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OT: Parcells only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by tombonneau, Dec 27, 2007.

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  1. tombonneau

    tombonneau In the Starting Line-Up

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    Was just reading an AP article talking about Tuna attending the Fish practice and they mentioned this as an aside.

    Am I the only one who thinks this is a staggeringly low number of Division Titles for a guy who almost coached 20 years?

    For frame of reference, BB just won his 5th DT in a row.
     
  2. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    BP is not about make good teams great, he is about make crappy teams good.
     
  3. PonyExpress

    PonyExpress In the Starting Line-Up

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    Parcells rebuilt 4 franchises from the dregs into playoff contenders (granted GYoung was a major part of G-men resurgence in the early 80s). There were many years of transition, and once the team's were on the right track he left to do it again. Parcells was a great coach and the ability to alter the course of 4, and now possibly 5 franchises for the better is unprecedented and HOF worthy.
     
  4. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    Bill Parcells is the most overrated coach of all time... In 7 years of coaching without Bill Belichick, he has never won a single playoff game. He is 55-57 and 0-3 in the playoffs. It's quite obvious who the true genius was behind any success Bill Parcells ever had.
     
  5. tombonneau

    tombonneau In the Starting Line-Up

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    I understand him taking over "bad" teams deflates his division title numbers, but I still think the apotheosis of Parcells has gone overboard.

    There are lots of coaches who have taken over bad teams and made them good. And they've done more than get them to the SB and lose.

    Again, I agree Parcells is an excellent coach and is able to maximize output from this roster, but he is not the dominant, otherworldly coach the media makes him out to be.
     
  6. tombonneau

    tombonneau In the Starting Line-Up

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    With one of those losses coming against Belichick. :)
     
  7. betterthanthealternative

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    His coaching resume is largely irrelevant here. His talent selection resume is largely irrelevant here. He is hiring people to do those two jobs. That's the talent that's called for here - hiring and leading, not doing.

    There is very little evidence to suggest that he will be any good at this at all, and some evidence that he can't help but meddle in other people's jobs.

    Time will tell.
     
  8. ShrewBeer

    ShrewBeer Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    he will pick a decent gm and coach, and he will draft well. this will give miami a chance to compete for the division title.
    his division title record means nothing, because he takes crap teams and makes them division contenders, and then bails. therefore he is not going to win many divisions. he will at least get some decent players onto the team and make it so they are not complete losers
     
  9. PatsFanSince74

    PatsFanSince74 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    as i recall, we had a similar debate about parcells a few months ago. i had taken the view that parcells without belichick was mediocre, but was put in my place by ponyex and others, who made the case over several posts that parcells is second to none in his ability to turnaround and build teams. they are still right.

    in order to judge parcells, you have to look at the whole course of his work with a team. by that standard, he was a truly great coach and belongs in the HOF no matter what happens in Miami.
     
  10. PonyExpress

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    BB is probably the greatest football coach in history, or at least in the conversation with P. Brown, Shula, Halas, Lombardi, Noll, Walsh. We don't have to diminish Parcells in order to elevate BB. After all, Parcells was smart enough to realize how good BB was and let him work his magic. That's part of being a great administrator, and he deserves credit for that. Parcells was also a great developer of coaching talent. Romeo, Coughlin, Weis, Payton, BB among others cut their coaching teeth under his guidance. Parcells was unlikeable, irascible, an egomaniac and often cruel man who knew how to win football games, and has maybe the best eye for talent ever. He is not overrated at all. He is a HOF coach.
     
  11. tombonneau

    tombonneau In the Starting Line-Up

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    These Parcells vs. BB debates always remind me of this great quote from an old Curran Projo article. I think it sums it up rather well.

     
  12. Brooklyn Nick

    Brooklyn Nick Banned

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    Parcells undertook a lot of total reclamation projects, teams who were very very far off from competing. All 4 spots he built teams that had the ability to contend (as Dallas does now, he built the team). But he only won the rings with the Giants

    Hes a great coach. That stat is more indicative of the fact that when he started at all 4 stops the teams completely sucked

    A lot of coaching is the talent. Listen, Belichick is a great coach, Id even argue the greatest of all time. But refresh my memory on what he won as a head coach in 6 years without Brady again?
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2007
  13. tuckeverlasting

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    by looking at this miami team, parcells certainly isn't afraid of a challenge.
     
  14. PatsWorldChamps

    PatsWorldChamps Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    AGREED! BP has always gone into situations where the team was on the rebound, with or without him... how he gets credit for anything at all is beyond my imagination. Most. overrated. coach. ever.
     
  15. PatsWorldChamps

    PatsWorldChamps Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    pretty safe bet that next year's team will have a better record, even if you coached them, AND ran the front office.
     
  16. PatsWorldChamps

    PatsWorldChamps Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    what did brady win without BB as a head coach again?
     
  17. PatsWorldChamps

    PatsWorldChamps Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    you are 100% crazy. and it has nothing to do with BB. no way in h3ll does BP belong in the HOF, he is not even average... he was working a deal with another team, WHILE his team was in town for a superbowl.. do you think even ONE of those players who worked all that year have even an OUNCE of respect for him? ANYONE can take a 1-15, 2-14, whatever, team, and make them better... your mother could... you cant do worse. he is great at putting himself in a situation where he cant lose (and he IS great at that). that is all. if the phins win 3 games for each of the next 3 years, some morons will say BP improved them.
     
  18. Flying Fungi

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    In deference to PWC, I will state that I 100% agree with you. My only caveat is that I would include Coach Landry on that short list (and there may be one or two others).

    Bill Parcells, love him or hate him, has left one of the largest footprints on the modern NFL. The fact that he is consistently a highly sought after candidate by many franchises should tell you about the professional consensus of the man's talents. If you are a Patriots fan from prior to Bob Kraft, you have no choice but to respect the work he did in NE regardless of the outcome of 1996.
     
  19. PatsWickedPissah

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    Parcells...
    Proven gameday coach...probably irrelevant to the Miami job
    Great motivator...unless you're TO
    Excellent judge and selector of asst coaches...key to the Miami job
    Good judge of foorball talent...relevant to the Miami job

    Parcells' new job is not coaching and only indirectly (final say & FA deals) choosing players. His job is to hire a HC and a personnell and cap guy who are competent. Miami has not drafted or coached well this century. I think he was an excellent choice and will turn around this franchise. He will need to pick either older guys without the need to run the whole show themselves or younger upcoming but yet unproven talents willing to have the Tuner looking over their shoulders giving edicts and taking the ultimate credit. That's why a Pioli to Miami ain't gonna happen, but a Josh McD could happen.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2007
  20. PonyExpress

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    Re: OT: Parcelss only won 5 Division Titles in 19 seasons

    I never said Parcells was a good man, a nice man or an honest man. He was a belligerent two faced jerk. But he was a great football coach.
     
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