RB's in the draft

[Off The Grid]

Darren McFadden
Rashard Mendenhall
Felix Jones
Chris Johnson

Jake Long
Ryan Clady
Branden Albert
Gosder Cherilus
Chris Williams
Jeff Otah
Sam Baker
Duane Brown

More busts in the second group.

There's more busts because your second gorup has almost 2x as many players.

Johnson is a beast.. The rest have a history of injuries..

2nd group: Long, Clady, Albert, Cherilus, Ota and Baker are all starters.. Albert and Cherilus are solid but not spectacular.. The others would be starters on our team.. Crazy talk..

Actually, there are ZERO Busts in his group, even though ~ as you point out ~ he's got twice the numbers...But this has already been noted. Brother Mustapha is an exceptional poster, and I have no wish to exacerbate the point.

 

[mcsully]

Actually, there are ZERO Busts in his group, even though ~ as you point out ~ he's got twice the numbers...But this has already been noted. Brother Mustapha is an exceptional poster, and I have no wish to exacerbate the point.

I'm only jumping in half way into the thread

Bust was a strong word that I used.. But 2 out of the 4 rb's haven't reached 1000 yds and McFadden would have been considered a bust up until the last month and a half.. Mendenhall in the one year he reached 1000, only avg around 70-80 yds a game.. For a run 1st team..

But that aside, I hope address the position in the future

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

My position is that if Dante can take fringe players and turn them into solid contributors...imagine what he could do with 5 STUDS??

Now review that fantasy in light of the salary cap. opcorn:

 

[Off The Grid]

Now review that fantasy in light of the salary cap. opcorn:

You can't seriously think I'm going to jump to, now can you?

I don't take instructions from the likes of you...or anyone, for that matter.

For the record, though: I've already addressed that.

Perhaps you should get up to speed, before taking such an arrogant and insulting attitude.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

You can't seriously think I'm going to jump to, now can you?

I don't take instructions from the likes of you...or anyone, for that matter.

For the record, though: I've already addressed that.

Perhaps you should get up to speed, before taking such an arrogant and insulting attitude.

Getting up to speed on such a prolific verbalist and poster, a nearly insurmountable task. Since you've already crunched all the numbers which would allow NE to field five All-Pros with commensurate salary impact on those other aspects of the team you also consider essential, I shan't waste your time further.

 

[Off The Grid]

Getting up to speed on such a prolific verbalist and poster, a nearly insurmountable task. Since you've already crunched all the numbers which would allow NE to field five All-Pros with commensurate salary impact on those other aspects of the team you also consider essential, I shan't waste your time further.

My compliments on a truly elegant bit of sarcasm, there.

I would point out that we already field 3 Grizzlies with All Pros on their resumes, and have a 4th ~ Sebastian the Cruel ~ who is already All Pro Caliber.

Stepping it up to where I want to go would not, then, be the "fantasy" that you propose it to be, then, would it?

My notion is to shift Salary Cap weight from Wide Out ~ which Coach Bill has, of course, already taken an huge step to do, and which I would further pursue, in the future ~ and to keep it off of Running Back, in favor of The Offensive Front Line. And if the continuing growth of the Salary Cap doesn't accommodate the big pay days of all 5 Studs at any point in the future, I would simply have us continue to do what we've always done, and with rapidly increasing effectiveness, lately: I'd draft replacement Studs. It's a simple enough approach.

 

[Defsoul]

I hope Mikel LeShoure comes out and the Patriots take a long look at him. The guy ran for 330 Yards and two touchdowns on 33 caries against Northwestern and is on pace for 1500 yards rushing. He has the size at 6 feet 1 inch and 230 pounds, he runs through armtackles and he is quite nimble for a big guy. I really hope he comes out.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

I hope Mikel LeShoure comes out and the Patriots take a long look at him. The guy ran for 330 Yards and two touchdowns on 33 caries against Northwestern and is on pace for 1500 yards rushing. He has the size at 6 feet 1 inch and 230 pounds, he runs through armtackles and he is quite nimble for a big guy. I really hope he comes out.

I am almost certain he comes out. Barring a total implosion, he will have had two very good years back to back. RBs don't have a long shelf life, so he needs to take advantage of his high draft stock and declare. Prior to the season, I thought he would be an excellent pick for us; now I'm not so sure that the price we would have to pay is worth it anymore. He's worked his way into late 1st round consideration by virtue of the weak RB class, and I think we can find much better value at other positions. If BB wants to draft him at 32 or 34, though, I'm not really going to complain, because I think he immediately makes the team better.

As much as I like BJGE, imagine a 6'1 #230 bruiser with way better burst running out the clock against the Colts. Maybe we don't let them back in the ball game.

Besides, I think a mid round guy like Bilal Powell could compliment our current rotation perfectly (6' #215, breakaway speed). YouTube - Bilal Powell midseason highlights

Now, if LeShoure has as much success as the last Fighting Illini who sported number 5, then I'm all for using that Carolina pick on him if he's available. That gives us a three down player who upgrades the team. Otherwise, I'm inclined to go bargain hunting in the middle rounds, and upgrade the lines if anyone of note is available.

 

[Off The Grid]

I hope Mikel LeShoure comes out and the Patriots take a long look at him. The guy ran for 330 Yards and two touchdowns on 33 caries against Northwestern and is on pace for 1500 yards rushing. He has the size at 6 feet 1 inch and 230 pounds, he runs through armtackles and he is quite nimble for a big guy. I really hope he comes out.

I am almost certain he comes out. Barring a total implosion, he will have had two very good years back to back. RBs don't have a long shelf life, so he needs to take advantage of his high draft stock and declare. Prior to the season, I thought he would be an excellent pick for us; now I'm not so sure that the price we would have to pay is worth it anymore. He's worked his way into late 1st round consideration by virtue of the weak RB class, and I think we can find much better value at other positions. If BB wants to draft him at 32 or 34, though, I'm not really going to complain, because I think he immediately makes the team better.

As much as I like BJGE, imagine a 6'1 #230 bruiser with way better burst running out the clock against the Colts. Maybe we don't let them back in the ball game.

Besides, I think a mid round guy like Bilal Powell could compliment our current rotation perfectly (6' #215, breakaway speed). YouTube - Bilal Powell midseason highlights

Now, if LeShoure has as much success as the last Fighting Illini who sported number 5, then I'm all for using that Carolina pick on him if he's available. That gives us a three down player who upgrades the team. Otherwise, I'm inclined to go bargain hunting in the middle rounds, and upgrade the lines if anyone of note is available.

Yup. I'd like to see us snag Roy Helu in the 4th or 5th AND Bilal Powell in the 5th or 6th: Two Bruising Blasters that will provide depth, keep each other fresh, and just BEAT on the LineBackers and Secondary unfortunate enough to meet them.

I like Green, too, but he is a slug, and he has got to go.

 

[UofApatsfan]

Darren McFadden
Rashard Mendenhall
Felix Jones
Chris Johnson

Jake Long
Ryan Clady
Branden Albert
Gosder Cherilus
Chris Williams
Jeff Otah
Sam Baker
Duane Brown

More busts in the second group.

You're cherrypicking a draft that happened to have a great crop of running backs taken in the 1st round with a very high number of offensive linemen teams reached on. Lets go by each lineman 1 by 1 to see how many "busts" there are:
Jake Long - 2nd team all NFL his rookie year, 1st team all NFL last year. I'd say he was worth it.
Ryan Clady - 2nd team all NFL his rookie year, 1st team all NFL last year. Just like Long, Denver got their money's worth and then some.
Chris Williams - Def. the closest thing to a bust out of all of these guys. All I will say to defend him is that he wasn't that bad playing left/right tackle last year, and for some reason Chicago moved him to left guard this year where he has struggled.
Branden Albert - A guard coming out of college being forced to play left tackle because KC has no better options. There's no way to properly judge Albert, he's being forced to play out of position. The same thing woulda happened if the Patriots drafted Logan Mankins then made him play left tackle.
Gosder Cherilus - Maybe it's a pick Detroit wants back but it's not a pick they're losing tons of sleep over. He's a decent starter who has problems when his team is playing from behind and can't use the run or play action to keep the defense off balance.
Jeff Otah - Has shown potential but has also had injury issues and struggles in pass protection at times. Similar to Cherilus, he hasn't lived up to the first round pick, but he's a dependable starter who isn't anywhere near the top of Carolina's issue list.
Sam Baker - Hard to argue with this pick given the giant leap ATL's offensive line made from 2007 to 2008.
Duane Brown - Same here, hard to argue with this pick when prior to Duane Brown the Texans O-line was known as one of the NFL's biggest jokes, and since then Matt Schaub has become a top 10 QB while their running game has been great.

So of the 8 linemen drafted:
2 of them (Long and Clady) are complete studs who will be every down probowlers for the next decade
2 more (Baker and Brown) will probably be good, but not great starters who also play every down and are borderline probowlers some years.
2 (Otah and Cherilus) will be starters in the NFL for years to come and will be good on teams that can establish the run. I'm not sure about Cherilus, but with Otah there's room for improvement.
1 is being played out of position and while he isn't good, he's doing a decent job at a position he doesn't have the physical tools to play
1 of them has the possibility of being out of the NFL in a few years. Granted it doesn't help being moved around every year, Williams should look this lost in his 3rd season.


Lets look at every running back drafted in the 1st since 2005 outside of 2008:
Ronnie Brown - Has major injury issues and splits carries when he is healthy. Hard to say he's what Miami envisioned with the 2nd overall pick.
Cedric Benson - It wasn't before Chicago released him that he learned how to run downhill. Has only had one 1000 rushing yard season, and has never averaged more than 4.2 YPC. A top 5 pick Chicago def. wants back.
Cadillac Williams - Had a great rookie year then fell off a cliff. Has yet to stay healthy or average more than 4 YPC since his rookie year, and most recently has lost most of his carries to an undrafted rookie.
Reggie Bush - His numbers have gone down every year since his unimpressive rookie season. Has never had more than 600 rushing yards in a season and hasn't stayed healthy since his rookie year. Arguably a bigger waste of the 2nd overall pick than Ronnie Brown.
Laurence Maroney - Nothing needs to be said here.
DeAngelo Williams - Looked like LT part two after his 3rd season, but was limited by injuries last year, and completely derailed by injuries this year. Carolina probably hoped for more than 2 good years out of him.
Joseph Addai - Like already mentioned RBs, it's been downhill ever since his rookie year. Got banged up towards the end of his 2nd season and has been a shell of himself since then. Contributes more as a pass catcher/blitz pickup than as a runner.
Adrian Peterson - The one guy so far who has undoubtedly proven he was worth his pick.
Marshawn Lynch - Promising rookie year, downhill ever since, cut by the team that used a top 10 pick on him. Same sh!t, different toilet.
Knowshon Moreno - Good rookie year but has taken a step back this year, largely due to his preseason injuries. Seems like the latest to follow a trend.
Donald Brown - Yesterday's game should do the talking.
Beanie Wells - Don't wanna sound like a broken record, but once again, promising rookie season he ended on a strong note, was poised for a breakout season this year, but has gotten one injury after another and is terrible catching/blocking.
CJ Spiller - Done nothing this year and so far looks way too undersized and fragile for the NFL.
Ryan Mathews - Like Spiller, done nothing so far and can't stay healthy. LT is laughing at the Chargers for thinking Mathews would replace him.
Jahvid Best - Has been great when healthy, but is too small to be getting any kind of a workload at this level and hasn't stayed healthy.

 

[cstjohn17]

Nice breakdown of the RBs, I appreciate the effort. This mirrors my thoughts, unless their is an Adrian Peterson type player available in round 1 then RB can wait to rounds 3+

Lets look at every running back drafted in the 1st since 2005 outside of 2008:
Ronnie Brown - Has major injury issues and splits carries when he is healthy. Hard to say he's what Miami envisioned with the 2nd overall pick.
Cedric Benson - It wasn't before Chicago released him that he learned how to run downhill. Has only had one 1000 rushing yard season, and has never averaged more than 4.2 YPC. A top 5 pick Chicago def. wants back.
Cadillac Williams - Had a great rookie year then fell off a cliff. Has yet to stay healthy or average more than 4 YPC since his rookie year, and most recently has lost most of his carries to an undrafted rookie.
Reggie Bush - His numbers have gone down every year since his unimpressive rookie season. Has never had more than 600 rushing yards in a season and hasn't stayed healthy since his rookie year. Arguably a bigger waste of the 2nd overall pick than Ronnie Brown.
Laurence Maroney - Nothing needs to be said here.
DeAngelo Williams - Looked like LT part two after his 3rd season, but was limited by injuries last year, and completely derailed by injuries this year. Carolina probably hoped for more than 2 good years out of him.
Joseph Addai - Like already mentioned RBs, it's been downhill ever since his rookie year. Got banged up towards the end of his 2nd season and has been a shell of himself since then. Contributes more as a pass catcher/blitz pickup than as a runner.
Adrian Peterson - The one guy so far who has undoubtedly proven he was worth his pick.
Marshawn Lynch - Promising rookie year, downhill ever since, cut by the team that used a top 10 pick on him. Same sh!t, different toilet.
Knowshon Moreno - Good rookie year but has taken a step back this year, largely due to his preseason injuries. Seems like the latest to follow a trend.
Donald Brown - Yesterday's game should do the talking.
Beanie Wells - Don't wanna sound like a broken record, but once again, promising rookie season he ended on a strong note, was poised for a breakout season this year, but has gotten one injury after another and is terrible catching/blocking.
CJ Spiller - Done nothing this year and so far looks way too undersized and fragile for the NFL.
Ryan Mathews - Like Spiller, done nothing so far and can't stay healthy. LT is laughing at the Chargers for thinking Mathews would replace him.
Jahvid Best - Has been great when healthy, but is too small to be getting any kind of a workload at this level and hasn't stayed healthy.

 

[DarrylS]

I would stick with BJGE as my feature back, no negative rushing yards yesterday... nice to find a complimentary speedster.

Just straight ahead kickbutt football.. the more he plays the more I like him.

 

[bigcountry75]

I would stick with BJGE as my feature back, no negative rushing yards yesterday... nice to find a complimentary speedster.

Just straight ahead kickbutt football.. the more he plays the more I like him.

I agree...BJGE looks like a solid RB with Woodhead (Stud) taking the 3rd down snaps.....I was a big advocate of getting Ingram but After yesterday I want a pass rusher and a lock down corner or a pass rusher and a stud DE in the 1st round next year.....I think we can wait until the later rounds for a previously mentioned Roy Helu....

 

[DaBruinz]

Right, so for those that are wanting to beef up the Oline, are you really saying that you want to draft a guard or a center in the middle of round 1? Because if your drafting a center that high, your team better be stacked. This draft is a weak year for 1st round talent Tackles.

Another case of 1+1=2,384,117
Please show me where myself, or anyone, was advocating taking an OG or OC in the 1st round. What was said was that you need to make sure you've taken care of the O-line or having a big name RB won't matter. There are questions about the entire Pats O-line except for Connolly. And I mentioned them.

It works both ways. A great back can make an O-line look really good. A great O-line can make average backs look really good. Now, with the Patriots they have a great QB so protecting him is important. But alot of this reminds me of when they drafted Mayo and a lot of people wanted to draft Brandon Albert. Sometimes i think fans take the saying "Games are won in the trenches" too far, and just want to draft lineman.

Please give me an example of a great back making an average to below average O-line look good in the free-agency era.

Here's an example. Chicago Bears, they need a LT and a RB. The choice is Chris Williams or Mendenhall. They end up picking Williams, who is an average LT, always hurt, and picking Matt Forte later who had a nice first season but has fallen off.

The logic they used was beef up the O-line first, and pick a back later. Look where it got them, 2 average players. Mendenhall? He's very good.

*ROFLMAO* Talk about a stretch.

First off, Williams has only missed 3 games due to injury so I don't know where you get that he's "always hurt". Also, Williams is playing LG for the Bears this year, not LT. He spent only 5 games at LT last season, playing 11 at RT.

Forte is hardly an "average back".

Also, you are using the benefit of hind-sight to try and justify this. Rule of thumb is that you build from the lines out. And, considering that there is a great likelihood that Lawfirm and Woodhead will be back, I don't see a starting RB being as high of a priority as a starting center, starting guard or starting tackle. That could change by draft time..

 

[JoeShmoe]

We need to tie up Mankins and Light, after that those top 4 picks should be on OLB, DE, WR and S/CB

Bodden and Warren will be back as starters next year as will Faulk, McGowan etc

 

[patsinthesnow]

BJGE sold me on being the starting RB next year. I've always liked him, but I didn't know if he could handle the load as a main back and be effective, he can.

NFL Stats: by Player Category

He's right up there with all the starting backs on YPC with 4.3, he's in the upper region of TDs with 7, and he's ranked 18th in rushing yards, 0 fumbles in his career, and always fights for an extra 2 or 3 yards.

I think he can handle 15-25 carries game. The only knock on him is no big/flashy plays, which I don't mind since Woodhead is that man.

 

[Metaphors]

I would stick with BJGE as my feature back, no negative rushing yards yesterday... nice to find a complimentary speedster.

Just straight ahead kickbutt football.. the more he plays the more I like him.

Totally agree. No negative plays, no mistakes. Developing receiving and blocking skills as well.

Speedster is the operative word in your description. Someone that is a threat to go the distance if you lose focus after being softened up by BJGE. My favorite...Da'Rel Scott from Maryland. 5'10", 200 so he is big enough, but he has legit track speed. Maryland started splitting his snaps after an injury last year and never stopped. That is a double benefit since the lack of production drops him in the draft, but also leaves more tread on his tires.

Another option I'm starting to lock on is Greg Little from UNC. He is a WR but has a RB background. Solid build (6'3", 230) so he could line up in the backfield in a seeming power set with Hernandez...but quickly split out into a spread WR look. What defensive package do you use against that? Nickel is too light if you want to defend 2 TE with a 230 lb RB. Base or heavy is too slow if Hernandez/Little motion wide.

Little will go much later than deserved due to his NCAA suspension. That combined with his position flexibility would make him a tremendous value to the Pats in the 3rd.

 

[patsfanboy]

BJGE and Woody for next year is a great duo, i rather upgrade our OLB,DE and DT than our RB.