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Don't put Parcells in the Patriots Hall of Fame.


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Yet the game was nevertheless competitive.

Triple the carries given to Martin. Put a muzzle on Eason. Number 11. I mean, Drew.

Now, beyond that, do the f*cking obvious and do not let Adam under any circumstances kick off to Howard and...the NFC's dominance ends only one year earlier than it did.

It was incredible how they went completely one dimensional in that 4th quarter. Literally. With Max Lane “protecting” Drew they ran just two times in the 4th quarter. No wonder the Packers teed off on Bledsoe like they did.

It was like Parcells didn’t give a crap he just wanted to finish off the game and get out of town.
 
No coach should go in the NEP HOF until Chuck Fairbanks goes in first...
Thank you for rescuing Mack from the CFL and giving him a chance
football-new-england-patriots-mack-herron-and-head-coach-chuck-on-picture-id154230720

...Oh, and this kid, too
subFAIRBANKS-obit-articleLarge.jpg
 
There were 4 major steps from mediocrity to dynasty

1) Kraft purchasing the stadium lease at auction
2) Orthwein hiring Parcells
3) Kraft purchasing the team
4) Kraft hiring Belichick as coach


Belichick:

1) Chooses to coach in New England
2) Hires Rehbein and sends him to scout at Michigan
3) Drafts Tom Brady
4) Keeps Brady on roster carrying four quarterbacks
5) Keeps Brady as starter when Bledsoe is recovered

#5 is the critical element and difference between Raymond Berry and Bill Belichick

Berry keeps Eason/Bledsoe/Whoever, team loses, fails to make playoffs, is mired in mediocrity while Flutie wins MVP's & titles and sets records elsewhere
My fix on it/Thanks for getting it started
 
Joke of a coach who wouldn't have won **** without Belichick. Was on the phone to the Jets before our Super Bowl against Green Bay. Played Hasan Graham instead of Troy Brown.

Other than being fortunate enough to have the greatest coach of all time as his DC his only other claims to fame are being a douche to his quarterbacks and making a lot of acerbic comments in press conferences.
It took me many years to appreciate Parcells' definite ability to motivate, and his contribution to the Patriots. He indeed brought instant credibility, and Belichick teams have inherited and carried on the legacy of focus on the game, the fundamentals and teamwork which has not been duplicated by any other coach/system in the last forty years.

You are right. He does not belong in the team Hall of Fame. Because he does not deserve it.

And there are a hundred other men who do.

Inducting Houston Antwine twenty years later than he should have been, after he died, is disgusting and a more permanent embarrassment to the franchise than the flying elvis [Kraft's fault].

Failing to induct Julius Adams, also decades after he should have been and after his death, while maybe equally but not more deserving players like Tedy Bruschi are inducted in their first year of eligibility is a total disgrace [also Kraft's fault. He's the f*cking owner. He inducted Billy Sullivan. He could induct Christian Peter if he wanted].
 
Personally, I give Bledsoe the majority of credit for righting the NE ship. Fat Tuna certainly added some gravitas but Drew’s arm lifted the franchise out of plodding mediocrity and into the era of aerial-assault offensive football.... a must see experience.
I will always refer to Gillette Stadium as The House That Drew Built
I am happy you were able to enjoy the...resurgence, not the initiation...of good football here locally.
 
Yet the game was nevertheless competitive.

Triple the carries given to Martin. Put a muzzle on Eason. Number 11. I mean, Drew.

Now, beyond that, do the f*cking obvious and do not let Adam under any circumstances kick off to Howard and...the NFC's dominance ends only one year earlier than it did.
That's quite a stretch..... if you change a couple plays, you can figure out a way to tie the game. If I change a couple plays, it's GB in a rout.

The better team won. Nothing to be ashamed of in there.
 
Bledsoe choked and thats why he never won 5hit.
Drew, like Tony Eason, is a very nice person. He simply wasn't that good.

May we please finally, mercifully, permanently debunk and dispose of one of the many great propagated myths in New England Patriots history?

"I will always refer to Gillette Stadium as The House That Drew Built"

:rolleyes:

WHO
Proof.ashx


OMG stop it. Stop. Inducting Bledsoe, and others, into the team HOF ahead of Julius Adams is a disgrace.

Drew Bledsoe, like Tony Eason, was a very good college quarterback, drafted in the first round, wore #11, who threw the ball for completions and picks, and got sacked a lot and at crucial moments. He got paid a ton of money, he showed up, tried hard, with no competition (until 2001) and did win some games for us.

While Eason is at most a barely competent NFL backup, Steve Grogan and Doug Flutie are exceptional quarterbacks who do not have Super Bowl rings due to the corruption, ignorance, stupidity and bumbling of officials, coaches and owners through the years.

Just as Bledsoe is at most a capable NFL starter, while Tom Brady is a first ballot Hall of Famer.

A young, unheralded quarterback drafted in the late rounds led a disrespected Patriots team which had lost eleven games in his rookie year to eleven wins in his second season, qualifying for the post season and a divisional round game against the Oakland Raiders. He put New England on the football map and established the Patriots as perennial contenders for the world championship, playing well over a decade longer. TB12? No.

His name, of course, is Steve Grogan.

"The New England Patriots established themselves as perennial contenders for the world championship in the modern era of pro football from their home in Foxborough built by Steve Grogan."

Gillette Stadium - CMGI Field - was built by Robert Kraft with help from Roger Goodell, the lackey Paul "The Patriots Damaged The League" Tagliabue sent here to broker a truce/agreement with the commonwealth legislature, in time for Kraft to back out of the Hartford deal.

Kraft likes to promote delusions like the flying elvis and enemy colored silver helmets and blue jerseys as 'traditional' ['traditionally wrong, stupid, insulting and idiotic'?] and putting Bledsoe in the same class as Ted Williams, Bill Russell and Larry Bird.

Like putting Eason in the same class as Bobby Orr, David Ortiz and John Havlicek.
 
Then I am correct about 19 other NFL teams being worse pathetic laughingstocks because they were worse than that and for much longer periods of time.

The New England Patriots of 2002-2005 are a pathetic laughingstock as well if Brady is benched mid season in '01 and then released.
????

They were a joke. Wtf is the debate?
 
Like I said.

Watch the game again like I just did and watch Parcells. Not a man who wanted to lose.
This is so typical of the Parcells apologists. Give Parcells the credit when they win, and blame the players when they lost.

One of the first things that usually comes out of Bellichick's mouth when the team has lost any game, but ESPECIALLY big games, was something to the effect that "we need to coach the team better" and to compliment the opponent.

Not you. In one post you blame Bledsoe (BTW, 2 of those picks came late in the game when they were down 2 scores and needed to score quickly). In another its Martin. Your Parcells' boot licking is sad. It reminds me of his bootlicking media friends, who keep pushing this fraudulent nomination either as a nod to a guy who made their lives easy for 4 years or a slam to the more successful guy who has made their lives hard for 20.

For the entirety of his career Parcells MIGHT be a HOF HC. For the time he was in NE, he was NOT!!!!!!! The fact is that Parcells was a master BUILDER of teams, he was NOT a MAINTAINER of teams. His MO was to go to a team who had had a few bad years, then parlay that team during the building process into a team with top notch talent....and then move on when the "message" starting to fade.

He had 2 other great skills, imo. He was very good at finding good assistants and letting them do their thing. He had a lot of good assistants from his Giants days do good things, beyond BB. The other thing he was REALLY very good at was giving a good press conference. Like I alluded to up top, he was GREAT with the media and made their jobs easy by being entertaining and giving them lots of story lines. They in turn have shown their loyalty by CONTINUALLY nominating him and pushing for his entry into the Pats HOF, despite the fact that the fans have just as continually (and rightfully so) kept him OUT!

Here's the thing. The MYTH of Bill Parcells and his apologists is that after years of wandering in the desert, Parcells, like Moses, wandered into town and led this moribund franchise into the Promise Land.

Well the fact is that the Pats have enjoyed periods of success in EVERY decade of their existence. Even in the 60's they had a run at the AFC championship. In the 70's they had a few good teams and would have had more if the Sullivans hadn't run Chuck Fairbanks out of town. They had good teams in the 80's under Ray Berry. AND they had a couple of good years under Parcells, but that is what all they were.....a couple of good years.

AND we should NEVER forget how he left town. NEVER! It was as shameful a departure as I could think of. It belongs in the same realm as Bobby Patrino's horrific end in Atlanta. My Patriot fandom will survive Tom Brady's departure, but I'm not sure it will survive the admittance to Bill Parcells to the Pats HOF.
 
This is so typical of the Parcells apologists. Give Parcells the credit when they win, and blame the players when they lost.

One of the first things that usually comes out of Bellichick's mouth when the team has lost any game, but ESPECIALLY big games, was something to the effect that "we need to coach the team better" and to compliment the opponent.

Not you. In one post you blame Bledsoe (BTW, 2 of those picks came late in the game when they were down 2 scores and needed to score quickly). In another its Martin. Your Parcells' boot licking is sad. It reminds me of his bootlicking media friends, who keep pushing this fraudulent nomination either as a nod to a guy who made their lives easy for 4 years or a slam to the more successful guy who has made their lives hard for 20.

For the entirety of his career Parcells MIGHT be a HOF HC. For the time he was in NE, he was NOT!!!!!!! The fact is that Parcells was a master BUILDER of teams, he was NOT a MAINTAINER of teams. His MO was to go to a team who had had a few bad years, then parlay that team during the building process into a team with top notch talent....and then move on when the "message" starting to fade.

He had 2 other great skills, imo. He was very good at finding good assistants and letting them do their thing. He had a lot of good assistants from his Giants days do good things, beyond BB. The other thing he was REALLY very good at was giving a good press conference. Like I alluded to up top, he was GREAT with the media and made their jobs easy by being entertaining and giving them lots of story lines. They in turn have shown their loyalty by CONTINUALLY nominating him and pushing for his entry into the Pats HOF, despite the fact that the fans have just as continually (and rightfully so) kept him OUT!

Here's the thing. The MYTH of Bill Parcells and his apologists is that after years of wandering in the desert, Parcells, like Moses, wandered into town and led this moribund franchise into the Promise Land.

Well the fact is that the Pats have enjoyed periods of success in EVERY decade of their existence. Even in the 60's they had a run at the AFC championship. In the 70's they had a few good teams and would have had more if the Sullivans hadn't run Chuck Fairbanks out of town. They had good teams in the 80's under Ray Berry. AND they had a couple of good years under Parcells, but that is what all they were.....a couple of good years.

AND we should NEVER forget how he left town. NEVER! It was as shameful a departure as I could think of. It belongs in the same realm as Bobby Patrino's horrific end in Atlanta. My Patriot fandom will survive Tom Brady's departure, but I'm not sure it will survive the admittance to Bill Parcells to the Pats HOF.

If McDonough was right that Parcells told Kraft "I will never win a Super Bowl for you" during Super Bowl week that is an immediate disqualifier.
 
Drew, like Tony Eason, is a very nice person. He simply wasn't that good.

May we please finally, mercifully, permanently debunk and dispose of one of the many great propagated myths in New England Patriots history?

"I will always refer to Gillette Stadium as The House That Drew Built"

:rolleyes:

WHO
Proof.ashx


OMG stop it. Stop. Inducting Bledsoe, and others, into the team HOF ahead of Julius Adams is a disgrace.

Drew Bledsoe, like Tony Eason, was a very good college quarterback, drafted in the first round, wore #11, who threw the ball for completions and picks, and got sacked a lot and at crucial moments. He got paid a ton of money, he showed up, tried hard, with no competition (until 2001) and did win some games for us.

While Eason is at most a barely competent NFL backup, Steve Grogan and Doug Flutie are exceptional quarterbacks who do not have Super Bowl rings due to the corruption, ignorance, stupidity and bumbling of officials, coaches and owners through the years.

Just as Bledsoe is at most a capable NFL starter, while Tom Brady is a first ballot Hall of Famer.

A young, unheralded quarterback drafted in the late rounds led a disrespected Patriots team which had lost eleven games in his rookie year to eleven wins in his second season, qualifying for the post season and a divisional round game against the Oakland Raiders. He put New England on the football map and established the Patriots as perennial contenders for the world championship, playing well over a decade longer. TB12? No.

His name, of course, is Steve Grogan.

"The New England Patriots established themselves as perennial contenders for the world championship in the modern era of pro football from their home in Foxborough built by Steve Grogan."

Gillette Stadium - CMGI Field - was built by Robert Kraft with help from Roger Goodell, the lackey Paul "The Patriots Damaged The League" Tagliabue sent here to broker a truce/agreement with the commonwealth legislature, in time for Kraft to back out of the Hartford deal.

Kraft likes to promote delusions like the flying elvis and enemy colored silver helmets and blue jerseys as 'traditional' ['traditionally wrong, stupid, insulting and idiotic'?] and putting Bledsoe in the same class as Ted Williams, Bill Russell and Larry Bird.

Like putting Eason in the same class as Bobby Orr, David Ortiz and John Havlicek.
Actually Eason was a good QB who lacked a key ingredient of a GREAT one. He wasn't physically tough. Now understand ANYONE who plays football enough that he can get to the NFL is physically tough by most standards. That should go without saying. But for the better part of the last 50 years the Pats were led by EXTREMELY tough QB's in Grogan, Bledsoe, and Brady.

If you look at Eason's record you could see the talent, but but in his first full season he was sacked 59 times in just 13 games. Brady only had 2 years during his 20 when he had 40 over 16 game season (01 and 13) They just beat the sh!t out that kid in 84 and did a pretty good job of it in 86 with 44.

By the time he left the Pats he was a shadow of the guy they drafted. But the fact is that our lasting remembrance of Tony Eason is him curled in a ball at the feet of a relentless Bears pass rush, instead of the QB who led the team through 3 very tough games to get the team to NO.

In the end Tony Eason was never as good as w hoped he would be, but not as bad he is perceived. I often wonder about how so called QB busts like David Carr would have faired if they hadn't been fed to the dogs their first few years
 
That defensive plan for the Green Bay game was fantastic. The team was just young, Milloy made a rookie blunder with Clay making a veteran mistake letting them back in the game. Add in the special teams blunder and that was it. Take away those two plays and they win the game despite giving up 5 sacks and 4 ints. Certainly a winnable game with some weird circumstances. That game still intriques me.

Parcells a Pats hofer? He brought his brand which helped but he also brought a lot of baggage and left in one of the worst ways a hall of fame head coach ever could. To this day I love BB’s napkin resignation as the ultimate touche to that fiasco. 6 superbowls later.
 
If you think the NEP from 1990 to 1992 weren't a pathetic laughingstock you would be wrong.
Patriots record '90-'92:...... 9-39
49ers record '77-'79: ...........9-39
Giants record '73-'75: .........9-32
Steelers record '68-'70: ......8-33-1
Cowboys record '88-'90: ....11-37
Redskins record '59-'61: .....5-30
Packers record '56-'58: .......8-27-1
Browns record '15-'17: .........4-44
Jets record '75-'77: ..............9-33
Jets record '94-'96: .............10-38
Bills record '69-'71: .............8-33-1
Bills record '84-'86: ............8-40
Colts record '81-'83: ...........9-31-1
Bengals record '92-'94: ......11-37
Raiders record '05-'07: ......10-38
Broncos record '63-'65: ......8-32-2
Chargers record '73-'75: .....9-32-1
Lions record '08-'10: ..........8-40
 
I agree, but man looking back at his drafts reminds me what picking high can be like:

1993: Bledsoe, Chris Slade
1994: Willie McGinest
1995: Ty Law, Curtis Martin, Ted Johnson
1996: Lawyer Milloy, Tedy Bruschi, Terry Glenn
For some reason, on Patsfans, the success of « how many pro bowlers you drafted » is more important than how many SBs you’ve won.
 
This is so typical of the Parcells apologists. Give Parcells the credit when they win, and blame the players when they lost.

One of the first things that usually comes out of Bellichick's mouth when the team has lost any game, but ESPECIALLY big games, was something to the effect that "we need to coach the team better" and to compliment the opponent.

Not you. In one post you blame Bledsoe (BTW, 2 of those picks came late in the game when they were down 2 scores and needed to score quickly). In another its Martin. Your Parcells' boot licking is sad. It reminds me of his bootlicking media friends, who keep pushing this fraudulent nomination either as a nod to a guy who made their lives easy for 4 years or a slam to the more successful guy who has made their lives hard for 20.

For the entirety of his career Parcells MIGHT be a HOF HC. For the time he was in NE, he was NOT!!!!!!! The fact is that Parcells was a master BUILDER of teams, he was NOT a MAINTAINER of teams. His MO was to go to a team who had had a few bad years, then parlay that team during the building process into a team with top notch talent....and then move on when the "message" starting to fade.

He had 2 other great skills, imo. He was very good at finding good assistants and letting them do their thing. He had a lot of good assistants from his Giants days do good things, beyond BB. The other thing he was REALLY very good at was giving a good press conference. Like I alluded to up top, he was GREAT with the media and made their jobs easy by being entertaining and giving them lots of story lines. They in turn have shown their loyalty by CONTINUALLY nominating him and pushing for his entry into the Pats HOF, despite the fact that the fans have just as continually (and rightfully so) kept him OUT!

Here's the thing. The MYTH of Bill Parcells and his apologists is that after years of wandering in the desert, Parcells, like Moses, wandered into town and led this moribund franchise into the Promise Land.

Well the fact is that the Pats have enjoyed periods of success in EVERY decade of their existence. Even in the 60's they had a run at the AFC championship. In the 70's they had a few good teams and would have had more if the Sullivans hadn't run Chuck Fairbanks out of town. They had good teams in the 80's under Ray Berry. AND they had a couple of good years under Parcells, but that is what all they were.....a couple of good years.

AND we should NEVER forget how he left town. NEVER! It was as shameful a departure as I could think of. It belongs in the same realm as Bobby Patrino's horrific end in Atlanta. My Patriot fandom will survive Tom Brady's departure, but I'm not sure it will survive the admittance to Bill Parcells to the Pats HOF.

Too funny.

You dont win football games with 4 INTs.

So, IF Bledsoe throws 2 late TDs in lieu of 2 late INTS and NE comes back and wins the Super Bowl, Bledsoe is your HERO. He won the game. Though, through your twisted logic, because Bledsoe threw 2 more late INTS, Parcells LOST the game. The INTs dont matter. In fact, none of the 4 INTs really count in your world of foolish nonsense. You actually have no leg to stand on in reality. Bledsoe was shipped out of town.

In regards to Martin. 11 carries for 42 yards. Damn Parcells should have run the ball MORE. Martins longest run was 18 yards meaning that he had 10 carries for 24 yards which equated to 2.4 yards a carry. Stupid Parcells, Martin was tearing up the Packers and doesnt he know when youre down by a couple of scores that you dont pass to get back in it , but you stick with your 2.4 yac RB?

Another BS response from you. Blaming Parcells for Bledsoe and Martin choking.
 
Too funny.

You dont win football games with 4 INTs.

So, IF Bledsoe throws 2 late TDs in lieu of 2 late INTS and NE comes back and wins the Super Bowl, Bledsoe is your HERO. He won the game. Though, through your twisted logic, because Bledsoe threw 2 more late INTS, Parcells LOST the game. The INTs dont matter. In fact, none of the 4 INTs really count in your world of foolish nonsense. You actually have no leg to stand on in reality. Bledsoe was shipped out of town.

In regards to Martin. 11 carries for 42 yards. Damn Parcells should have run the ball MORE. Martins longest run was 18 yards meaning that he had 10 carries for 24 yards which equated to 2.4 yards a carry. Stupid Parcells, Martin was tearing up the Packers and doesnt he know when youre down by a couple of scores that you dont pass to get back in it , but you stick with your 2.4 yac RB?

Another BS response from you. Blaming Parcells for Bledsoe and Martin choking.

11 carries is not Martín choking, They ran twice the entire 4th quarter. Twice. And they were down by 2 scores not 4. It’s like Parcells didn’t care anymore.

How would the Pats do if Brady was asked to throw only 15 times in a Super Bowl.
 
He did some good things, but I’d rather see a guy like Deion Branch in.

People are furious at BB for the Butler thing but, Parcells took a new job during Super Bowl week.
 
What disqualifies Parcells from being worthy is obvious.

Berry was outstanding with one, horrible, terrible exception:

Starting and playing Eason in Super Bowl XX. And a year later in Denver. And in 1988 in Week 15.

The big black (sorry) mark for Holovak is described by @jmt57 :


Walter Beach was drafted by the Giants in 1960, then signed with the Patriots early in their inaugural season. He played in 18 games for the Pats with one interception. Beach also played a bit on offense (with nine receptions and six carries) and on special teams (seven kickoff returns and one punt return). Beach had one touchdown with the Pats, a 51 yard reception from Butch Songin against the Chargers. Walter Beach also spent four seasons with the Cleveland Browns and was a starting corner on that team's last NFL championship, in 1964.

Beach grew up two houses from a civil rights lawyer named Milton Henry and his family. Fast forward a bit, to a 1962 preseason game in New Orleans that led to the Patriots cutting Beach:

He had been released by the Boston Patriots of the American Football League the previous year, after he organized a protest by the black players on the team against segregated accommodations in New Orleans, where Boston was scheduled to play a preseason game. While the white Patriots were set to stay in a luxury hotel, the black players were to stay with black families.

“I told them we signed up to play football, not to be segregated against,” Beach said. He told Mike Holovak, the Patriots’ coach at the time, that he would fly down the day of the game and then fly back to Boston after the game was over.

Identified as a troublemaker, Beach was cut the next day.
I didn't know that. Do we know that Holovak was the one to make the decision?
 
Branch and Seymour shot their way out of NE in messy divorces. Branch refused to come to training camp.

Great guys. Put them in the NEHOF!

Bob Kraft committed Cardinal sin # 1 and meddled in the draft and Football operations like a mini Jerry Jones. Parcells had every right to be angry and want out.
 
I didn't know that. Do we know that Holovak was the one to make the decision?

If that's true, then fook holovak.
But most definitely, fook parcells.
Ain't no way, shape or form that ******* gets the privilege of the Patriots Hall of Fame.
What he did was 10x worse than what Kraft did to Brady.
 
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