Steelers are the team no one wants to play down the stretch

patsfanincleveland · Dec 16, 2015

supafly said:
And yet you continue to ignore the fact that they had a higher ranked defense (points allowed--the important stat) than we did going into last weekend's game? For a team with "no defense," they were ranked 7th in the entire NFL last week, and even now are giving up 0.5 pts per game more than we are.

Are you suggesting that our defense sucks as well, then? As mentioned before, they had 2 bad games, one where they won and one where they lost. Since we enjoy cherry picking stats so much around here, that means that 8/11 remaining games have seen points allowed that were less than 20. That's nothing close to a sign of a team with "no defense," although I do agree with you that Pittsburgh can be attacked through the air, especially if Edelman is healthy and our pass protection holds up. I wouldn't get caught up in thinking that Pittsburgh's defense sucks, though. They've played much better than expected this year.

That isn't even close to being true. Brown caught a total of 2 balls on the last drive. One was for 13 yards, and one was for 11 yards (TD). That's a total of 24 yards on the final drive, whereas Brown had 133 on the night. In other words, he clearly was over 100 yards, and also was even over his 105 yard per game average (currently #2 in the NFL for wide receivers).

No one even came close to suggesting that "Butler sucks," but when you allow 9/11 attempts for 133 yards and a touchdown, most people aren't going to say that "Butler pretty much locked down Brown," which is borderline ridiculous. He didn't "lock" anyone down.

He was simply near and around the ball, as he should've been, and we were happy to see that kind of effort in week one. In what world does allowing 9/11 attempts for 133 yards equate to stopping someone?

Your fundamental problem is you use meaningless and irrelevant statistics to further an concept that is meaningless in regard to the likely outcome concerning a rematch in the playoffs.

What their "7th" ranked defense did against Johnny Football, AJ McCarron and Matt Hassellback is completely meaningless when faced with the prospect of facing this offense.

That "7th" ranked defense surrendered 28 points to this offense and was allowed to surrender only 28 points due to some self imposed mercy rule by the coaching staff. The Steelers "bad games" also uniquely correlate to the only good offenses they played.

Nothing has really changed the underlying fundamentals that would expect some truly different outcome.

They simply don't match up.

Also, considering that last week BB reverted back to the CB1 on WR2......it's not exactly clear why anyone would spend so much time evaluating a matchup that produced some yards while making zero difference in a week 1 game.

Ice_Ice_Brady · Dec 16, 2015

JJDChE said:
Ben can chuck up the deep ball, but really we've been good at defending that this year. Especially with Ryan coming on as the year has gone by. I don't see the Steelers giving us a big problem on defense.

Yes...the Steelers couldn't match up any worse than against the Patriots. Our secondary takes away the deep ball and pressures the quarterback to get rid of the ball quickly. Mike Tomlin/Ben Roethlisberger are never known to adjust their scheme; they are both dumb jocks (much like Bill Cowher with smashmouth) who are convinced they will win if they impose their will on the other team by doing what they typically do best.

Brady_to_Moss · Dec 16, 2015

Only team in the AFC that scares me is Pitt

supafly · Dec 17, 2015

patsfanincleveland said:
What their "7th" ranked defense did against Johnny Football, AJ McCarron and Matt Hassellback is completely meaningless when faced with the prospect of facing this offense.

They had the 7th ranked defense as far as giving up points per game. That isn't "completely meaningless" as you say. It's simply a fact. While I agree that we obviously pose a different threat, the fact remains that the Steelers defense has not proven to be terrible, and I'm not sure how/why you'd argue against that?

patsfanincleveland said:
Also, considering that last week BB reverted back to the CB1 on WR2......it's not exactly clear why anyone would spend so much time evaluating a matchup that produced some yards while making zero difference in a week 1 game.

You'd have to ask the poster who started the conversation, claiming that Butler "pretty much shut down Brown." Since allowing 9/11 passes for 133 yards and a touchdown obviously isn't "shutting anyone down" in the NFL, I responded--and rightfully so.

PatriotsPimp136 · Dec 17, 2015

Butler has gotten better since that first game against brown. Pitt's a dangerous team offensively but their defense leaves alot to be desired.

supafly · Dec 17, 2015

patsfanincleveland said:
That's the problem with living in western PA.

You start using Steeler fan logic.

In September, the same clowns made a "vow" to come into Foxboro and take care of business.

The only question concerning the Steeler's defense is if BB let's up and doesn't put 50 on them.

I hope you're right @patsfanincleveland. As of now, I see no other AFC contender that really concerns me.

JPsPats · Dec 17, 2015

Brady_to_Moss said:
Only team in the AFC that scares me is Pitt

Same. Their offence is deadly especially with Williams turning back the clock. I do think we match up decently with butler and Ryan but brown will always get his yards.

Key to beating them is limiting the big plays. We MUST rush a minimum of 4 guys, none of this 3 man rush bs Patricia has been doing lately. Brown will get open eventually, and you know they will try 2-3 deep shots to martavis Bryant a game.

supafly · Dec 17, 2015

PatriotsPimp136 said:
Butler has gotten better since that first game against brown. Pitt's a dangerous team offensively but their defense leaves alot to be desired.

It's not set in stone that we'd do the exact same thing, especially since Martavius Bryant is back now.

It's quite possible that Butler would cover the WR2 (Bryant) one-on-one, while Logan Ryan would take on Brown with safety help over the top. It's impossible to know how Belichick would attack those matchups, but it's something to ponder, as the return of Bryant does change things up a bit.

PatriotsPimp136 · Dec 17, 2015

supafly said:
It's not set in stone that we'd do the exact same thing, especially since Martavius Bryant is back now.

It's quite possible that Butler would cover the WR2 (Bryant) one-on-one, while Logan Ryan would take on Brown with safety help over the top. It's impossible to know how Belichick would attack those matchups, but it's something to ponder, as the return of Bryant does change things up a bit.

Getting a pass rush would help. You have to get physical with their wrs.

patsfanincleveland · Dec 17, 2015

supafly said:
They had the 7th ranked defense as far as giving up points per game. That isn't "completely meaningless" as you say. It's simply a fact. While I agree that we obviously pose a different threat, the fact remains that the Steelers defense has not proven to be terrible, and I'm not sure how/why you'd argue against that?

You'd have to ask the poster who started the conversation, claiming that Butler "pretty much shut down Brown." Since allowing 9/11 passes for 133 yards and a touchdown obviously isn't "shutting anyone down" in the NFL, I responded--and rightfully so.

Pittsburgh having the "7th" ranked defense is a fact..........that's meaningless.

Nothing has fundamentally changed that makes that defense match up any better than it has for the past 15 years.

The Patriots are the terror match up that the Steelers do not want to face.

venecol · Dec 17, 2015

Ross12 said:
Let's not forget that the Patriots beat the Steelers without too much struggle on opening night this year. A rematch would still be at home. Granted, the Pats were much healthier then, but they should be mostly healthy by playoff time, should the Steelers make it to them. Butler mostly shut Brown down. The key factor IMO is that Martavis Bryant is back and Wheaton has emerged. However, Ryan has come into his own since then, and Lennie Johnson looked great last night.

On the other side of the ball, the Steelers D still sucks. Edelman and Gronk back = points.

That is not the same PIT team Pats faced during Week 1.

venecol · Dec 17, 2015

supafly said:
And yet you continue to ignore the fact that they had a higher ranked defense (points allowed--the important stat) than we did going into last weekend's game? For a team with "no defense," they were ranked 7th in the entire NFL last week, and even now are giving up 0.5 pts per game more than we are.

Are you suggesting that our defense sucks as well, then? As mentioned before, they had 2 bad games, one where they won and one where they lost. Since we enjoy cherry picking stats so much around here, that means that 8/11 remaining games have seen points allowed that were less than 20. That's nothing close to a sign of a team with "no defense," although I do agree with you that Pittsburgh can be attacked through the air, especially if Edelman is healthy and our pass protection holds up. I wouldn't get caught up in thinking that Pittsburgh's defense sucks, though. They've played much better than expected this year.

That isn't even close to being true. Brown caught a total of 2 balls on the last drive. One was for 13 yards, and one was for 11 yards (TD). That's a total of 24 yards on the final drive, whereas Brown had 133 on the night. In other words, he clearly was over 100 yards, and also was even over his 105 yard per game average (currently #2 in the NFL for wide receivers).

No one even came close to suggesting that "Butler sucks," but when you allow 9/11 attempts for 133 yards and a touchdown, most people aren't going to say that "Butler pretty much locked down Brown," which is borderline ridiculous. He didn't "lock" anyone down.

He was simply near and around the ball, as he should've been, and we were happy to see that kind of effort in week one. In what world does allowing 9/11 attempts for 133 yards equate to stopping someone?

In all fairness, that was Butlers first game as a CB#1 in a primetime game that everyone watched. He did a respectable job but he was covering Brown, who is well Brown (voted #1 WR by his peers).

Neither team is the same as in that first week game. I would say that both the Pats and PIT D have gotten way better since then. The PIT O is better imo than during that game. Pats O has been downgraded due to injuries since that game.

I expect a tough game if it happens with the Pats pulling off the win in friendly territory mainly because we have a way better coach.

lillloyd · Dec 17, 2015

We still have a ways to go to even get to the playoffs. IF we get there I think it could be a pretty intriguing matchup; obviously we didn't have Bryant the first time out, and Wheaton has progressed of late, but on the flip side your secondary has been great with Ryan (and arguably, Butler) well outpacing expectations.

It would be huge if NE was able to take out the Jets next week...is there any scenario where you guys clinch a bye THIS weekend, or is it pretty much a lock that you will be playing for *something* (i.e. not resting starters)?

SVN · Dec 17, 2015

lillloyd said:
We still have a ways to go to even get to the playoffs. IF we get there I think it could be a pretty intriguing matchup; obviously we didn't have Bryant the first time out, and Wheaton has progressed of late, but on the flip side your secondary has been great with Ryan (and arguably, Butler) well outpacing expectations.

It would be huge if NE was able to take out the Jets next week...is there any scenario where you guys clinch a bye THIS weekend, or is it pretty much a lock that you will be playing for *something* (i.e. not resting starters)?

Pats get a bye with a win vs titans and a denver loss.So basically its upto you guys to get the pats a bye this week

VrabelJr · Dec 17, 2015

The Steelers front 7 is pretty good. Not as good as ours but it's certainly up there. Heyward, McLendon, Tuitt on the DL with Shazier, Timmons, Jones, Dupree at LB and Moats, Harrison, Spence, Geathers, and Thomas for depth is pretty damn nice. The weakness of that team is at CB and Safety. Mitchell is a decent FS but he can't matchup with Gronk and their CBs would get schooled by our fast, shifty WRs.

1960Pats · Dec 17, 2015

Uncle Rico said:
Ahh, good ol' conventional wisdom. Nothing like it …

View attachment 11566

Were thos SB50 predictions or 1950 predictions?

VrabelJr · Dec 17, 2015

lillloyd said:
We still have a ways to go to even get to the playoffs. IF we get there I think it could be a pretty intriguing matchup; obviously we didn't have Bryant the first time out, and Wheaton has progressed of late, but on the flip side your secondary has been great with Ryan (and arguably, Butler) well outpacing expectations.

It would be huge if NE was able to take out the Jets next week...is there any scenario where you guys clinch a bye THIS weekend, or is it pretty much a lock that you will be playing for *something* (i.e. not resting starters)?

If we win and Denver loses or Cincy loses and Denver ties we lock up a bye this week. So if your team does its job and our team does its job then our game against the Jets doesn't matter that much. I believe we still want to beat the Jets though because A) they are the Jets and B) we want the #1 seed.

1960Pats · Dec 17, 2015

There's one team that definitely no one wants to play in the playoffs. The Patriots.

supafly · Dec 17, 2015

patsfanincleveland said:
Pittsburgh having the "7th" ranked defense is a fact..........that's meaningless.

No one is suggesting that we wouldn't match up well with Pittsburgh--only that having the 7th ranked defense doesn't equate to "sucking all year," which is the post I responded to.

I think you must have jumped in the middle of this, and kind of ran with your own thoughts here. Stating that a team is 7th in scoring defense is a pretty innocuous comment, which also happens to be factual, like it or not.

Either way, I get your point which is that they'll likely suck (hopefully) against us, and that's all that matters.

Zeus · Dec 17, 2015

In the AFC, people are looking harder at the likely wild cards, Pittsburgh and KC, due to the QB questions in Denver and Cincinnati (and the lack of competiton from the woeful AFC South).

In the NFC, Seattle will in all likelihood crush the so-called winner of the NFC East and then head straight to Carolina. Tough road for the Panthers who will have to beat Seattle and then possibly Arizona or GB.

The tournament will be wide open. Nobody really wants to play NE, especially once they get Edelcritter and Hightower back. They are the best balanced and most battle-tested team in football. The NFC teams have to be more than a little bit wary of Seattle.

Pittsburgh has a dynamic passing game. Will it hold up in the cold weather against playoff level defensive competition? That's the question.

Steelers are the team no one wants to play down the stretch

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