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O-Line Breakdown by KC Joyner

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by JSn, May 8, 2009.

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  1. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    Point of attack: Patriots run blocking - AFC East - ESPN

    Man, Kaczur is a friggin' turnstyle! ;)
    Last edited: May 8, 2009
  2. BradyFTW!

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    If Yates was deemed fine, then it's time for Joyner to go back to the drawing board.
  3. MoLewisrocks

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    "What stands out most about those stats for the Patriots is that they were pushed into the backfield 11 times as a team, second-most in the division to the Buffalo Bills' 22 times.

    Center Dan Koppen was pushed back six times, tied for second-most in the division. He allowed six defenders to make contact with a ball carrier in the backfield, also second-most."

    Borderline acceptable being a laudable goal...

    The pass blocking stats would be interesting too...;)
  4. psychoPat

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    Thanx for the exotic data.

    But what jumps out at me is that
    this poor chap Joyner has nothing better to do
    than watch and log every snap of every OL in the league.
  5. BradyFTW!

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    You kidding? He's getting paid to break down game footage. How is that not a kickass thing?
  6. Sicilian

    Sicilian On the Roster

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    Remember, this is only run blocking stats. Last year we had a pretty decent running game that included numerous injuries to our running backs while still maintaing success.

    Pass blocking may be a different story.
  7. sg14

    sg14 Rookie

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    Going by this Neal is our best run blocking OL, with Mankins and Light looking strong.

    Going by this,, Koppen rates about the same as Yates,, I was hoping for one of those stud centers for the Pats in this recent draft, Koppen got mauled last year a few times, Looks like these ratings are pretty good on how these players rate compared to each other.


    PLayer att yards avg rating
    Matt Light, LT 141 777 5.5 90.1
    Mark LeVoir, LT 56 221 3.9 89.3
    Logan Mankins, LG 223 1,119 5.0 91.0
    Dan Koppen, C 197 952 4.8 84.3
    Stephen Neal, RG 117 557 4.9 94.0
    Billy Yates, RG 63 297 4.7 84.1
    Nick Kaczur, RT 106 636 6.0 86.8
  8. unoriginal

    unoriginal Rookie

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    Centers must be evaluated differently than guards in that one of their hands is tied up by the snap. We don't know if Joyner took this into account when he calculated his success rate.
  9. Dirk3601215

    Dirk3601215 Rookie

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    our line is pretty decent as a whole. i wouldnt be too worried.
  10. fnordcircle

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    Posted by a guy who has nothing better to do than to post thousands of inane posts on the internet for free.
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    I believe that Koppen was dealing with an elbow issue for a fair portion of the season, and that may have impacted his game. It would explain his dropoff from the season before. Other than that, there's really nothing surprising here about the starters.
  12. PatsFanSince74

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    This "poor chap" has figured out how to do what we all dream about...he's figured out how to have "nothing better to do" than make a lot of money doing what he loves...and it's all about the NFL!

    The Football Scientist
  13. JoeShmoe

    JoeShmoe Rookie

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    LeVoir looks solid there too. Wonder if he and Vollmer challenge Kazcur ar RT by seasons end?
  14. efin98

    efin98 Rookie

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    He was hurt weeks 12-14 but he didn't miss any starts. There is at least one major sack that is entirely his fault in the Pittsburgh game that could be attributed to the injury, a drive killer on 2nd and 1 in Pittsburgh territory in the 3rd quarter.


    I really want to know if there is any, and I mean any, factoring of injuries to players in the stats. Neal wasn't his old self at all frankly, and he was on the PUP list at the start of the year and needed at least two games before he was able to play up to basic standards for them. His stats being low is understandable but it can be written off by his injury preventing him from playing at the top of his game.
  15. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

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    I may be missing something, but from my observations being a good lineman on the run isn't always - or even mostly - about north south, pushing back or forward - there's a lot of lateral movement needed to break holes open where the RB is looking for them.

    I've seen plenty of plays where a good O lineman will get a good angle and give up some ground to the defensive push - just as long as they're still opening the hole.

    And as far as speed rushers on a pass play, I've seen plenty of plays involving a speed rusher where the "point of engagement" on the left side is the QB.

    I'm not saying there's nothing to be gained by this breakdown - I'm just cautioning that these types of stats usually leave out a heckuva lot of important nuances to the game.
  16. Urgent

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    Nuances aside, when Neal was out, the offense was sputtering. Cassel was getting killed up the middle - he constantly had a defender in his face by his fifth step.

    When Neal returned, the offense really improved. Those run-blocking stats certainly support that from a statistical basis.
  17. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    I also suspect that you'd see Nick's game progressing over the season as he was coming out of an addiction and a lot of off-field distractions. I would love to see these stats for games 9-16 only.
  18. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

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    I'm not downplaying the lack of Neal or injuries in general - though it did seem to me that it was more than just one reason why the OL wasn't playing well earlier last year.

    I think part of it was that they were NOT fully healthy - had NOT yet gotten their act together and were playing well as a unit - and had to contend with playing for a new QB who hadn't been under cetner since high school, who was not getting rid of the ball as quick as Brady or moving around in the pocket as well as Brady, and the fact that with a green QB under center there was more pressure being put on the pass rush.

    I may have forgotten a few other factors too.... after the Miami game and their poor performance (and yes, maybe even the boos of fans) seemed to spark them to play better and the return of Neal seemed to help as well - but at that point I think they had adjusted pretty well to playing with Cassel behind them.
  19. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    That's an excellent point. I'm not sure how much it factors in to this cold stat, but the Line play HAD to be affected by in pass blocking situations, for sure.
  20. Brady-To-Branch

    Brady-To-Branch Rookie

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    KC Joyner has stated that Centers are usually the weak link in any O-line.

    That makes sense, since they have to be able to snap the ball while getting hit.

    So if the weakest part of the Pats O-line was at C, I can live with that.
    Last edited: May 11, 2009
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