What happened to Tunsil proves that Brady was 100% right in destroying his phone

[Dorito Dink]

All people and certainly all celebrities should destroy their old phones or somehow make the data impossible to retrieve, EXCEPT AND UNLESS they contain data relating to current or foreseeable legal proceedings. If you destroy those types of phones, there may be repercussions.

Given that there was an agreement between Wells and Brady that Brady would NOT have to turn over his cell phone, why the hell wouldn't he destroy the phone if it was no longer in use?

"Just in case ole' Teddy changes his mind and comes back to request my phone, I'll just keep it around."

Dumb.

 

[letekro]

Seriously? Where have you been for the last year and a half? Yes, they didn't want the phone at first. But this is the reason they now give for his suspension.

No. Wrong. I have explained above. They gave a narrow request to turn over documents and he refused. Goodell says "lack of cooperation-Aha! Article 46!". Kind of BS if you ask me, but the 2nd Circuit panel found no problem with this. At any rate, the suspension is not based on failure to turn over the phone.

 

[letekro]

Given that there was an agreement between Wells and Brady that Brady would NOT have to turn over his cell phone, why the hell wouldn't he destroy the phone if it was no longer in use?

"Just in case ole' Teddy changes his mind and comes back to request my phone, I'll just keep it around."

Dumb.

Two judges on the 2nd Circuit found it relevant. A judge in a defamation case would certainly find it extraordinarily relevant.

 

[NashuaPats]

Steph Stradley answered the question over the phone again yesterday.

 

[Schmo]

I can't remember exactly why, but he turned over some emails that related to an irrelevant period, maybe after the Colts game or way before. He didn't turn over any texts or emails from the phone in question--which was by far the most relevant-- which was active from September 2014 to March 2015.

Right, but why have I been able to read them? Or why did he feel the need to apologize to peyton.

If he had some private pictures of giselle or info about his kids, what makes anyone think that the NFL, given its history to anonymously leak information, would keep that safe and secure. Unfortunately, it boils down to his willingness to be suspended for protecting his family. I would do the same.

 

[letekro]

Right, but why have I been able to read them? Or why did he feel the need to apologize to peyton.

If he had some private pictures of giselle or info about his kids, what makes anyone think that the NFL, given its history to anonymously leak information, would keep that safe and secure. Unfortunately, it boils down to his willingness to be suspended for protecting his family. I would do the same.

Many people would do the same. There are repercussions, however. I'm extremely confident that he and his lawyers considered them and decided the harm of turning the messages over outweighed the harm that would come from refusing Wells's request. Maybe they were right, maybe they were wrong, it depends what was in the requested texts.

 

[letekro]

Steph Stradley answered the question over the phone again yesterday.

I believe she is referring to the legal issue of notice. Not what we are discussing here.

 

[Dorito Dink]

Two judges on the 2nd Circuit found it relevant. A judge in a defamation case would certainly find it extraordinarily relevant.

The two judges were VERY clearly ignorant to the case and its specifics. Chin said there was "overwhelming evidence" from the freaking Wells Report for crying out loud (hint: Wells admitted there was no conclusive evidence).

The phone situation is a classic red herring used by a corrupt dictator looking for any way to convict. It was stated from the onset that the phone was not required nor would he be punished for not providing it. Once the NFL realized they had dogshit for evidence, they created a red herring to prosecute Brady by saying he "destroyed" the phone. End of story. Not Brady's fault that you and Mo and Curly from the Second Circuit can't see this for what it is.

 

[The Gr8est]

Many people would do the same. There are repercussions, however. I'm extremely confident that he and his lawyers considered them and decided the harm of turning the messages over outweighed the harm that would come from refusing Wells's request. Maybe they were right, maybe they were wrong, it depends what was in the requested texts.

Isn't it important that the evidence supports no inflation of the footballs making the phone moot?

There is no murder conviction when the corpse is walking around uninjured.

 

[chasa]

That's correct, although I don't see your point. As I said in my post, they didn't want his phone, they wanted responsive texts and emails. Tis one thing not to provide them, tis another to destroy them.

apparently you didn't see the leaked documents that included hundreds of emails and text correspondence from brady including private items such as Brady saying manning only had one year left, and what cover pool cover he should get, etc.

Brady gave them EVERYTHING. And once they couldn't find anything they could use to persecute him, they decided "oh by the way we changed out mind, give us your phone"

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Obviously, the NFL had no leverage to seek the texts from those people and the list was therefore of little value.

No, the NFL had access to every single phone of every single NFL employee who was not an NFL player (and thus protected by the union). With the full list of names, dates, and times provided by Brady's team, the NFL knew if they were missing any relevant information or not.

Specifically, the NFL knew that they were not missing any relevant information AT ALL, since the record provided by TB12 showed no calls to JJ, McNally, or other staffers that had not already been analyzed by having access to those phones.

It is bewildering the sheer level of ignorance displayed about deflategate, even among those that think that they followed it!

sheesh

 

[Froob]

Wells did not want phone.

Brady provides info from time in question.

Wells is satisfied

Pash modifies report

Wells/Pash say Brady was uncooperative

Brady has hearing.

Goodell asks where is phone

Brady had is cycled out

Brady provides all phone/text records to NFL

Goodell says Brady destroyed phone and uncooperative

Chin says Brady not turning over a private phone was damaging to his cause.

It's incredible the judges bought this. Didn't Kessler bring this up? He had to of had.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Wells's job was to investigate. The NFL's job was to levy a punishment. Wells clearly stated in the Report that Brady failed to turn over potentially relevant evidence--the very evidence you and I have been discussing:

We did not receive, and were therefore unable to review, all of the materials we
requested or deemed relevant. In particular, we requested electronically stored information,including emails and text messages, from several individuals who declined our request. Of note,Tom Brady was asked to provide emails and text messages in response to narrowly tailored requests pertinent to the subject of our investigation. Brady declined our request.

It is a stretch to say that Wells is saying he was "satisfied" with Brady's response here. The relevant idea here is that Brady could have turned over potentially relevant information, but didn't, and Wells made note of that in the Report. Based on this, Goodell invoked Article 46 for "lack of cooperation." Again, we are back to the legal issue of notice, which the 2nd Cir. panel did not find compelling.

Its not a stretch. Wells said it. He is on record as saying it.

You are correct in the respect that Wells did ask to look at TB12's phone and was denied the request. In the absence of the phone he stated that TB12 answered every question with sincerity and honesty. He had McNally and Jaz's texts so he was "satisfied". To your point we don't know what constitutes "satisfied" but he said it. Thats it.

Now, if someone told TB12 that he would have been in big F-ing trouble w/o turning over his phone at that juncture and in March and Wells says that TB12 was completely uncooperative, then that is different than "satisfied" and "cooperative"

I really don't want to argue this anymore. 15 months is enough.

 

[RobertWeathers]

It's incredible the judges bought this. Didn't Kessler bring this up? He had to of had.

Not sure but it better f-ing come up in the en banc if there is one.

 

[Dorito Dink]

Isn't it important that the evidence supports no inflation of the footballs making the phone moot?

There is no murder conviction when the corpse is walking around uninjured.

Blasphemous. I heard that guy say he'd "kill" for a vacation one time. Sure enough 2 weeks later, he took vacation.

Goodell sentences said guy to death...and is also suspended for 2 games.

 

[Froob]

Not sure but it better f-ing come up in the en banc if there is one.

I just don't understand how someone could possibly explain that timeline of events and say the phone was relevant.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I just don't understand how someone could possibly explain that timeline of events and say the phone was relevant.

Its inexplicable. From Wells to Pash to Goody to m-f-ing Chin.

Even though the phone issue bit Tom in the ass he did the 100% right thing.

Despite what Goody and Chin believe this is not North Korea.

 

[IllegalContact]

Brady's phone was irrelevant......its existence or not would not have changed anything......the emphasis would have just been placed on some other meaningless point.

requested messages were provided
Wells stated the phone would no longer be needed.

the fact that it was destroyed only served as fluff after the fact.

 

[TheFlyingWedge]

That's correct, although I don't see your point. As I said in my post, they didn't want his phone, they wanted responsive texts and emails. Tis one thing not to provide them, tis another to destroy them.

By destroying a phone, the text messages and emails are not also destroyed. They still exist and can be retrieved by the phone carrier or transferred to another device. Any idiot who has ever upgraded to a new phone should know this.

Brady gave the NFL access to pages and pages of that data from his phone carrier but the NFL inexplicably stated that it would be too much work to go through it all.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

Nice try, but the request was for text messages and emails based on a list of search terms, not the phone itself.

And even if they did want Brady's phone, the scandal was not that he didn't provide it, but that he got rid of the phone, and all of the data on it, immediately before being interviewed by Wells.

I don't dislike often, but this is a clearly a need to use it situation.

Unless you are related to someone in the NFL* front office, I'm not even sure how you can be postulating such nonsense. Obviously you ate everything up that Her Goodell was putting out there without questioning his motivations.

I'd spell it out for you, but I imagine you made up your mind some time ago and would only be further entrenched in your position by being challenged (my opinion which could be wrong).. I realize you could say the same thing about me and I hope I am open minded to having my position challenged.