Welcome to PatsFans.com

NFL Scheduling Quirk - Patriots @ Indy for three years straight

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by JoeSixPat, Apr 14, 2009.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    9,798
    Likes Received:
    21
    Ratings:
    +24 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    OK - I know enough about the schedule making process to understand why the Pats have had to play @ Indy each year since 2007.

    Of course, one can't claim its unfair - given that Indy played at Foxboro three years straight (2004-2006)

    2003 it was Pats @ Indy. 2002 was the last time we didn't have a regular season Indy game (the year after the Colts left the division). So what's up with the NFL schedule makers? Presumably next year is @ Foxboro assuming they play each other - but what's with the three year cycles?
  2. PATRIOT64

    PATRIOT64 Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2006
    Messages:
    3,775
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Would you like cheese with that whine? :rolleyes:

    If you have been watching Pats and Colts games for the past several years you would know that NE either has won those games or played good enough to win but came up short. - 08 should have won,07 did win - 06 AFCCG had a huge lead but blew it

    It does not matter to me where they play,NE is nearly as good on the road against the Colts with Brady as they are at home.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  3. brdmaverick

    brdmaverick Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,079
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    The reason for the three year cycles is because that's the way it works with four divisions in a conference.

    Every year one division plays one other entire division within the conference. With four divisions, there are three other divisions to cycle through for three years until the cycle is repeated.
  4. brdmaverick

    brdmaverick Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,079
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    While the Pats play AT the Colts for three years straight, the Steelers would have played AT the Pats for three straight years (if the Pats won the division last year)
  5. brdmaverick

    brdmaverick Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,079
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    I get what you are saying where it is quirky, but I'm not sure there is a better solution.
  6. CampPen33

    CampPen33 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Messages:
    636
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Ok here it is: the Colts played in NE - 2004, 2005, 2006. :cool: This is established. How can we complain we are going there! 2010 maybe we will be able to throw snowballs at them.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  7. LuthierJr

    LuthierJr Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2007
    Messages:
    723
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Man it's gonna be fun to stick it to them in their new stadium for three straight years.
  8. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    31,088
    Likes Received:
    29
    Ratings:
    +40 / 2 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #24 Jersey
    Do you people who say he's whining actually read ?

    He's saying it's a weird quirk. And he's right, it is.
  9. CampPen33

    CampPen33 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Messages:
    636
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:


    It is, but it still stems from the annoyance that we have to play there again. :mad: I complain about it, until I think about kicking the crap out of them in their house again!:singing:
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  10. Patjew

    Patjew PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2005
    Messages:
    9,549
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +18 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #18 Jersey
    That's not good enough. NE lost 2 of those 3 home games and just barely won the first one. Hopefully they even the series this year.
  11. Patjew

    Patjew PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2005
    Messages:
    9,549
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +18 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #18 Jersey
    They already stuck it to us there last year. One more chance for us.
  12. PATRIOT64

    PATRIOT64 Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2006
    Messages:
    3,775
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Why is this even a discussion?

    NE had those 3 games at home and that is true but they got thier butts handed to them in 2005 - did squeak out a win in 2004 but got beat down again at Gillette in 2006 - Thats a poor 1-2 record at Gillette if I add it right

    Is this home field 3 games in a row a big advantage you guys are complaining about?

    Unless you are a season ticket holder who wanted to see the two play live or you wanted to get a ticket for that particular game in hoping it was played in Foxboro in 2009 then its understandable,otherwise its stupid

    Both teams are as tough on the road as they are at home - IT DON'T MATTER ...period,end of story
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  13. TommyBrady12

    TommyBrady12 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2008
    Messages:
    3,328
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    starting next year the colts will play the pats in foxborough five years straight. peyton will be 38 during the fifth year.
  14. CampPen33

    CampPen33 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Messages:
    636
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    You have a source to share on that?:singing:
  15. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    9,798
    Likes Received:
    21
    Ratings:
    +24 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:


    Yeah, I hate it when I actually have an opportunity to go to Gilette to watch them play against one of their better opponents.

    Like you I'd prefer all home games be played against weak teams as blowouts are much more fun to watch than close, well played games.

    :rolleyes:
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  16. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    9,798
    Likes Received:
    21
    Ratings:
    +24 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Apparently, they're whining that I'm not whining?

    Um - I understand why we play the winners in the division.

    But your telling me that the NFL has formula that says that the games are on a three year Home and Away cycle?

    If someone can show me that rule and explain why it's a rule in the first place I'd appreciate it.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  17. ScottieC

    ScottieC Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,034
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    I'm so sick of this question. No offense, Joe.

    NFL announces teams' 2009 opponents - NFL - SI.com

    National Football League - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  18. PATSYLICIOUS

    PATSYLICIOUS Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2007
    Messages:
    10,960
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #12 Jersey
    I think it's just random. We played home vs. SD in 07 and then @ SD in 08 so there's no specific pattern when it comes to home/away.
  19. BradfordPatsFan

    BradfordPatsFan Rookie

    Joined:
    May 7, 2006
    Messages:
    2,525
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Sure there is. The home game in 07 was part of a two year cycle where the Pats would host the same place finisher from the AFCW. The year before the Pats hosted Denver IIRC. They both finished first in their respective years. Starting this year and next year the pats will play @ the AFCW team they finish in the same slot as.

    Last year's game was part of the once every three year cycle where the Pats will play two AFCW home and 2 AFCW away. Three years ago the Chargers and Raiders came to NE while the Pats went to KC and Denver. Last year the Pats went to SD and Oakland while hosting Denver and KC. In 2012 we will host SD and Oakland while traveling out to KC and Denver. In 2015 the Pats will go to SD and Oakland and travel to KC and Denver.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  20. neuronet

    neuronet Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2008
    Messages:
    2,171
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #87 Jersey
    What really sucks is that they will change it after this year, and it will end up with NE playing there again next year. :snob:
  21. neuronet

    neuronet Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2008
    Messages:
    2,171
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #87 Jersey
  22. TommyBrady12

    TommyBrady12 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2008
    Messages:
    3,328
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    no i'm wrong. i thought we played five straight in indy.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  23. ScottieC

    ScottieC Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2008
    Messages:
    3,034
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    It's not random.

    The only thing Random about the NFL is the way they call penalties and distribute fines.
  24. Patsrock

    Patsrock Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2006
    Messages:
    1,309
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    If the Pats and SD had finished in the same slot (i.e 1st and 1st 2nd and 2nd) The Pats would have played @SD again this year. Here is how the Pats schedule was since 2002.

    vs NFC teams

    2002 NFCN (@Chi, @Det)(GB, Min) reverse for 2006
    2003 NFCE (@Phil, @Was)(NYG,Dal) reverse for 2007
    2004 NFCW(@STL, @AZ)(Sea, SF) reverse for 2008
    2005 NFCS(@Car, @ATL)(NO,TB) reverse for 2009

    vs AFC teams
    2002,2008 AFCW(@SD, @Oak)(Den, KC) reverse for 2005
    2003,2009 AFCS (@Indy,@Hou)(Jac, Tenn) reverse for 2006
    2004 AFCN(@Pitt, @Clev)(Cincy,Balt) reverse for 2007

    vs AFC like finishing teams

    2002 @AFCS 1st(Tenn) AFCN 1st (Pitts)
    2003 @AFCW 2nd(Den) AFCN 2nd (Clev)
    2004 @AFCW 1st (KC) AFCS 1st (Indy)
    2005 @AFCN 1st (Pitts) AFCS 1st (Indy)
    2006 @AFCN 1st(Cincy) AFCW 1st (Den)
    2007 @AFCS 1st (Indy) AFCW 1st (SD)
    2008 @AFCS 1st (Indy) AFCN 1st (Pitts)
    2009 @AFCW 2nd (Den) AFCN 2nd (Balt)
  25. jmt57

    jmt57 Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,955
    Likes Received:
    22
    Ratings:
    +30 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    It's not random.

    This year the Pats are playing the Colts as part of the division rotation (AFC East teams vs AFC South teams.) This happens every three years with one home and one away game every six years against each of those teams. In 2006 the Pats were in Foxboro for the Colts and Texans, and at Jacksonville and Tennessee. In 2009 (and 2003) it is/was the reverse.

    The other part of the equation is the final two games of every team's schedule, where teams that finished first the previous season face each other, as do teams that finished second, third and fourth in their divisions. For 2009 that results in the Pats playing Denver and Baltimore. One of each of these games is home and the other is away. It is this portion of the schedule that resulted in the Pats playing the Colts in 2008, 2007, 2005 and 2004 as both teams finished first in their division the previous year.

    The 'quirk' is the fact that the 1st place AFC East team was at the 1st place AFC South team two years in a row. Here are the schedules of the 1st place AFC East team the last few years, and you can see why that happens:

    2009: at AFC west; home vs AFC north
    2008: at AFC south, home vs AFC north
    2007: at AFC south, home vs AFC west
    2006: at AFC north, home vs AFC west
    2005: at AFC north, home vs AFC south
    2004: at AFC west, home vs AFC south
    2003: at AFC west, home vs AFC north

    As you can see, there is a very specific pattern - nothing random at all to the schedule. It is similar to the fact that once every eight years AFC East teams have to play both the AFC West and NFC West (and vise versa.) There is no conspiracy, and nobody in the NFL offices is trying to help or hurt a specific team.

    Now you can argue perhaps that the pattern should have been set up differently, but I would counter that by saying that at the time very few expected so many AFC teams to dominate their divisions for a lengthy time. The NFL had been set up for parity with the salary cap, free agency, and reverse order of standings for the draft to insure that few teams remained on top, or on the bottom, for very long. Obviously that did not happen as the best organizations figured out how to remain competitive within the salary cap era, while those that did not seldom won their divisions.
  26. upstater1

    upstater1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    12,926
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Is there a medicine a doctor can prescribe for involuntary knee jerking?

    Jeez, sometimes the responses are written before the first poster even hits send.
  27. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2005
    Messages:
    20,235
    Likes Received:
    32
    Ratings:
    +33 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Actually, there is, and Patsrock did the legwork to show it.

    Note that in the two intervening years between playing an entire division, both years have the same host for the matches (i.e., NE in 2004, 2005; IND in 2007, 2008). If they switched that around (e.g., AFCE@AFCS then AFCS@AFCE), you'd never have this bizarre situation.

    Then again, it's still better than the pre-2002 days, when you had the spectacle of NE@PIT something like nine times in a row.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  28. jmt57

    jmt57 Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,955
    Likes Received:
    22
    Ratings:
    +30 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    So rather than this current setup of AFC east first place teams:
    2009: at AFC west; home vs AFC north
    2008: at AFC south, home vs AFC north
    2007: at AFC south, home vs AFC west
    2006: at AFC north, home vs AFC west
    2005: at AFC north, home vs AFC south
    2004: at AFC west, home vs AFC south
    2003: at AFC west, home vs AFC north

    The NFL could adjust to something like this, perhaps:
    2009: at AFC west; home vs AFC north
    2008: at AFC north, home vs AFC south
    2007: at AFC south, home vs AFC west
    2006: at AFC west, home vs AFC north
    2005: at AFC north, home vs AFC south
    2004: at AFC south, home vs AFC west
    2003: at AFC west, home vs AFC north
  29. PATSYLICIOUS

    PATSYLICIOUS Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2007
    Messages:
    10,960
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #12 Jersey
    I see, thanks for the explanations.

    So following the pattern in 2010 we will be at AFC west, home vs AFC south for the teams that finish alike in their division... therefore if we and Indy finish alike they'll be coming to Foxboro?
  30. godef

    godef Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,118
    Likes Received:
    6
    Ratings:
    +6 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Your presumption is correct.

    The reason we have played the Colts continuously for so many years is because both teams typically wind up in 1st place. In 2 out of 3 consecutive seasons, you play the team in another division in the conference that's in the same position as you.

    In the 1 out of 3 seasons, you play round robin vs that division. That's what is happening this year. In 2006, the last time we played the South in round-robin, we hosted the Colts. This year we play at the Colts. In three years, we will host the Colts again.

    Note that means two intervening seasons, which means no two teams in opposing divisions can continuously play home-and-away every other year. In the case of the East Division 1st vs the South Division 1st, both games are either home or away in the non round-robin seasons.

    This is not true for all combination of teams/divisions, but it's literally impossible to avoid in some cases. And when you play that team round robin, that makes 3 consecutive home or away games since the one before or the one after will be home or away.

    The NFL counts on continual changes in division standings from year to year to mix things up. The fact that the Pats and the Colts both dominated 1st place in their divisions so far is what causes the quirk.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page