the offense improved? If anything the Cardinals offense will be worse this season, since the Cardinals lost their starting left tackle for the season and the Cardinals are starting a rookie at right tackle. Also, wasn't Skelton leading the charge down the stretch last season and not Kolb?

Losing Levi Brown was a huge blow. While Brown was average at best in pass protection. He was a mauler in the run game. Jeremy Bridges was supposed to start at RT heading into training camp. He also landed on IR.

So yes the Cards have moved to plan B on the OL. They are starting 2 players who have never played their positions in the NFL before. It showed against the Seahawks.

Skelton played in most of the games after the Defense made their turn around. Skelton had his ups and downs. Very often Skelton would put his team in a hole early but would somehow manage to have a late 4th quarter drive for the win. Most of it was due to some of the best catches I have ever seen by Larry Fitzgerald. Also the running game started to pick up some with Beanie Wells.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Meanwhile, the Seattle Seahawks were a dropped touchdown pass from Braylon "ex-Jet" Edwards away from winning the game.

yep. But at no fault to the defense as you can see by what I listed above.

And it wasn't considered a dropped pass by the way. It would have been an amazing catch if he had come down with it.

 

[Deus Irae]

yep. But at no fault to the defense as you can see by what I listed above.

That is simply not true.

And it wasn't considered a dropped pass by the way. It would have been an amazing catch if he had come down with it.

It hit him right in the hands.

 

[ATippett56]

Losing Levi Brown was a huge blow. While Brown was average at best in pass protection. He was a mauler in the run game. Jeremy Bridges was supposed to start at RT heading into training camp. He also landed on IR.

So yes the Cards have moved to plan B on the OL. They are starting 2 players who have never played their positions in the NFL before. It showed against the Seahawks.

Skelton played in most of the games after the Defense made their turn around. Skelton had his ups and downs. Very often Skelton would put his team in a hole early but would somehow manage to have a late 4th quarter drive for the win. Most of it was due to some of the best catches I have ever seen by Larry Fitzgerald. Also the running game started to pick up some with Beanie Wells.

With regards to the Arizona Cardinals offense this season:

Skelton > Kolb
Brown >>>>> Batiste
Bridges >>>>> Massie

If anything, the Arizona Cardinals will be ever more anemic on offense this season as opposed to last season.

 

[Kontradiction]

I'm on record as stating the Cardinal defense might be every bit as good as the Raven's D. And in that respect will be a good test for our offense just a week before our game with the Ravens. This is as good a defense as we will face all season. I don't think the Pats are overlooking them. And given how badly our D gave up yards last season, I don't think they can afford to overlook ANYONE.

If our offense is as efficient as it was against the Titans, I see no reason for it to be effective against the Ravens too. But that's the IF here. (Also we'll be home against AZ and on the road vs Baltimore)

One point in this post is so ridiculous that it made me stop dead in my tracks while scrolling through the thread and respond to it...

I'm on record as stating the Cardinal defense might be every bit as good as the Raven's D. And in that respect will be a good test for our offense just a week before our game with the Ravens. This is as good a defense as we will face all season.

Not even close.

 

[PP21]

There are endless threads on this board cherry picking games or parts of a season to prove a point.


The Cardinals are what their record says they are and that is an 8-8 team with a middle of-the road defense and a poor offense.

I agree they're nothing more than an 8-8 team... because of the offense.

Middle of the road defense? meh.

 

[ATippett56]

Over the final 9 games of the season last year, the Cardinals defense was ranked in the top 5 of several defensive categories. This include being the best defense at stopping teams on 3rd down and the Second best at stopping teams from scroing TDs in the Redzone.

During that second half stretch, the Arizona Cardinals defense did not shut down Brandon Lloyd, the New England Patriots new number one split end.

Brandon Lloyd Career Game Log - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Furthermore, down the stretch run, the Arizona Cardinals gave up 23 points on the road to Cincinnati and San Francisco, the only two teams with winning records in the last remaining eight games.

2011 Arizona Cardinals Statistics & Players - Pro-Football-Reference.com

 

[PP21]

Furthermore, down the stretch run, the Arizona Cardinals gave up 23 points on the road to Cincinnati and San Francisco, the only two teams with winning records in the last remaining eight games.

2011 Arizona Cardinals Statistics & Players - Pro-Football-Reference.com

lol..

SF game:

Time of possession: SF 44 minutes .. AZ 15 minutes.
AZ offense had 47 yards at half. No drive lasted longer than 5 plays. Defense only gave up 9 pts despite two turnovers.
One truly bad defensive drive in the 3rd quarter where SF had a 13 play, 84 yard drive. The other TD they had was because of a short field (INT) that started at the AZ 37. The defense was on the field all game. The fact they gave up only 23 points when the offense turned the ball over 5 times was a miracle. Patrick Peterson did get torn apart by Crabtree though.

Cincinnati game:
Their first 10 points came off of short fields. FG drive started on the AZ 23, and TD drive started on the AZ 28. Not easy to work with if you're the defense.
Cincy's other TD in the game came off an INT. The AZ offense had 53 yards at half. Cincy was up 20-0.
The defense was a victim of the offense in these games. The 2nd half defense was crazy good. 88 yards against, 2 forced turnovers, only 3 points against. The AZ offense finally mustered up some TD/FG drives.
Game should have gone to OT too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJQYmiEdG9o

And again, I'm not trying to say we'll hold Brady in check or anything. The best defenses struggle to do that since he's one of the greatest of all-time.

 

[ATippett56]

The defense was a victim of the offense in these games.

How will the defense improve this season with even a worse offense this season?

 

[MadCardDisease]

It hit him right in the hands.

Which NFC West teams had no drops - NFC West Blog - ESPN

Failing to make catches isn't the same as dropping passes, however. Seattle was one of six NFL teams, and the only one from the NFC West, to make it through opening week without what ESPN Stats & Information defines as drops: "passes the receiver should have caught with ordinary effort, and only when the receiver is 100 percent at fault."

 

[MadCardDisease]

How will the defense improve this season with even a worse offense this season?

I think you may be confusing the TEAM with the Defense. The Defense could be better than last year. However issues on the offense could hold the overall team back.

 

[ATippett56]

I think you may be confusing the TEAM with the Defense. The Defense could be better than last year. However issues on the offense could hold the overall team back.

The Cardinals defense may be statistically worse this season in the points allowed category, since the defense will most likely have to defend a shorter field due to the offense's ineptitude (lack of quality offensive tackles and questionable quarterback talent).

 

[MadCardDisease]

During that second half stretch, the Arizona Cardinals defense did not shut down Brandon Lloyd, the New England Patriots new number one split end.

Brandon Lloyd Career Game Log - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Really? 5 catches for 80 yards and no TDs.

Furthermore, down the stretch run, the Arizona Cardinals gave up 23 points on the road to Cincinnati and San Francisco, the only two teams with winning records in the last remaining eight games.

2011 Arizona Cardinals Statistics & Players - Pro-Football-Reference.com

If you knew anything about that game in SF you would know that:

1st Quarter:

Cards D holds SF and ends up blocking a 46 yard FG.

Skelton throws INT and SF gets ball on Cards 38. SF comes away with no points.

Cards D holds SF to a FG after Cards O goes 3 and out.

Wells Fumbles at Cards 26. Cards D holds SF to a field goal.

2nd Quarter

After another 3 and out by the Cardinals O, Cards D blocks 2nd field goal of the day.

Cards D holds SF to another Field Goal

3rd Quarter

Card D gives up only TD of the game on the opening drive of the 2nd half

Skelton throws INT and SF gets ball on Cardinals 37. Cards D holds SF to a field goal.

Skelton throws INT Cards D holds SF to no points


4th Quarter

SF punts and Cardinals fumble. SF gets ball on Arizona 31. Cards D picks off Alex Smith.

Arizona goes 3 and out yet again. Cards D holds SF to no points.

Rich Bartel replaces Skelton and Arizona finally scored on a TD pass to Fitz.

Arizona D holds SF to no points.

Arizona O fails on 4th down conversion. SF takes the ball over an runs down clock.



So yeah. It sure sounds like SF rolled over the Cardinals D.

 

[lurker1965]

link to hated site

I'm sure you make some good points. Pity you lose all credibility by posting a E!SPN link.

 

[lurker1965]

I'm on record as stating the Cardinal defense might be every bit as good as the Raven's D. ...

Don't Bogart that joint, my friend.

 

[ATippett56]

Really? 5 catches for 80 yards and no TDs.

Brandon Lloyd - 5 receptions for 74 receiving yards and 1 touchdown. Hence, there is no "Revis Island" on the Arizona Cardinals defense. The New England Patriots offense contends with the real "Revis Island" twice a year.

What's so great about the Arizona Cardinals rush defense?

Marshawn Lynch - 21 carries for 85 rushing yards

As for the Arizona Cardinals defense versus the San Francisco 49ers offense last season, the San Francisco 49ers scored 23 against the Arizona Cardinals which was incidentally less than one point from the season average:

Scored 380 points (23.8/g), 11th of 32 in the NFL.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/sfo/2011.htm

 

[MadCardDisease]

Now lets look at how the Card D did the second time against SF:

1st Quarter

Cards D forces SF to punt on opening Drive

After Az O goes 3 and out SF takes over at AZ 43. Cards D holds SF to a FG

Az O goes 3 and out again. Cards D forces SF to punt.

Az goes 3 and out again and SF returns it to Az 4 yard line. End of Q

2nd Quarter

SF starts at Az 4 yard line. Defense forces SF to kick a FG.

Skelton Fumbles and SF recovers on AZ 43. Defense holds and 50 yard FG no good.

Skelton throws a TD on first play of the Drive.

Az holds SF to another FG.

Skelton is picked off again and SF start at AZ 16. Defense holds SF to another FG.

3rd Quarter

AZ is forced to punt and SF returns it to the AZ 37. SF scores a TD.

AZ scores a TD to Fitzgerald.

Cards D holds SF to 3 and out.

AZ O punts to SF. Cards D forces another 3 and out.

Skelton picked off yet again. Cards D forces SF to punt.

4th Quarter

Skelton throws a TD to Roberts.

SF has another 3 and out and is forced to punt.

AZ punts back to SF. Cards D holds SF to another 3 and out.

AZ goes 3 and out punts back to SF. Cards D stops SF in 4 plays.

Arizona runs out the clock.

 

[Deus Irae]

Which NFC West teams had no drops - NFC West Blog - ESPN

You can argue about what a drop is all you want. It hit him in the hands, and it was not a difficult catch to make. He should have had it.