Kraft Orchids Case - Prosecuters Want a Tug Rule?

IcyPatriot said:

Click to expand...

I dunno about that, but I'd put it at even money that the chief of police in Jupiter is a Dolphins fan, as it's a mere two hour drive to Miami.

I am willing to bet after they ID'd Kraft, they were all dancing that they wee gonna take down the empire all by themselves.

VectorPrime said:

All Kraft has to do is admit fault, say some things about dealing with demons and having an incredibly regretful lapse of judgement, and apologize with a donation to some charity and this basically all goes away within a week. But he’s not going to because at the end of the day he’s a rich sociopath and he’s going to end up dragging both his name and the reputation of the entire organization through the mud in a completely doomed attempt to salvage his reputation. And in effect he’ll destroy himself. And the fans which he professes to love will suffer.

Click to expand...

Sad but true. I wish he'd chosen another hill to die on, like the one in 2015... but... this is his bed, he made it, he gets to lie in it. I just hope he doesn't decide to drag the entire organization down with him.

Jonathan is ready, Bob. If you're exonerated he can reinstate you, but for the moment, you're adding a lot of dead weight to the organization and you need to stand aside until this is behind you.

I'm having the most trouble with he showed his license and returned the next day.

Bob ... this is not how you became rich ... that being doing dumb sh!t.

KDPPatsfan85 said:

Kraft will most likely be fined a couple million and suspended for 8 games.

Click to expand...

Holy crap, and your basing this on what?

I just heard the sheriff on this case in an interview with NPR. He calls the men involved monsters. He says they are more culpable in all of this then the traffickers them selves. He says he does not believe that any talk of not knowing what was happening. He wonders why women would continue to live unguarded in such terrible conditions. These women live in the massage parlor 24 hours a day and 7days a week. They slept on the very tables on which they conducted there sexual acts. It’s just sad.

Charlotte Pats Fan said:

Holy crap, and your basing this on what?

Click to expand...

actually that's pretty mild under the circumstances.

Besides, it's the informal punishments that are really gonna hurt Kraft here, not the formal ones. NFL rulings come and go and can be survived and fought against, just ask Al Davis. But the informal sanction could be pretty stiff here, because Kraft was something of a patron saint of NFL owners so this damages the reputation at least indirectly of every NFL owner. Something tells me he won't be leading committees or sitting at the head of the table anymore. His reputation in the room was something he was willing to throw the best thing that ever happened to him under the bus to preserve, and that's gone now, or at least sharply diminished, because other owners don't want to be caught in the blast radius.

This is the big reason why I really want him to hand the team off to Jonathan now, and make sure his franchise is as clear of this mess as they can be and because that's the best way I know of to make sure the Patriots continue to have a strong voice on the Board. I don't think he'll do it, but it is the right move.

Simpelton said:

In my opinion what Kraft did is no worse than what, say, Jerry Richardson did. Just for an example. A very pertinent example. A very pertinent example that casts a long shadow over this exact situation.

Click to expand...

Richardson engaged in a continuous pattern of racism and sexual harassment towards his employees in an NFL front office, your example is not pertinent in the least.

How f*cking stupid is Bob Kraft? Unf”ckinbelievable?

ChrisR2223 said:

Robert Kraft be like

Click to expand...

VectorPrime said:

All Kraft has to do is admit fault, say some things about dealing with demons and having an incredibly regretful lapse of judgement, and apologize with a donation to some charity and this basically all goes away within a week. But he’s not going to because at the end of the day he’s a rich sociopath and he’s going to end up dragging both his name and the reputation of the entire organization through the mud in a completely doomed attempt to salvage his reputation. And in effect he’ll destroy himself. And the fans which he professes to love will suffer.

Click to expand...

He can blame Alcohol we all hear him drunk when the mics in his face.

PittPatriot said:

I just heard the sheriff on this case in an interview with NPR. He calls the men involved monsters. He says they are more culpable in all of this then the traffickers them selves. He says he does not believe that any talk of not knowing what was happening. He wonders why women would continue to live unguarded in such terrible conditions. These women live in the massage parlor 24 hours a day and 7days a week. They slept on the very tables on which they conducted there sexual acts. It’s just sad.

Click to expand...

That is terrible.

PatsDeb said:

No, it's sad and pathetic that an older man who is widowed and already has a much younger GF as far as we know would seek THAT kind of sexual/female company (sleazy "massage" parlor) in his "HEY LOOK AT ME!!" Bentley. I don't think it's harsh at all to call him a foolish, dirty old man. The shoe fits.

Click to expand...

So why are "massage" parlors sleazy in your mind, but presumably a high-end escort service isn't? What's the distinction you're making? I'd hope it isn't based on the type of women who are involved.

IcyPatriot said:

I'm having the most trouble with he showed his license and returned the next day.

Bob ... this is not how you became rich ... that being doing dumb sh!t.

Click to expand...

Dementia.
Honestly can't rule it out
Bobby is suffering from dementia and trying to be young and dumb again it's sad.
He's killing his wife's Memory.

Practicing pagan/occultist? Lol...you suck at life.

robertweathers said:

Without Kraft none of this happens.

Click to expand...

Overwhelming percentage of the credit goes to Tom and Bill.

Simpelton said:

(Why do I get the sense that some of the people defending Kraft are actually projecting something onto Kraft that has to do with themselves?)

Click to expand...

Funny, I feel the same way about the pearl-clutchers. It is like when people are cheating on their significant other, they constantly make cheating accusations. People are projecting thier own unprocessed guilt onto Kraft.

I will stick with "a 77 year old guy got a quick * from someone he paid" (who also, reportedly, left NO DOUBT that she was over the age of consent). Accusing him of sex trafficking or anything else is just a huge leap and fallacy.

dreighver said:

So why are "massage" parlors sleazy in your mind, but presumably a high-end escort service isn't? What's the distinction you're making? I'd hope it isn't based on the type of women who are involved.

Click to expand...

Maybe that one Woman is a highly paid woman who is professional and works in and lives in top conditions and isn't living in filth and paid pennies to pleasure old senior citizens?
I've never been with a professional so O dunno

He’s hired the lawyer who represented Jefferey Epstein.

He’s really going to wreck this entire organizations reputation in a desperate attempt to save his own when literally no one will think he’s clean even if he gets off on some innane technicality.

**** him. Jonathan get your dad ruled mentally incompetent. Please.

TommyBrady12 said:

Overwhelming percentage of the credit goes to Tom and Bill.

Click to expand...

This. This so so much. Robert got lucky he chose BB instead of the other options he outlines in « the Two Bills » doc.

ChrisR2223 said:

Maybe that one Woman is a highly paid woman who is professional and works in and lives in top conditions and isn't living in filth and paid pennies to pleasure old senior citizens?
I've never been with a professional so O dunno

Click to expand...

PatsDeb said:

No, it's sad and pathetic that an older man who is widowed and already has a much younger GF as far as we know would seek THAT kind of sexual/female company (sleazy "massage" parlor) in his "HEY LOOK AT ME!!" Bentley. I don't think it's harsh at all to call him a foolish, dirty old man. The shoe fits.

Click to expand...

That makes perfect sense, but how is Kraft to realize the distinction?

It seems that many here find it hard to believe that Kraft was unaware of the working conditions of this massage spa he attended.

That would make sense that if Kraft was well-aware of the ins-and-outs of prostitution -- presumably he'd also be aware of which establishments are sleazy and which are not. Presumably this awareness would come from frequenting these establishments. The idea that this was the first time he solicited and was genuinely ignorant to the working conditions of these places doesn't seem far-fetched. Who knows if that is actually the case.

I think it's perfectly reasonable that he was innocently ignorant of these conditions, but then again I've never solicited a prostitute, nor have I conducted any thorough research on these establishments. So, with that in mind, perhaps Kraft should have been aware and I am wrong.

Regardless of Kraft's awareness and intentions, what is extremely clear from this discussion is that we need to promote greater societal awareness about human trafficking and forced labor (sexual or otherwise). I've gained a greater awareness from reading this thread which I didn't have prior to this Kraft incident.

VectorPrime said:

He’s hired the lawyer who represented Jefferey Epstein.

He’s really going to wreck this entire organizations reputation in a desperate attempt to save his own when literally no one will think he’s clean even if he gets off on some innane technicality.

**** him. Jonathan get your dad ruled mentally incompetent. Please.

Click to expand...

I think he’s been going to this parlour for a while and that’s why he’s freaked out about the larger implications.