Anyone else worried about of the JAG factor at the safety position?

[mgteich]

The Secondary

We need 7 position player defensive backs. We have 8.
BODDEN
McCOURTY
ARRINGTON
BUTLER
DOWLING
CHUNG
BARRETT
BROWN

SOME OBSERVATIONS
1) Belichick decided that Brown and Barrett would add more than Sanders and Meriweather.
2) Butler had a solid preseason and survived.
3) Dowling is part of the present and future of the secondary.
4) It is great if Bodden and Arrington are ready for Game 1.

MY HOPE
A) We will add a veteran safety.
B) This would result in an very reasonable secondary, given the 2011 additions of Bodden, Dowling, Barrett and the new addition.

 

[Jared]

Re: THe Secondary

Many teams commonly carry 9 or 10 DBs on their roster. We are currently below the average number.

 

[mgteich]

Re: THe Secondary



I agree. We have 8 defensive backs plus wannabees Ihedigbo and Molden. So, we have the "normal" 9-10. My judgement is that we can go with the normal of 9 since ALL of the nine are able to function in the system. The 9th was Dowling who has looked fine. We would need 10 if we had one or two who were questionable and needed to learn the system. We would need 10 if we didn't have enough top special teamers among the 9.

 

[Bruschi_]

Re: THe Secondary

I agree. We have 8 defensive backs plus wannabees Ihedigbo and Molden. So, we have the "normal" 9-10. My judgement is that we can go with the normal of 9 since ALL of the nine are able to function in the system. The 9th was Dowling who has looked fine. We would need 10 if we had one or two who were questionable and needed to learn the system. We would need 10 if we didn't have enough top special teamers among the 9.

I dunno why the hate for the "wannabee" Molden. I wouldn't be surprised if he becomes the #3 CB by end of season or even mid-season. Ihedigbo should be one of the first gone tho.

 

[Coach42]

Re: THe Secondary

Molden making the team has to be the biggest upset, right? The guy couldn't even get on the field for one of the worst secondaries in football and now be is making the team over Brandon Merriweather?

 

[mgteich]

Re: THe Secondary

There's no hate for Molden. Personally, I'd be extremely surprised if the were our #3 by midseason moving ahead of Arrington AND Butler AND Dowling (2 former starters and a high 2nd rounder).

Molden was an oft injured STer for Houston, at the bottom of the depth chart at corner. After 3 years they cut him. He may be a very good special teamer.

HOWEVER, as a corner, he is a project. He has played 32 snaps (not games, SNAPS) at corner in 3 years in Houston. He dropped back in coverage 20 times in 3 YEARS in Houston.

Do I think that we have room for project on the squad. OK, got me; I do. If Molden is this year's project who is also a top STer, then fine. This situation worked out fine from Brown and Arrington.

So, BOTTOM LINE
I have no hate for Molden. I just think him the 3rd most expendable player on the 53, after TARP and IHEDIGBO.

I dunno why the hate for the "wannabee" Molden. I wouldn't be surprised if he becomes the #3 CB by end of season or even mid-season. Ihedigbo should be one of the first gone tho.

 

[Coach42]

Re: THe Secondary

I dunno why the hate for the "wannabee" Molden. I wouldn't be surprised if he becomes the #3 CB by end of season or even mid-season. Ihedigbo should be one of the first gone tho.

Its not hate, shock and awe. He has only been on the team for 3 days.

 

[Metaphors]

Re: The Secondary

A) We will add a veteran safety.

My thoughts:

- The Pats can realistically only have 3 CBs active (4 if you include a ST ace like Arrington). The Pats have 6 guys on the roster listed as CBs.

- The Pats have 4 safeties but none are particularly adept at coverage.

- Dowling and Molden are both bigger than Meriweather.

Seems to me that Dowling and/or Molden will take over the cover safety role played by Meriweather. Additional benefit is that they can step outside and jam bigger receivers when needed (Pats face quite a few this year).

Maybe instead of finding safeties that can cover, Belichick wants to use corners that can hit/tackle. Just a thought.

 

[Fencer]

Re: The Secondary

My thoughts:

- The Pats can realistically only have 3 CBs active (4 if you include a ST ace like Arrington). The Pats have 6 guys on the roster listed as CBs.

- The Pats have 4 safeties but none are particularly adept at coverage.

- Dowling and Molden are both bigger than Meriweather.

Seems to me that Dowling and/or Molden will take over the cover safety role played by Meriweather. Additional benefit is that they can step outside and jam bigger receivers when needed (Pats face quite a few this year).

Maybe instead of finding safeties that can cover, Belichick wants to use corners that can hit/tackle. Just a thought.

I'm guessing BB is serious about having two safeties on the field with similar characteristics, rather than any version of a free/strong safety split. That might be one reason for Meriweather's expendability.

It had been my hope that Arrington would wind up at safety. But that requires having sufficient CB depth without him, something which hasn't yet been established to be the case. It might also require at least a partial free/strong safety kind of split, although any DB who's lined up even for a few snaps at DE may also have what it takes to regularly assume strong safety responsibilities.

Right now it looks like Arrington's position in the defense is #3 CB, even though Bodden is the one who slides into the slot in nickel packages. He also is the natural top backup to the starters, with Butler being the slot CB whenever any of the other 3 CBs is unavailable.

 

[mgteich]

Re: The Secondary

I really don't think of Dowling and Molden in the same category at all.

I agree that Dowling may very well be used as a safety. Molden is a developmental special teamer. He would only be active if he is a top special teamer. IMHO, he is clearly the least likely of the 10 defensive backs to be active.

My thoughts:

- The Pats can realistically only have 3 CBs active (4 if you include a ST ace like Arrington). The Pats have 6 guys on the roster listed as CBs.

- The Pats have 4 safeties but none are particularly adept at coverage.

- Dowling and Molden are both bigger than Meriweather.

Seems to me that Dowling and/or Molden will take over the cover safety role played by Meriweather. Additional benefit is that they can step outside and jam bigger receivers when needed (Pats face quite a few this year).

Maybe instead of finding safeties that can cover, Belichick wants to use corners that can hit/tackle. Just a thought.

 

[Bruschi_]

Re: The Secondary

We have enough Special Teamers already: Slater, Ihedigbo, Barrett, Tarpinian, White. I think you are underestimating Molden's role. Don't think Butler is here much longer if he was being shopped around during cut downs.

 

[Triumph]

Re: The Secondary

We have enough Special Teamers already: Slater, Ihedigbo, Barrett, Tarpinian, White. I think you are underestimating Molden's role. Don't think Butler is here much longer if he was being shopped around during cut downs.

But he had a good training camp.

 

[Triumph]

Re: The Secondary

My thoughts:

- The Pats can realistically only have 3 CBs active (4 if you include a ST ace like Arrington). The Pats have 6 guys on the roster listed as CBs.

- The Pats have 4 safeties but none are particularly adept at coverage.

- Dowling and Molden are both bigger than Meriweather.

Seems to me that Dowling and/or Molden will take over the cover safety role played by Meriweather. Additional benefit is that they can step outside and jam bigger receivers when needed (Pats face quite a few this year).

Maybe instead of finding safeties that can cover, Belichick wants to use corners that can hit/tackle. Just a thought.

Dont forget Josh Barret is 6' 2" - 225

Life on the bubble is uncomfortable for Pats like Meriweather, Barrett | New England Patriots | projo.com | The Providence Journal

 

[supafly]

Re: The Secondary

We have enough Special Teamers already: Slater, Ihedigbo, Barrett, Tarpinian, White. I think you are underestimating Molden's role. Don't think Butler is here much longer if he was being shopped around during cut downs.

I think YOU are underestimating Barrett's role He will not simply be a ST here.

I am sure that Molden will have the opportunity to move up in the pack with some decent play + potential injuries/lessened play from some of the lower CB's, but I agree with mg that hopefully we don't see this.

You may be right in saying that you believe that he (Molden) is ahead of Butler, but I am guessing not at the moment anyway.

 

[reflexblue]

Re: THe Secondary

I agree. We have 8 defensive backs plus wannabees Ihedigbo and Molden. So, we have the "normal" 9-10. My judgement is that we can go with the normal of 9 since ALL of the nine are able to function in the system. The 9th was Dowling who has looked fine. We would need 10 if we had one or two who were questionable and needed to learn the system. We would need 10 if we didn't have enough top special teamers among the 9.

I just hope Dowling can stay healthy, thats been a problem for him since HS. I wouldn't count on that changing now.

 

[nantucketguy]

So besides Chung, anyone worried about the Safety postion going into week one?

 

[Bruschi_]

No. Barrett and Brown are upgrades to their predecessors. They have higher ceilings then those we had. Sanders was average at best. Meriweather was very overrated due to some nice hits and I guess being liked by his coworkers. The sky ain't falling watch and see.

 

[Reckedtrek]

Depends. What's your definition of "JAG"?

 

[Amnorix]

Well, Chung isn't a JAG, which you basically admitted in the OP.

As for the other guy, whoever it is, Meriweather was an inconsistent perform and, on balance, a JAG or worse in the sense that he could kill your defense as fast as he helped it. I think BB in general would prefer a consistent JAG than an inconsistent great/awful player. He can plan around the consistent guy, whereas he doesn't know WTF he is going to get from the inconsistent guy on any given play/series/game.

So yes, I'm "worried" about the other safety position in the sense that I hope we get someone who performs well, but no more worried than I would be if Meriweather was starting.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

No. Barrett and Brown are upgrades to their predecessors. They have higher ceilings then those we had. Sanders was average at best. Meriweather was very overrated due to some nice hits and I guess being liked by his coworkers. The sky ain't falling watch and see.

Exactly, I don't know what people think Meriweather was but he was not a good Safety. If the new guys can play their assignments and make an occasional tackle we're already in better shape. I don't think there is anything Brown can't do that Sanders could. The safety position has been sub par for a few years now, nowhere to go but up.