In your opinion is Jadeveon Clowney a 'Prima Donna' ?

[JPsPats]

Yeah, you have to go all the way back 2 years to a guy named Andrew Luck. Or this year for Johnny Manziel. Or next year for Jameis Winston. All are guys who played college football and gave it their all even though they each knew they would be top draft picks the following year.

Luck was draft eligible after his first good season. In his non eligible draft year his stats were 13 tds 4 ints no one was saying anything about him yet.

Manziel isnt even viewed as a first round pick by everyone, jaws has an article on nfl.com saying he wouldn't touch manziel till the 4th round. Everyone says clowney should be a top pick.

Do you hear anyone saying manziel is a once in a decade qb? How about for mariota? Haven't heard that for winston either.

And you wanna nail clowney for his issues, how about when manziel showed up drunk to peyton mannings throwing academy in the off season last year? There were reports he was partying before game nights too. He gets a pass though, right?

 

[thenepatsrule]

Luck was draft eligible after his first good season. In his non eligible draft year his stats were 13 tds 4 ints no one was saying anything about him yet.

Manziel isnt even viewed as a first round pick by everyone, jaws has an article on nfl.com saying he wouldn't touch manziel till the 4th round. Everyone says clowney should be a top pick.

Do you hear anyone saying manziel is a once in a decade qb? How about for mariota? Haven't heard that for winston either.

And you wanna nail clowney for his issues, how about when manziel showed up drunk to peyton mannings throwing academy in the off season last year? There were reports he was partying before game nights too. He gets a pass though, right?

In my opinion Greg Robinson as the first overall pick makes a lot of sense for the Texans, Clowney seems to be TOish when it comes to creating drama. Manziel will be toast the moment two defenders land on him or if he were to get knocked hard out of bounds. The Texans are better off investing in a OLineman to protect their QB.

 

[JPsPats]

In my opinion Greg Robinson as the first overall pick makes a lot of sense for the Texans, Clowney seems to be TOish when it comes to creating drama. Manziel will be toast the moment two defenders land on him or if he were to get knocked hard out of bounds. The Texans are better off investing in a OLineman to protect their QB.

I wouldn't be surprised if they went oline, qb, mack, or clowney

They wanna win now ----> can't win w.o a qb so they may grab one.
Oline------> can't go wrong with a franchise tackle, although they do have a good one already.
Clowney or mack---> pairing on of those guys with Watt would build a nasty line with constant pressure.

 

[Kontradiction]

In my opinion Greg Robinson as the first overall pick makes a lot of sense for the Texans, Clowney seems to be TOish when it comes to creating drama. Manziel will be toast the moment two defenders land on him or if he were to get knocked hard out of bounds. The Texans are better off investing in a OLineman to protect their QB.

RE: Manziel. He's usually been pretty smart about getting out of bounds before the big hit. People said the same thing about Russell Wilson two years ago and he's yet to absorb a really big hit while on the run.

 

[thenepatsrule]

I wouldn't be surprised if they went oline, qb, mack, or clowney

They wanna win now ----> can't win w.o a qb so they may grab one.
Oline------> can't go wrong with a franchise tackle, although they do have a good one already.
Clowney or mack---> pairing on of those guys with Watt would build a nasty line with constant pressure.

With Watts contract nearing an end , there is a small chance he may leave the Texans for a team willing to pay more

Here's how Watt's situation will work. By May 3, the Texans have to decide whether or not to pick up an optional fifth year (2015) for Watt's rookie contract. The value of that contract is based on a variation on a transition tag. Because Watt was the 11th selection, his fifth-year salary would be an average of the top 25 players' salaries at his position, excluding the top three.
Texans have plenty of time to work on J.J. Watt's next deal - ESPN

I doubt Clowney will be a starter from day 1, if that's the case how long will he and Watt play together for?

 

[thenepatsrule]

RE: Manziel. He's usually been pretty smart about getting out of bounds before the big hit. People said the same thing about Russell Wilson two years ago and he's yet to absorb a really big hit while on the run.

While the Wilson story is true , the same cannot b said about RG3, look where his career stands now. The problem with QBs like Wilson/RG3/Manziel (i.e Smaller QBs - RG3 is 6.2 BTW) is that every time they run you hold your breath and pray to Jesus that they don't get hit,cause if they do there is a very very good chance that they wont make it to the end of the game.

 

[Kontradiction]

While the Wilson story is true , the same cannot b said about RG3, look where his career stands now. The problem with QBs like Wilson/RG3/Manziel (i.e Smaller QBs - RG3 is 6.2 BTW) is that every time they run you hold your breath and pray to Jesus that they don't get hit,cause if they do there is a very very good chance that they wont make it to the end of the game.

RGIII was the exact opposite of Wilson in college. While Wilson would duck out of bounds, RGIII would cut it back inside to pick up more yardage. I figured he was going to pay dearly for that at the pro level if his coaches didn't fix that part of his game and said it several times in the draft forum.

 

[JPsPats]

With Watts contract nearing an end , there is a small chance he may leave the Texans for a team willing to pay more



I doubt Clowney will be a starter from day 1, if that's the case how long will he and Watt play together for?

If the texans don't think he can start right away, they won't pick him. If your a top 5 pick you damn well be ready to start.

 

[thenepatsrule]

If the texans don't think he can start right away, they won't pick him. If your a top 5 pick you damn well be ready to start.

I agree with what you said, but i doubt Clowney will start right away. Main reason being his lack of work ethic.

 

[Deus Irae]

I agree with what you said, but i doubt Clowney will start right away. Main reason being his lack of work ethic.

If Clowney goes to the Texans, he'll end up having to learn to play the 3-4 OLB. That might slow down his adjustment time. He'll be getting plenty of snaps from the beginning, though, and the work ethic discussion isn't going to change that.

 

[SB39]

There are numerous monetary scandals involving players and agents and somehow you don't think this happens?

No I don't, and here's why:

Every single knowledgeable person in sports knows that giving a half-assed effort is more dangerous than going all out. When you give a half assed effort, you are more likely to get injured, not less likely (assuming your opponents are going all out).

Not one single agent would advise a client "you need to stay healthy, so give a half assed effort when you're out there."

He stated he was sick. Do you have anything of substance to dispute his claim?

Heh heh. And if you believe the ole' "flu like symptoms in August" excuse, then I have a great deal on the Zakim Bridge you might be interested in.

Your childlike naivete is adorable!

 

[SB39]

Luck was draft eligible after his first good season. In his non eligible draft year his stats were 13 tds 4 ints no one was saying anything about him yet.

The above statement is completely irrelevant to the point. Fact is that going into his final year at Stanford, Andrew Luck knew he would be the #1 pick in the following draft - and he didn't give a half assed effort to "stay healthy" like the Clowney apologists are saying Clowney did.

Manziel isnt even viewed as a first round pick by everyone, jaws has an article on nfl.com saying he wouldn't touch manziel till the 4th round. Everyone says clowney should be a top pick.

Last time I checked, Jaws was not GM of the Texans, Browns, Jaguars, etc. Manziel went into this season knowing he would be a top pick in the following draft, and he didn't give a half assed effort to "stay healthy" like the Clowney apologists are saying Clowney did.

Do you hear anyone saying manziel is a once in a decade qb? How about for mariota? Haven't heard that for winston either.

They are all surefire top-5 picks, like Clowney is, which is what we are talking about. And sorry, but plenty of people called Luck a once-a-decade prospect, yet he went all out his final season at Stanford.

(Funny how once-a-decade prospects appear every other year or so).

And you wanna nail clowney for his issues, how about when manziel showed up drunk to peyton mannings throwing academy in the off season last year? There were reports he was partying before game nights too. He gets a pass though, right?

My friend, I am ripping Manziel a new one in another thread for precisely that type of behavior. You should join in and help come to my defense because Manziel has the same apologists over there that Clowney has over here.

But, despite how much I dislike Manziel as a player, I do have to give the guy credit that one thing he did not do this past year is give a half-assed effort on the field.

 

[Kontradiction]

No I don't, and here's why:

Every single knowledgeable person in sports knows that giving a half-assed effort is more dangerous than going all out. When you give a half assed effort, you are more likely to get injured, not less likely (assuming your opponents are going all out).

Not true. But since you're saying it as if it's a fact, then you need to provide some sources or studies that state this is the case in contact sports. I'll wait while you cite your sources.

Also, this statement has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the comment you quoted.

Not one single agent would advise a client "you need to stay healthy, so give a half assed effort when you're out there."

No, but they would caution them on the amount of money at stake if said athlete does get injured. Said athlete would then take more precautions to protect himself. Dominique Easley was being touted as a consensus first round pick 1/4 through the college season, blew his other knee out, and is now looking at getting drafted on Day 2 at earliest, just as an example.

Heh heh. And if you believe the ole' "flu like symptoms in August" excuse, then I have a great deal on the Zakim Bridge you might be interested in.

Not sure about you, but I've had some pretty disgusting colds in August. Like I said, you're more than welcome to provide something to dispute the claim that he was sick. I'm all ears. What it looks like you're doing, in response, is trying to make a case that common colds don't exist during the summer?

Your childlike naivete is adorable!

An attempt at a personal attack, such as this, is typically the first sign that someone knows their argument is weak. Please continue to dig your heels in on this one, though.

 

[SB39]

Not true. But since you're saying it as if it's a fact, then you need to provide some sources or studies that state this is the case in contact sports. I'll wait while you cite your sources.

Boy for someone who said he was "not going to jump into this", you're sure doing a lot of jumping. Self-control issues, maybe?

Here's about 100 articles saying that being in top physical shape and going all out is the best way to avoid injury. It took me about 10 seconds to find these. Thank you for waiting.

Let me google that for you

No, but they would caution them on the amount of money at stake if said athlete does get injured. Said athlete would then take more precautions to protect himself. Dominique Easley was being touted as a consensus first round pick 1/4 through the college season, blew his other knee out, and is now looking at getting drafted on Day 2 at earliest, just as an example.

No one is saying injuries don't happen, just that going half assed is no way to avoid injuries. If anything, going half assed (when your opponents are going all out) only increases the chances.

Not sure about you, but I've had some pretty disgusting colds in August. Like I said, you're more than welcome to provide something to dispute the claim that he was sick. I'm all ears. What it looks like you're doing, in response, is trying to make a case that common colds don't exist during the summer?

Heh heh.... a fan who believes the ole' sports "flu like symptoms" excuse... Like I said before, your childlike naivete is adorable!

You might actually have a case if the same situation didn't follow him around all year long, but it did. What, did he have the flu against UCF, UGA, Mizzou and Tennessee also?

 

[OhExaulted1]

Well, Belichick couldn't "fix" Haynesworth, so I guess you feel Belichick as a coach isn't worth a damn?

Haynesworth is more of the exception than the rule. For every Fat Albert there's been a bunch more Bryan Cox's, Rodney Harrison's, Corey Dillon's and Randy Mosses, none of which showed up here with stellar reputations.

Bethel Johnson was another idiot, but hanging your hat on Fat Albert alone is not a great comparison to (as mentioned) some kid fresh out of college.

 

[IllegalContact]

I'd hate to be the one who looks bad in passing up on Clowney.....


that said, the texans would be smartest to move the pick....turn it into 2 picks, get someone like khalil mack (cushing can't be counted on) and maybe OT taylor lewan.

they would be then much more comfortable trading the #33 to the pats for ryan mallett

 

[Kontradiction]

Boy for someone who said he was "not going to jump into this", you're sure doing a lot of jumping. Self-control issues, maybe?

Boredom.

Here's about 100 articles saying that being in top physical shape and going all out is the best way to avoid injury. It took me about 10 seconds to find these. Thank you for waiting.

Let me google that for you

Did you actually read any of those articles? The one that actually tries to quantify what you're stating as fact with actual research comes away with this...

In work with injured athletes, some sport and exercise psychologists have proposed that certain attitudes might predispose athletes to injury (7). According to this research, the attitudes that coaches often try to instil in their athletes can actually backfire with regard to injury risks. For example, the 'no pain, no gain', and 'give 110%' attitudes might unwittingly lead to athletes taking undue risks. In many sports, participants need to be assertive and play hard, but within safe limits, employing appropriate techniques and strategies. This doesn't just apply to contact sports since many other exercisers attempt to go through the pain barrier and as a result suffer overuse injuries or over-train.

Not only does it disagree with your take. As a matter of fact, it goes the exact opposite direction.

I like the Google search, though. I like the way you tried to skew the results by searching "sports giving a poor effort more likely to be injured", instead of something along the lines of, "study of injuries to athletes related to effort".

No one is saying injuries don't happen, just that going half assed is no way to avoid injuries.

Injuries are unavoidable in any contact sport, but I've yet to see anything that you have provided that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that being more careful on the field only causes injury to happen more often.

If anything, going half assed (when your opponents are going all out) only increases the chances.

You've only proven that this is opinion.

Heh heh.... a fan who believes the ole' sports "flu like symptoms" excuse... Like I said before, your childlike naivete is adorable!

And now, since you can't dispute what I said or prove that his claim is false, you're going after me. As I said, this is the first sign that an opponent knows his position is a weak one.

You might actually have a case if the same situation didn't follow him around all year long, but it did. What, did he have the flu against UCF, UGA, Mizzou and Tennessee also?

No, but I've never made the claim that he was giving full effort. My response to you was a reply to the fact that he was sucking wind in the UNC game. The rest of the year he didn't appear to be sick or out of sorts. In that game, he did.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

That's true but, Haynesworth could have been much much better if he had Wilfork's work ethic. I guess we'll see. I just think he has too many red flags for a guy that's going to be at least a top 5 pick.

He has one red flag. One...the perception that he doesn't work hard.

The "I don't like how they start on the ground" comment was made tongue in cheek, as well, he was grinning when he said it and it was showing confidence in himself that he doesn't get knocked to the ground. He didn't do the drill, but the reason he didn't was not because he didn't like how they started on the ground, it was a joke he made that has spun out of control.

Other red flags do not exist. Comparing him to a piece of sheeit like Haynesworth is not fair. That guy loafed through college (his career stats do not compare to Clowney's sophomore year alone), loafed in the pros, stomped a man when his helmet was off, had women issues, he had a laundry list of red flags and he was over 30 when he arrived in New England. Clowney is just now able to order a drink.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Yeah, you have to go all the way back 2 years to a guy named Andrew Luck. Or this year for Johnny Manziel. Or next year for Jameis Winston. All are guys who played college football and gave it their all even though they each knew they would be top draft picks the following year.

Luck was eligible for the draft, he could have left. Manziel is not considered a surefire top 5 pick, and Winston is going to have to have another season where he proves it as well. Clowney was the surefire #1 pick in the draft and was ineligible. That doesn't happen often at all, as none of your examples fit the criteria.

Edit---I see another reasonable poster beat me to the punch on this point. I just wanted to weigh in on this because it's wrong. Not sure what Clowney did to so enrage SB39, but I fear it is clouding his judgment.

 

[SB39]

I'd hate to be the one who looks bad in passing up on Clowney.....


that said, the texans would be smartest to move the pick....turn it into 2 picks, get someone like khalil mack (cushing can't be counted on) and maybe OT taylor lewan.

That's exactly how I feel. Well, I don't mean those two specific players, but if I were in the top-3 or in a position to draft Clowney, I'd trade down and turn my pick into multiple first rounders.

And I have no doubt that so would Belichick.