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Felger: Pats moving to a more "aggressive" scheme?


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Their defense almost lost them all 3 of those super bowls and finally cracked in '07. But to be fair, Brady had a perfect chance of pulling away from the Panthers but threw a dumb pass in the endzone that was intercepted which put the Panthers right back in the game.

Couldn't have said it any better. The problem with the current Pats is that nobody has shown they can come through in the clutch. Nobody can make a damn play. Like the 1st Ravens game, Butler didn't do anything to make Clayton drop the pass. The Pats rely on you making a mistake instead of making opponents make mistakes.

Lack of playmaking in critical situations his has been a major problem since 2006. While former clutch players like Vrabel, Bruschi and Harrrison were getting older and McGinest gone, nobody could step up and make a play.

I understand their defense is young, but I haven't seen a young player with any swagger. In fact, most of them don't look very confident at all. All I see them do is look around and wait for something to happen. This defense needs an attitude and until they show that, they won't go very far in the playoffs.


Why do you insist upon torturing yourself with the dumbest thoughts and beliefs?

So....let's adapt the Steelers defense that almost cost them the SB against a 9-7 Cardinals team...a defense that save for a worse opposing defense would be remembered for providing the biggest collapse in Super Bowl history. Let's adopt the defense that WOULD have cost them SB XL but for a completely bogus holding call. Seattle ran up and down the field all game on them.

Maybe the Giants. Look at their sustained level of excellence since 2007.

How about the "#1" Jets defense. The defense that surrendered six 4th quarter leads in 2009 that resulted in losses?

Almost and did are two different things.

No swagger...well.. like duh. You have rookies and second year players. Anybody remember the dynasty years of the late 1990's?

Reality

It's QB driven league. As such, you have to sustain scoring. We didn't last year on the road. Also, the real measure should be drives with points surrendered. You give opponents chance after change, averages say they will score. The particurly applies to the fourth qtr as defenses wear down.

That's why football is a game of adjustments.

We are ahead of the game because BB knows you can't have too many good secondary guys. Actually, the Jets figured that out too.

One play or drive is not a game made. Inability to recognize this concept has driven this site to fixate on the Baltimore TD in the playoffs and the 98 yard drive in Denver.
 
There's a lot of good points in this post. I think the secret in the past to the Patriots defense was selective aggression. The Johnson and Ryan defenses they are dialing up blitzes all the time and when it's working it's very flashy and everybody says ooooh look at this fun toy. When it's not teams can drop a ton of points on them. Lebeau is much more selective. He waits until teams are in situations that favor his defense and then he brings pressure or fakes pressure causing other teams to make mistakes. I want the Patriots to become more situationally aggressive.

Part of this has been lack or personnel. There are times when they tried to be aggressive and got burnt because even with the blitz they got no pressure or corner quickly lost contain. We'll find out shortly if this team once again has the personnel.
 
You couldn't be any more wrong. In Madden 11, Brandon Meriweather has 89 swagger! Spikes has 88! And to complement them, both Hernandez and Cunningham have 85 swagger. How's that sound? :rocker:

OH GOD! here comes the Apocalypse. We are now using Madden ratings to decide how good our players are. :eek:
 
You couldn't be any more wrong. In Madden 11, Brandon Meriweather has 89 swagger! Spikes has 88! And to complement them, both Hernandez and Cunningham have 85 swagger. How's that sound? :rocker:
I stand corrected. ;)
Really? Against the Rams they shut down the Greatest SHow on Turf for 3 1/2 quarters. The Patriots offense scored 13 points in that game while the Pats defense scored 7 points (a Ty Law INY returned for a TD).
Fair enough. All I'm saying is that it became a trend to allow teams back in the game and hoping Brady bailed them out. And I forgot to mention about the Giants in the '07 super bowl, they failed when it mattered most as well. The Pats chewed up tons of clock on their second to last drive when they scored the go-ahead TD.
Why do you insist upon torturing yourself with the dumbest thoughts and beliefs?
Because it's the truth. The Pats will never win another super bowl with Brady with their current scheme and non play-making players.
So....let's adapt the Steelers defense that almost cost them the SB against a 9-7 Cardinals team...a defense that save for a worse opposing defense would be remembered for providing the biggest collapse in Super Bowl history. Let's adopt the defense that WOULD have cost them SB XL but for a completely bogus holding call. Seattle ran up and down the field all game on them.
Okay, adopting an attacking style defense with the Pats offense = super bowl victory.
How about the "#1" Jets defense. The defense that surrendered six 4th quarter leads in 2009 that resulted in losses?
Bad comparison. They had Mark Sanchez at QB. And they did go farther in the playoffs then the Pats, didn't they?

No swagger...well.. like duh. You have rookies and second year players. Anybody remember the dynasty years of the late 1990's?
Just because you're a rookie, doesn't mean you can't feel confident or have swagger. Plenty of 1st and 2nd year guys have that.

It's good to hear from you.
 
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This is an interesting thread. But I would opine that its a MUCH more complex issue. Here are a couple of points to think about on both sides of the issue

1. We would all want our defense to be more effective. Sometimes it looked plain ugly out there, yet somehow, last season, that DEFENSE managed to be the FIFTH best scoring D in the entire NFL. And isn't scoring D the ONLY stat that really counts. Why would BB want to radically change his defensive philosophy when it is clearly still working in a very tough environment.

The whole concept behind "bend but don't break" isn't to rack up great stats, but to keep offenses from scoring points. And while it might be very unsatisfying and frustrating for the fans, the end result is that the Pats have generally been in the top 5 in the all important scoring D, even when languishing in the 20's in a lot of other Defensive stats.

This old fashioned philosophy has resulted in an awful lot of wins over the past decade. I would be a shame just to throw it away simply because it has become "out of fashion".

2. For all its glitz and glamor, the fact is that that Jets Blitzing aggressive, attacking, sexy defense managed exactly ONE more sack that the Pats had last season.

3. OTOH, the league's offense HAS changed a great deal in the last 5 years. The Polian rules/interpretation changes, drastically changed the way offenses attack the field, and how the D can defend it. Though I DO think that the pendulum is swinging back some, but not much...yet.

4. The Jets may not have had a bunch of sacks last season, but they did FORCE teams to adjust to what THEY did as opposed to the other way around. And they did cause a lot more "pressures" than the Pats.

5. The final factor in whether we should see a "different" style of D this season, will be based on the talent on the field.

Playing a more "aggressive" D would make guys like Lewis, Burgess, and Guyton more effective. The talent in the secondary is better and could allow the front 7 to be more aggressive. Also we have some guys in the secondary who could be effective blitzers in their own right.

It is also one of BB's core philosophies that he build his schemes around the players he has, rather than the other way around. If your players are more suited to be aggressive, then he won't keep them from doing what they do best, just to satisfy his ego.

BOTTOM LINE - Will we radically change our defensive philosophy? I don't think so. Why woiuld we? Why radically change what is clearly still working. Could we see a more "aggressive" D this year with more blitzing and/or DLmen one gapping. Absolutely. I think the times require it, and the talent can handle it. BUT....we aren't going to see a wholesale change in the defensive philosophy.
 
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The Patriots were one of the most blitz-happy teams in the NFL last year, so the 'aggression' theory makes no sense, IMO, if that's how your judging it. The ever popular "creativity" is a more likely change, as BB returning to the defense (combined with personnel changes and development) could well lead to more exotic play calling.
 
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Fair enough. All I'm saying is that it became a trend to allow teams back in the game and hoping Brady bailed them out. And I forgot to mention about the Giants in the '07 super bowl, they failed when it mattered most as well. The Pats chewed up tons of clock on their second to last drive when they scored the go-ahead TD.

I can also say the offense wasn't doing enough to help out the defense. The Pats defense held the Rams to 17 points which is quite a feat especially in a dome and the offense could only muster 13 points. Maybe if the offense was more effective, they wouldn't need a Brady comeback. I don't think the Pats defense in that game could have played a much better game other than McGinest not committing a stupid penalty away from the play that negated a Tebucky Jones fumble recovery for a TD that ended up being a Rams' TD the next play. Without that penalty and the Pats are up by 14 points and there is no final drive.

Against Carolina, Vinatieri missed a 31 yard field goal and had a 36 yard field goal blocked. With 18 seconds in the half, Vinatieri muffed a kick off that allowed the Panthers to start their drive on the 47 yard line and were able to kick a field goal after one play. That is 9 points that Vinatieri were responsible for (well the blocked kick could go to the line). Vinatieri doesn't screw up those kicks and the offense doesn't have to "bail out" the defense.

As for the Philly game, the offense struggled and it was the defense giving the offense a short field that allowed them to score. The longest drive for the Pats in that game was for 69 yards and all but one scoring drive came off a strong defensive stand that gave the Pats great field position. BTW, the offense didn't score a single point after 3:49 into the 4th quarter and went three and out on every possession after that. I would argue the defense bailed out the offense since the defense wore down McNabb and his receivers and intercepted him to end the game.

If guess if you didn't watch the Super Bowls and just look at the final drives, you can argue the offense bailed out the defense. But the reality does not support that perception as I clearly point out.
 
This is an interesting thread. But I would opine that its a MUCH more complex issue. Here are a couple of points to think about on both sides of the issue

1. We would all want our defense to be more effective. Sometimes it looked plain ugly out there, yet somehow, last season, that DEFENSE managed to be the FIFTH best scoring D in the entire NFL. And isn't scoring D the ONLY stat that really counts. Why would BB want to radically change his defensive philosophy when it is clearly still working in a very tough environment.

The whole concept behind "bend but don't break" isn't to rack up great stats, but to keep offenses from scoring points. And while it might be very unsatisfying and frustrating for the fans, the end result is that the Pats have generally been in the top 5 in the all important scoring D, even when languishing in the 20's in a lot of other Defensive stats.

This old fashioned philosophy has resulted in an awful lot of wins over the past decade. I would be a shame just to throw it away simply because it has become "out of fashion".

2. For all its glitz and glamor, the fact is that that Jets Blitzing aggressive, attacking, sexy defense managed exactly ONE more sack that the Pats had last season.

3. OTOH, the league's offense HAS changed a great deal in the last 5 years. The Polian rules/interpretation changes, drastically changed the way offenses attack the field, and how the D can defend it. Though I DO think that the pendulum is swinging back some, but not much...yet.

4. The Jets may not have had a bunch of sacks last season, but they did FORCE teams to adjust to what THEY did as opposed to the other way around. And they did cause a lot more "pressures" than the Pats.

5. The final factor in whether we should see a "different" style of D this season, will be based on the talent on the field.

Playing a more "aggressive" D would make guys like Lewis, Burgess, and Guyton more effective. The talent in the secondary is better and could allow the front 7 to be more aggressive. Also we have some guys in the secondary who could be effective blitzers in their own right.

It is also one of BB's core philosophies that he build his schemes around the players he has, rather than the other way around. If your players are more suited to be aggressive, then he won't keep them from doing what they do best, just to satisfy his ego.

BOTTOM LINE - Will we radically change our defensive philosophy? I don't think so. Why woiuld we? Why radically change what is clearly still working. Could we see a more "aggressive" D this year with more blitzing and/or DLmen one gapping. Absolutely. I think the times require it, and the talent can handle it. BUT....we aren't going to see a wholesale change in the defensive philosophy.

Sack totals aren't everything. Just from watching the two teams, the Jets were MUCH more disruptive and adept at getting after the QB than the Pats. I honestly think if the Jets had Cromartie instead of Lito/Lowery last year, they would've given the Colts all they could handle in the AFC Championship game. The only thing that killed them in that game was the lack of a somewhat decent CB opposite Revis.

I think some of those stats are fools gold. If you look at Brady's stats, it looked like he had his second best season of his career in 2009. From watching the games as fans, we know that's not true. Brady was not the same last year after coming of knee surgery and playing through a litany of injuries. He made uncharacteristic mistakes and couldn't seal the deal in some games like he has so many times in the past. The same can be said for the defense. The stats might look pretty good, but from watching the games, there were a lot of issues and problems. Did you ever really trust this defense to get that big stop? It seemed like Belichick certainly didn't, especially against Indy.

The Patriots were one of the most blitz-happy teams in the NFL last year, so the 'aggression' theory makes no sense, IMO, if that's how your judging it. The ever popular "creativity" is a more likely change, as BB returning to the defense (combined with personnel changes and development) could well lead to more exotic play calling.

That article about the blitzing teams just took a tally of how many times teams sent more than 4 rushers. We're talking more about the scheme specifically, 1-gap vs 2-gap. I think a blitzing 1-gap defense is what people are talking about as a more "aggressive" scheme because you have a D-Line trying to penetrate and LB's/safties coming. Even if you are running a blitz out of the 2-gap, it takes longer to develop since the first move of the DL is to engage their blocker and control the gaps on both sides, and then try to get to the QB after they read pass. A one-gapping penetrator is trying to get into the backfield and blow the play up before it can develop from the get go.
 
Sack totals aren't everything. Just from watching the two teams, the Jets were MUCH more disruptive and adept at getting after the QB than the Pats. I honestly think if the Jets had Cromartie instead of Lito/Lowery last year, they would've given the Colts all they could handle in the AFC Championship game. The only thing that killed them in that game was the lack of a somewhat decent CB opposite Revis.

I think some of those stats are fools gold. If you look at Brady's stats, it looked like he had his second best season of his career in 2009. From watching the games as fans, we know that's not true. Brady was not the same last year after coming of knee surgery and playing through a litany of injuries. He made uncharacteristic mistakes and couldn't seal the deal in some games like he has so many times in the past. The same can be said for the defense. The stats might look pretty good, but from watching the games, there were a lot of issues and problems. Did you ever really trust this defense to get that big stop? It seemed like Belichick certainly didn't, especially against Indy.



That article about the blitzing teams just took a tally of how many times teams sent more than 4 rushers. We're talking more about the scheme specifically, 1-gap vs 2-gap. I think a blitzing 1-gap defense is what people are talking about as a more "aggressive" scheme because you have a D-Line trying to penetrate and LB's/safties coming. Even if you are running a blitz out of the 2-gap, it takes longer to develop since the first move of the DL is to engage their blocker and control the gaps on both sides, and then try to get to the QB after they read pass. A one-gapping penetrator is trying to get into the backfield and blow the play up before it can develop from the get go.

fan

You are perfectly correct on Brady 2009. Still, it's vital to remember that ACL's are two year injuries (refer to recent post here on Phillip Rivers). That means 2009 was predictable AND a return on 2003-2007 Brady is NOT inevitable but it's highly plausible.

The Jet's defense was so disruptive they blew SIX 4th quarter leads that resulted in losses. It's funny how many posters refer back to the game in Miami.

Did anyone see how the Jets defense did in Miami?

I am not saying that we don't want to bring more explosive and creative pressure. The problem here is that everyone is deluded with "the pass rush" and "pressure" as if that's the objective.
 
That article about the blitzing teams just took a tally of how many times teams sent more than 4 rushers. We're talking more about the scheme specifically, 1-gap vs 2-gap. I think a blitzing 1-gap defense is what people are talking about as a more "aggressive" scheme because you have a D-Line trying to penetrate and LB's/safties coming. Even if you are running a blitz out of the 2-gap, it takes longer to develop since the first move of the DL is to engage their blocker and control the gaps on both sides, and then try to get to the QB after they read pass. A one-gapping penetrator is trying to get into the backfield and blow the play up before it can develop from the get go.

The Patriots' defensive problems were personnel-based, not schematic in nature. The defense was able to hold teams to the 5th fewest points in the NFL last season, despite having a subpar defensive roster. That's actually a pretty good job being done by the defensive coaching staff.
 
That article about the blitzing teams just took a tally of how many times teams sent more than 4 rushers. We're talking more about the scheme specifically, 1-gap vs 2-gap. I think a blitzing 1-gap defense is what people are talking about as a more "aggressive" scheme because you have a D-Line trying to penetrate and LB's/safties coming. Even if you are running a blitz out of the 2-gap, it takes longer to develop since the first move of the DL is to engage their blocker and control the gaps on both sides, and then try to get to the QB after they read pass. A one-gapping penetrator is trying to get into the backfield and blow the play up before it can develop from the get go.

This is a good point to bring up. However 2-gap has nothing to do with blitz schemes because those schemes are pre-determined, and called in the defensive huddle before the snap. You don't read and react on a stunt or scoop, for example, you just launch at the snap.
 
I remember the Patriots playing attack Defense... Every year Pete Carroll and company coached, we had lots of agressive, blitzing, Defense. Just look at the pile of Lombardi Trophies we have in the Pat's Trophy case, from those memorable, blitzing, Carroll years.

Aggressive Attack Defenses lead to lots of Cheap scores by opponents.

I can only think of 1 Superbowl winner of the past decade that was entirely based on its Defense, blitzing and otherwise. And that was the Ravens. I thought they were more noted for their immovable "Twin Mounds of Pounds", with Tony "Goose" Siragusa and Pat Williams(?).

The Pats Defense was in re-building mode in 2009, playing lots of rookies and second year men, and frankly having some glaring unfilled holes like at Seymour's RDE, Harrison's at SS, Bruschi's at ILB, and Vrabel's at OLB. The Pats Defense will be doing so in 2010, too. Although all of those holes now have a valid candidate, or three, to fill them, now.

Read & React isn't glamorous, but it yielded the 5th fewest points in the League. Just like it has done all decade.

Now that Jabba Wreck's blitzes have been recorded, catalogued, and counters plotted, I predict that Wreck's best Defensive play, and his prized #1 Defense will disappear without it. His whole Defensne won't work as well this season. In fact I guarantee it.

Jabba Wrecks best Defensive play was an agressive rush by RB Thomas Jones led by FB Tony Rchardson through the hole opened by LG Alan Faneca, consuming about 60s econds of the 3600 seconds of the game. And repeated many, many times.

Wrecks wrecked that greatest defensive play by himself, dumping Jones, Richardson and Faneca. And for good measure Leon Washington too.
 
I remember the Patriots playing attack Defense... Every year Pete Carroll and company coached, we had lots of agressive, blitzing, Defense. Just look at the pile of Lombardi Trophies we have in the Pat's Trophy case, from those memorable, blitzing, Carroll years.

Aggressive Attack Defenses lead to lots of Cheap scores by opponents.

I can only think of 1 Superbowl winner of the past decade that was entirely based on its Defense, blitzing and otherwise. And that was the Ravens. I thought they were more noted for their immovable "Twin Mounds of Pounds", with Tony "Goose" Siragusa and Pat Williams(?).

The Pats Defense was in re-building mode in 2009, playing lots of rookies and second year men, and frankly having some glaring unfilled holes like at Seymour's RDE, Harrison's at SS, Bruschi's at ILB, and Vrabel's at OLB. The Pats Defense will be doing so in 2010, too. Although all of those holes now have a valid candidate, or three, to fill them, now.

Read & React isn't glamorous, but it yielded the 5th fewest points in the League. Just like it has done all decade.

Now that Jabba Wreck's blitzes have been recorded, catalogued, and counters plotted, I predict that Wreck's best Defensive play, and his prized #1 Defense will disappear without it. His whole Defensne won't work as well this season. In fact I guarantee it.

Jabba Wrecks best Defensive play was an agressive rush by RB Thomas Jones led by FB Tony Rchardson through the hole opened by LG Alan Faneca, consuming about 60s econds of the 3600 seconds of the game. And repeated many, many times.

Wrecks wrecked that greatest defensive play by himself, dumping Jones, Richardson and Faneca. And for good measure Leon Washington too.

There is a difference between being more aggressive and being an attack, pin your ears back and throw the kitchen sink at the QB offense. The Pats will most likely go for the former rather than the latter.

Besides, the league has changed in the last few years. The running game has become less and less important and the passing game has become more and more important. When offenses change, the defense needs to also. I don't know if past history will transend into the future. Look at the two teams in the Super Bowl last season. Both were offensive powerhouses with great passing attacks (Indy didn't even have a good running game) and with ok defenses.
 
fan

You are perfectly correct on Brady 2009. Still, it's vital to remember that ACL's are two year injuries (refer to recent post here on Phillip Rivers). That means 2009 was predictable AND a return on 2003-2007 Brady is NOT inevitable but it's highly plausible.

The Jet's defense was so disruptive they blew SIX 4th quarter leads that resulted in losses. It's funny how many posters refer back to the game in Miami.

Did anyone see how the Jets defense did in Miami?

I am not saying that we don't want to bring more explosive and creative pressure. The problem here is that everyone is deluded with "the pass rush" and "pressure" as if that's the objective.

I agree that Brady should be closer to his 03-07 form and that ACL injuries are two year injuries. That's why I've been a fan of looking into Shawne Merriman. His value is at an all time low, when healthy he is a dominant pass rusher, and I think he's primed for a big comeback year in his 2nd year back from ACL surgery. But that's neither here nor there.

The Jets blew some leads but they did get better as the season went on, showing improvement and playing big when they needed to. Also, look at what Rex had to work with. I live in NY and saw many of their games. Rhodes was a bum of a safety who was rightly benched at one point because he couldn't cover anyone and was afraid to get his jersey dirty. What did they have at corner besides Revis? Lito? Stickland? Lowery? I think he did a pretty good job considering what he had. I think our overall depth at corner was better than the Jets, and our safeties were definitely better. They basically had Revis and bunch of mediocre guys. It's scary to say, but I think that D will be even better this year with Revis and Cromartie.

Forget the Jets, I'm most concerned with the Patriots. And the fact is that they have struggled mightily to get pressure on the QB in the last couple of years. IMO, there are two ways you can go about trying to resolve this. Go out and get a stud OLB who requires double teams, or explore a change in scheme where you are more aggressive in general. I think the Patriots have the horses at corner now to be able to that.

The Patriots' defensive problems were personnel-based, not schematic in nature. The defense was able to hold teams to the 5th fewest points in the NFL last season, despite having a subpar defensive roster. That's actually a pretty good job being done by the defensive coaching staff.

I think it was a little bit of both. Obviously it's extremely hard to replace the Seymours, Vrabels, Burschis, Harrisons, etc., but I still felt the Patriots defense was way too passive at times. Just because they supposedly sent more than 4 rushers a lot doesn't necessarily mean they were an "aggressive" defense.

Those stats are padded by beating up on bad teams. It's like a baseball player that beats up on #4 and #5 pitchers but can't hit #1 and #2 pitchers well. Usually those players fizzle out in the playoffs and don't make much of an impact. Isn't it a similar case with the Pats? The Pats defense beat up on the teams with subpar/poor offenses like the Titans, Bucs, Bills, Jags, Jets, etc. Then when they had to play the big boys like the Colts, Saints, Ravens, etc., they were really nowhere to be found. The Saints absolutely blew their doors off, giving up 27 points to the Ravens at him is way too many, and BB went for it on 4th and 2 because, in all honesty, he didn't trust his defense to get the stop they needed. The blowout in the playoffs was the fault of the offense and the defense with the turnovers virtually putting the defense in a no-win situation, but you can't get gashed for 80 yards on the first play of the game. That set the tone.

Let's say we had beaten Baltimore. Did you honestly have that much confidence in this team to go into SD and be able to shut down that offense?

Personnel definitely played a role, but scheme did too.

This is a good point to bring up. However 2-gap has nothing to do with blitz schemes because those schemes are pre-determined, and called in the defensive huddle before the snap. You don't read and react on a stunt or scoop, for example, you just launch at the snap.

My mistake. It just seems that when the Patriots bring an extra rusher they do the same thing way too often. They have their 3 big lineman try to tie up a bunch of offensive lineman, which frees up two guys on the outside with one on one matchups. But these guys weren't even able to win those one on one matchups most of the time. That's where if you have a stud OLB like Ware or Merriman when he was healthy, you can win those one on one matchups a good chunk of the time and force them to double you, which, in turn, opens things up for the other guys.

Since the Pats don't have one of those types of guys, I think they need to rely on more penetration and stunting with the DL for when they aren't blitzing. I like the idea of trying to get into the backfield and blowing the play up before it even has time to develop. It's more effective, especially on a passing play, than having to first engage your blocker, read pass, and then try to get to the QB. And it obviously works pretty well against the run too with the way the Ravens had been so good against the run with Rex's scheme. No RB had a 100+ yard game on them for a few years. Pretty ridiculous.
 
I think it was a little bit of both. Obviously it's extremely hard to replace the Seymours, Vrabels, Burschis, Harrisons, etc., but I still felt the Patriots defense was way too passive at times. Just because they supposedly sent more than 4 rushers a lot doesn't necessarily mean they were an "aggressive" defense.

Most people who aren't really looking at what's happening think their favorite team is being too passive. It's the way of things. People who aren't really focused on the play miss the subtleties. The same thing happens in basketball and hockey. One can be aggressive while playing in a 2-gap system. It's simply that the aggression is channeled differently.

Those stats are padded by beating up on bad teams. It's like a baseball player that beats up on #4 and #5 pitchers but can't hit #1 and #2 pitchers well. Usually those players fizzle out in the playoffs and don't make much of an impact. Isn't it a similar case with the Pats? The Pats defense beat up on the teams with subpar/poor offenses like the Titans, Bucs, Bills, Jags, Jets, etc. Then when they had to play the big boys like the Colts, Saints, Ravens, etc., they were really nowhere to be found. The Saints absolutely blew their doors off, giving up 27 points to the Ravens at him is way too many, and BB went for it on 4th and 2 because, in all honesty, he didn't trust his defense to get the stop they needed. The blowout in the playoffs was the fault of the offense and the defense with the turnovers virtually putting the defense in a no-win situation, but you can't get gashed for 80 yards on the first play of the game. That set the tone.

You are absolutely correct here, which is my point about personnel rather than scheme. When personnel sucks ass, scheme can still get you wins against inferior opponents. Once you start playing the big boys, though, lack of talent gets exposed. It wasn't scheme that had players falling down and running into each other. It was players and their inability to execute.

Let's say we had beaten Baltimore. Did you honestly have that much confidence in this team to go into SD and be able to shut down that offense?

You've got the wrong guy here. I was talking about the team pissing away the season pretty much from the moment of the Seymour trade. Again, though, that was about personnel, not scheme.

Personnel definitely played a role, but scheme did too.

Is it possible that Pees failed to maximize the abilities of the players? Sure.

Is it possible that BB's help (and he was clearly working with the defense) was insufficient in its attempt to maximize the abilities of the players? Sure.

However, given that Pees had been able to get pretty good play out of the defenses before, and given that BB is arguably the best defensive coach in the history of the game, isn't it more likely that the biggest problem was simply that losing players like Bruschi, Vrabel, Seymour, Seau and Harrison, and Mayo coming down with an injury, left the cupboard pretty bare, since the replacements were lesser players and/or rookies facing the expected learning curve?
 
You couldn't be any more wrong. In Madden 11, Brandon Meriweather has 89 swagger! Spikes has 88! And to complement them, both Hernandez and Cunningham have 85 swagger. How's that sound? :rocker:
Sounds pretty dumb to me.

Braylon Edwards sits on the bench between plays, checks out Madden, and becomes fearful of going over the middle? "Ooo, watch out, Santonio. Meriweather's Madden Swagger is 89! Maybe you better not run that in-cut."

BB: "Sorry, Jerod. I know you've started every game you've played in for us, and you do a good job, but your Madden Swagger is lower than Spikes, so you will be inactive for the rest of they year."
 
As for the Giants' Super Bowl, the defense failed the last drive, but that was a total team effort.
When you only score 14 points, it's hard to blame the defense.

It wasn't the defense or defensive coordinator who made zero in-game or second-half adjustments, abandoned the running game, and did't use any screens to slow the pass rush.
 
seymour, was replaced by green,

tedy bruschi, was replaced by guyton,

vrabel, was replaced by burgess,

harrison, was replaced by mcgowan,

hobbs, was replaced by a rookie.


i think they did ok for with they had to work with. the only one knock i have is on the front office for not drafting any OLB's other then crable, who they have put on IR for the last 2 years and woods who is a ST player.


Clay Matthews, Connor Barwin, and tully banta-cain, sounds a lot better then.

Derrick Burgess, Rob Ninkovich, and tully banta-cain, but oh will i still have hope for crable, and i wanna see with Cunningham, can do
 
When you only score 14 points, it's hard to blame the defense.

It wasn't the defense or defensive coordinator who made zero in-game or second-half adjustments, abandoned the running game, and did't use any screens to slow the pass rush.

And it wasn't the Pats offense or offensive coordinator who did that either. The Pats did make offensive adjustment and they did run screens. People need to stop believing the BS rumor that McDaniels refused to change the gameplan one bit. The Pats were out played and outcoached and it wasn't just the offense's fault and especially not all McDaniels' fault.
 
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