Linda's 3 Merged Threads About Refs (there's room for 4)

[JJDChE]

Yours is a silly argument. The one thing that players across all the sports ask for is consistency. There are levels to calls in all leagues, and the officials clearly don't call every incident of every rules violation. So, using your own claim as the basis for evaluation, there's not a single official in the NFL who actually does his job properly, because they do not call every violation of every rule.

It's on Gronk not to hold, not for the ref to look the other way.

Holding in the open field, within a few yards of the play isn't generally overlooked.

 

[Deus Irae]

It's on Gronk not to hold, not for the ref to look the other way.

Holding in the open field, within a few yards of the play isn't generally overlooked.

Again, you ignore the reality of the game in favor of a meaningless platitude.

 

[Mack Herron]

Always easy to argue a close call. Better to look at the number of calls, especially big ones, indicating a lack of discipline and composure. And most of the mistakes were not made by rookies, but by players who should know better. Sure players screwed up--but so many of them (8 for 60yds)? I don't think coaches escape culpability here. Same for the blocked punt and repeated offensive ineptitude especially converting third down (5 for 15). Again, easy to say "execution" but that is too easy because if everyone executes each play like it was drawn up then they all work. The coaches job is to tilt the balance by drawing up plays that pit strengths against opponents weaknesses. From that standpoint, the play calling left a lot to be desired. For me, coaches and players had more to do with the outcome than refs, who were bad for both teams.

 

[JJDChE]

Again, you ignore the reality of the game in favor of a meaningless platitude.

It's on Gronk to play it legally, regardless of what was called earlier.

Holding doesn't become legal because someone else got away with it in the game.

 

[Deus Irae]

It's on Gronk to play it legally, regardless of what was called earlier.

Holding doesn't become legal because someone else got away with it in the game.

One of the biggest plays came when veteran safety Kerry Rhodes knocked away a potential game-tying two-point conversion away from Rob Gronkowski after Gronkowski scored New England’s only touchdown of the game.

“I had man-to-man on that play and I was able to be physical with him down there, because he (Gronkowski) is a physical guy,” Rhodes said of his two-point defense. “I got my hands on him and when I got my hands on him I knew, I looked up and saw Brady looking at him so I took him the whole way.”

It Is What It Is » How Cardinals bottled up Tom Brady, Patriots

You have no valid, supportable argument. None.

 

[vyrago]

I'd prefer we didn't whine and pout like Flacco, personally.

Yeah, let him get the refs p'od at him.

 

[JJDChE]

It Is What It Is » How Cardinals bottled up Tom Brady, Patriots

You have no valid, supportable argument. None.

Of course I do. Gronkowski got called for an obvious infraction within yards of a game changing play. It was illegal, he got penalized. It wasn't a questionable play. He clearly held him. No other argument is valid.

You can't always expect make-up calls or for things to be called perfectly consistently. They never were with the regular refs and even less so with the replacements.

 

[Deus Irae]

Of course I do. Gronkowski got called for an obvious infraction within yards of a game changing play. It was illegal, he got penalized. It wasn't a questionable play. He clearly held him. No other argument is valid.

You can't always expect make-up calls or for things to be called perfectly consistently. They never were with the regular refs and even less so with the replacements.

Pereira just weighed in on this, on 98.5. When asked about it, he said he'd reviewed it again and he called it marginal at best, said that if he was grading for it, it would get an MC (which is where he'd defend the call as barely technically correct but would tell the official never to make that call again), and would expect that no regular officials would call it. He also said that the hand outside the frame was barely there and was really not enough to call it while being technically correct.

In other words, the former top dog of officials in the NFL disagrees with you and agrees with what most of the rest of us have been saying. That being the case, you can take this up with him.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Re: [Linda's TWOMerged Threads About Refs]Should the Pats call out officials like Fla

But, they WERE a part of it, right?

They obviously were, the point is I'd rather my team focus on it's internal issues that clearly needs addressed than to pout about officiating which everybody knows has been awful.

 

[Linda_The_Pats_Fan (She was NEM)]

Yours is a silly argument. The one thing that players across all the sports ask for is consistency. There are levels to calls in all leagues, and the officials clearly don't call every incident of every rules violation. So, using your own claim as the basis for evaluation, there's not a single official in the NFL who actually does his job properly, because they do not call every violation of every rule.

You nailed it. It is called "common sense" and there are times when common sense must prevail over everything else.

What this official has done is to put himself into a situation where every similar play that comes his way during the course of every other game that he will officiate at for the rest of his life will be a situation where he will see the same thing that he saw Gronk allegedly doing, and he will be required to throw the flag, even if it happens a dozen times in every game. If not, then he should be asked, why?

Consistency is the rule.

 

[Linda_The_Pats_Fan (She was NEM)]

Re: [Linda's TWOMerged Threads About Refs]Should the Pats call out officials like Fla

They obviously were, the point is I'd rather my team focus on it's internal issues that clearly needs addressed than to pout about officiating which everybody knows has been awful.

Oh, I doubt that they are pouting about it. They are professional athletes doing what they get paid to do.

It is for us, the fans, to pout about things that happen , to be angered about them, to cheer about them and discuss them.. That is what makes us "fans."

And I have no problem with fans that want to discuss this particular issue, pro or con. That is what makes us "fans."

If some fans want to discuss it at length, while others want to move on, I have no problem with that, either. That is what makes us "fans."

Discussion with other fans is a good remedy, a medicine that will provide a cure.

I can speak for myself and say that when the incident happened, I was shocked, I was in a state of disbelief. As I made my way home, my eyes filled up with tears.

When I finally got home, I was in a state of shock, could not even speak to anyone. I made a promise before the game to bring a family member somewhere, and I did, but I was still in partial shock.

Then, on coming home again, I began to read posts in this forum and the pain began to subside. I made posts, and comments, and the pain subsided even more, and then more and more as the night wore on. I actually was able to fall asleep right away, albeit at a very late hour.

And today, the pain is just about gone. The memory of what transpired lingers on, but it, too, will fade away and by kickoff next Sunday, my total concentration will be on the game at hand.

And so, I am grateful for this forum. it was my cure for what happened yesterday. It has been my medicine.

And this is what makes us FANS.

 

[Linda_The_Pats_Fan (She was NEM)]

From that standpoint, the play calling left a lot to be desired. For me, coaches and players had more to do with the outcome than refs,

And with that part of your comments, I completely agree.

 

[Wolfpack]

Re: The official that threw the flag??????

We rail against these things when they happen because they are not correct within the context of the game, regardless of the letter of the rules, and because we know them to be relatively rare occurrences when the usual officials are in there (OK, it's not quite as rare in the WWE/NBA). In this case, a real official probably doesn't make that call because he's experienced enough to see the context. The replacement official screwed the pooch.

Yeah, because the regular refs never made a bad call that screwed the Patriots.

Wait, whuh?

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Re: [Linda's TWOMerged Threads About Refs]Should the Pats call out officials like Fla

Oh, I doubt that they are pouting about it. They are professional athletes doing what they get paid to do.

It is for us, the fans, to pout about things that happen , to be angered about them, to cheer about them and discuss them.. That is what makes us "fans."
.

Wasn't the original question whether the Pats should call out the refs like Flacco did? That's what I was responding to

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: The official that threw the flag??????

Yeah, because the regular refs never made a bad call that screwed the Patriots.

Wait, whuh?

The real officials make mistakes. That doesn't mean you should be playing the equivalency card when it's clearly not applicable.

The former head of officials came out and said that he used to teach his officials not to make that call, that if one made that call, he'd tell them not to do it again, and that it was a borderline call even by the very letter of the rule.

 

[Wolfpack]

Re: The official that threw the flag??????

The real officials make mistakes. That doesn't mean you should be playing the equivalency card when it's clearly not applicable.

And it also doesn't mean you should say "I think the regular refs wouldn't have made that call" when the regulars make plenty of atrocious calls.

The former head of officials came out and said that he used to teach his officials not to make that call, that if one made that call, he'd tell them not to do it again, and that it was a borderline call even by the very letter of the rule.

By your own admission, it was a borderline call. And yet, at the same time, you're just oh-so-sure the regulars would have not thrown the flag.

You have no evidence to support your assertion whatsoever. It's just a WAG. Yet, as is so often the case, you argue to the bitter end and refuse to entertain even the slightest notion that maybe - just maybe - what you're saying would have happened might not necessarily have.

 

[unoriginal]

Some people here must be a real hoot at traffic court.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: The official that threw the flag??????

And it also doesn't mean you should say "I think the regular refs wouldn't have made that call" when the regulars make plenty of atrocious calls.
By your own admission, it was a borderline call. And yet, at the same time, you're just oh-so-sure the regulars would have not thrown the flag.

You have no evidence to support your assertion whatsoever. It's just a WAG. Yet, as is so often the case, you argue to the bitter end and refuse to entertain even the slightest notion that maybe - just maybe - what you're saying would have happened might not necessarily have.

It was Pereira calling it a borderline call, although he said more than that, as I noted, since he was saying that it was borderline whether it was any kind of hold call at all, not whether it was a borderline call to make. He specifically said that this was the type of call he trained the officials not to make. Go troll someone else.

 

[Wolfpack]

Re: The official that threw the flag??????

It was Pereira calling it a borderline call, although he said more than that, as I noted, since he was saying that it was borderline whether it was any kind of hold call at all, not whether it was a borderline call to make. He specifically said that this was the type of call he trained the officials not to make. Go troll someone else.

If I'm a troll, yet you keep responding because of your obsessive desire to always have the last word, what does that say about you?

Fact is neither you nor I nor anyone else has any idea whatsoever whether the regulars would have made that call or not. You're just guessing on what you admit is a borderline call. Guessing and speculating is fine, but for you to sit there 100% confident that your guess is 100% correct and you're right and everyone else is wrong (as usual) just makes you look silly (as usual).

Deus' obsessive need to have the last word coming in 4..... 3...... .2..........

 

[JJDChE]

Pereira just weighed in on this, on 98.5. When asked about it, he said he'd reviewed it again and he called it marginal at best, said that if he was grading for it, it would get an MC (which is where he'd defend the call as barely technically correct but would tell the official never to make that call again), and would expect that no regular officials would call it. He also said that the hand outside the frame was barely there and was really not enough to call it while being technically correct.

In other words, the former top dog of officials in the NFL disagrees with you and agrees with what most of the rest of us have been saying. That being the case, you can take this up with him.

Sounds like Pereira agrees with me. I thought it was more obvious watching it real time, but if he says it was marginal I'll certainly agree with his review.