OT: Parcells only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

[tombonneau]

Was just reading an AP article talking about Tuna attending the Fish practice and they mentioned this as an aside.

Am I the only one who thinks this is a staggeringly low number of Division Titles for a guy who almost coached 20 years?

For frame of reference, BB just won his 5th DT in a row.

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

BP is not about make good teams great, he is about make crappy teams good.

 

[PonyExpress]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Was just reading an AP article talking about Tuna attending the Fish practice and they mentioned this as an aside.

Am I the only one who thinks this is a staggeringly low number of Division Titles for a guy who almost coached 20 years?

For frame of reference, BB just won his 5th DT in a row.

Parcells rebuilt 4 franchises from the dregs into playoff contenders (granted GYoung was a major part of G-men resurgence in the early 80s). There were many years of transition, and once the team's were on the right track he left to do it again. Parcells was a great coach and the ability to alter the course of 4, and now possibly 5 franchises for the better is unprecedented and HOF worthy.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Parcells rebuilt 4 franchises from the dregs into playoff contenders (granted GYoung was a major part of G-men resurgence in the early 80s). There were many years of transition, and once the team's were on the right track he left to do it again. Parcells was a great coach and the ability to alter the course of 4, and now possibly 5 franchises for the better is unprecedented and HOF worthy.

Bill Parcells is the most overrated coach of all time... In 7 years of coaching without Bill Belichick, he has never won a single playoff game. He is 55-57 and 0-3 in the playoffs. It's quite obvious who the true genius was behind any success Bill Parcells ever had.

 

[tombonneau]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Parcells rebuilt 4 franchises from the dregs into playoff contenders (granted GYoung was a major part of G-men resurgence in the early 80s). There were many years of transition, and once the team's were on the right track he left to do it again. Parcells was a great coach and the ability to alter the course of 4, and now possibly 5 franchises for the better is unprecedented and HOF worthy.

I understand him taking over "bad" teams deflates his division title numbers, but I still think the apotheosis of Parcells has gone overboard.

There are lots of coaches who have taken over bad teams and made them good. And they've done more than get them to the SB and lose.

Again, I agree Parcells is an excellent coach and is able to maximize output from this roster, but he is not the dominant, otherworldly coach the media makes him out to be.

 

[tombonneau]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Bill Parcells is the most overrated coach of all time... In 7 years of coaching without Bill Belichick, he has never won a single playoff game. He is 55-57 and 0-3 in the playoffs. It's quite obvious who the true genius was behind any success Bill Parcells ever had.

With one of those losses coming against Belichick.

 

[BTTA]

Was just reading an AP article talking about Tuna attending the Fish practice and they mentioned this as an aside.

Am I the only one who thinks this is a staggeringly low number of Division Titles for a guy who almost coached 20 years?

For frame of reference, BB just won his 5th DT in a row.

His coaching resume is largely irrelevant here. His talent selection resume is largely irrelevant here. He is hiring people to do those two jobs. That's the talent that's called for here - hiring and leading, not doing.

There is very little evidence to suggest that he will be any good at this at all, and some evidence that he can't help but meddle in other people's jobs.

Time will tell.

 

[ShrewBeer]

he will pick a decent gm and coach, and he will draft well. this will give miami a chance to compete for the division title.
his division title record means nothing, because he takes crap teams and makes them division contenders, and then bails. therefore he is not going to win many divisions. he will at least get some decent players onto the team and make it so they are not complete losers

 

[PatsFanSince74]

as i recall, we had a similar debate about parcells a few months ago. i had taken the view that parcells without belichick was mediocre, but was put in my place by ponyex and others, who made the case over several posts that parcells is second to none in his ability to turnaround and build teams. they are still right.

in order to judge parcells, you have to look at the whole course of his work with a team. by that standard, he was a truly great coach and belongs in the HOF no matter what happens in Miami.

 

[PonyExpress]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Bill Parcells is the most overrated coach of all time... In 7 years of coaching without Bill Belichick, he has never won a single playoff game. He is 55-57 and 0-3 in the playoffs. It's quite obvious who the true genius was behind any success Bill Parcells ever had.

BB is probably the greatest football coach in history, or at least in the conversation with P. Brown, Shula, Halas, Lombardi, Noll, Walsh. We don't have to diminish Parcells in order to elevate BB. After all, Parcells was smart enough to realize how good BB was and let him work his magic. That's part of being a great administrator, and he deserves credit for that. Parcells was also a great developer of coaching talent. Romeo, Coughlin, Weis, Payton, BB among others cut their coaching teeth under his guidance. Parcells was unlikeable, irascible, an egomaniac and often cruel man who knew how to win football games, and has maybe the best eye for talent ever. He is not overrated at all. He is a HOF coach.

 

[tombonneau]

These Parcells vs. BB debates always remind me of this great quote from an old Curran Projo article. I think it sums it up rather well.

"I think (Belichick) felt he didn't get the kind of credit he should have,"
said Bob Glauber of Newsday, who covered the Giants in the '80s and the Jets
in the '90s. "Parcells was the show and Belichick was working his butt off
doing the dirty work and Parcells got the credit."

One writer recalled a night in a hotel during the days with the Giants.
Belichick was breaking down film in a ballroom, explaining some intricacies
of his scheme to the writer. Another assistant told Belichick he should wrap
it up, in case Parcells walked through.

"He won't come down here," Belichick said. "This is where the work gets
done."

 

[Brooklyn Nick]

Parcells undertook a lot of total reclamation projects, teams who were very very far off from competing. All 4 spots he built teams that had the ability to contend (as Dallas does now, he built the team). But he only won the rings with the Giants

Hes a great coach. That stat is more indicative of the fact that when he started at all 4 stops the teams completely sucked

A lot of coaching is the talent. Listen, Belichick is a great coach, Id even argue the greatest of all time. But refresh my memory on what he won as a head coach in 6 years without Brady again?

 

[tuckeverlasting]

by looking at this miami team, parcells certainly isn't afraid of a challenge.

 

[PatsWorldChamps]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Bill Parcells is the most overrated coach of all time... In 7 years of coaching without Bill Belichick, he has never won a single playoff game. He is 55-57 and 0-3 in the playoffs. It's quite obvious who the true genius was behind any success Bill Parcells ever had.

AGREED! BP has always gone into situations where the team was on the rebound, with or without him... how he gets credit for anything at all is beyond my imagination. Most. overrated. coach. ever.

 

[PatsWorldChamps]

by looking at this miami team, parcells certainly isn't afraid of a challenge.

pretty safe bet that next year's team will have a better record, even if you coached them, AND ran the front office.

 

[PatsWorldChamps]

Parcells undertook a lot of total reclamation projects, teams who were very very far off from competing. All 4 spots he built teams that had the ability to contend (as Dallas does now, he built the team). But he only won the rings with the Giants

Hes a great coach. That stat is more indicative of the fact that when he started at all 4 stops the teams completely sucked

A lot of coaching is the talent. Listen, Belichick is a great coach, Id even argue the greatest of all time. But refresh my memory on what he won as a head coach in 6 years without Brady again?

what did brady win without BB as a head coach again?

 

[PatsWorldChamps]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

BB is probably the greatest football coach in history, or at least in the conversation with P. Brown, Shula, Halas, Lombardi, Noll, Walsh. We don't have to diminish Parcells in order to elevate BB. After all, Parcells was smart enough to realize how good BB was and let him work his magic. That's part of being a great administrator, and he deserves credit for that. Parcells was also a great developer of coaching talent. Romeo, Coughlin, Weis, Payton, BB among others cut their coaching teeth under his guidance. Parcells was unlikeable, irascible, an egomaniac and often cruel man who knew how to win football games, and has maybe the best eye for talent ever. He is not overrated at all. He is a HOF coach.

you are 100% crazy. and it has nothing to do with BB. no way in h3ll does BP belong in the HOF, he is not even average... he was working a deal with another team, WHILE his team was in town for a superbowl.. do you think even ONE of those players who worked all that year have even an OUNCE of respect for him? ANYONE can take a 1-15, 2-14, whatever, team, and make them better... your mother could... you cant do worse. he is great at putting himself in a situation where he cant lose (and he IS great at that). that is all. if the phins win 3 games for each of the next 3 years, some morons will say BP improved them.

 

[Flying Fungi]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

BB is probably the greatest football coach in history, or at least in the conversation with P. Brown, Shula, Halas, Lombardi, Noll, Walsh. We don't have to diminish Parcells in order to elevate BB. After all, Parcells was smart enough to realize how good BB was and let him work his magic. That's part of being a great administrator, and he deserves credit for that. Parcells was also a great developer of coaching talent. Romeo, Coughlin, Weis, Payton, BB among others cut their coaching teeth under his guidance. Parcells was unlikeable, irascible, an egomaniac and often cruel man who knew how to win football games, and has maybe the best eye for talent ever. He is not overrated at all. He is a HOF coach.

In deference to PWC, I will state that I 100% agree with you. My only caveat is that I would include Coach Landry on that short list (and there may be one or two others).

Bill Parcells, love him or hate him, has left one of the largest footprints on the modern NFL. The fact that he is consistently a highly sought after candidate by many franchises should tell you about the professional consensus of the man's talents. If you are a Patriots fan from prior to Bob Kraft, you have no choice but to respect the work he did in NE regardless of the outcome of 1996.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Parcells...
Proven gameday coach...probably irrelevant to the Miami job
Great motivator...unless you're TO
Excellent judge and selector of asst coaches...key to the Miami job
Good judge of foorball talent...relevant to the Miami job

Parcells' new job is not coaching and only indirectly (final say & FA deals) choosing players. His job is to hire a HC and a personnell and cap guy who are competent. Miami has not drafted or coached well this century. I think he was an excellent choice and will turn around this franchise. He will need to pick either older guys without the need to run the whole show themselves or younger upcoming but yet unproven talents willing to have the Tuner looking over their shoulders giving edicts and taking the ultimate credit. That's why a Pioli to Miami ain't gonna happen, but a Josh McD could happen.

 

[PonyExpress]

Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

you are 100% crazy. and it has nothing to do with BB. no way in h3ll does BP belong in the HOF, he is not even average... he was working a deal with another team, WHILE his team was in town for a superbowl.. do you think even ONE of those players who worked all that year have even an OUNCE of respect for him? ANYONE can take a 1-15, 2-14, whatever, team, and make them better... your mother could... you cant do worse. he is great at putting himself in a situation where he cant lose (and he IS great at that). that is all. if the phins win 3 games for each of the next 3 years, some morons will say BP improved them.

I never said Parcells was a good man, a nice man or an honest man. He was a belligerent two faced jerk. But he was a great football coach.