How do you feel about the Patriots salary cap management in recent years?

[ausbacker]

I have no issue with the Patriots cap management.

 

[Patsrock]

Brady restructured his contract in 2013, 2012, and 2010 to free up cap space for this team, would our cap situation be as good if he did not do that, Brady’s cap hit is 13th amongst and 14th amongst APY for all NFL QBs, the team first QB certainly helps the cap hit, if Brady had a $22M cap hit like Eli Manning we’d be in a totally different situation.

2010 and 2013 were extensions.
2012 was a restructure.

Stop acting like restructures and extensions are about team firs Brady didn't lose apenny of his money. They just moved it around for cap purposes.

 

[mgteich]

Please list ALL the top quarterbacks not in their rookie contracts who earn less per year than Brady.

Brady took a 3 year $27M extension and basically guaranteed all of his money (a total of $57 over 5 years). So, Brady was being paid $15M a year. The extension reduced his new compensation to $9M a year ($11.4M average over the 5 years. The market for top quarterbacks is more in the range of double what Brady accepted.

Of course, all of Brady's money is guaranteed.

2010 and 2013 were extensions.
2012 was a restructure.

Stop acting like restructures and extensions are about team firs Brady didn't lose apenny of his money. They just moved it around for cap purposes.

 

[Brady6]

I have no issue with the Patriots cap management.

I agree there is no issue with it. I do think it could have been better over the past 2 seasons and that is removing Hernandez completely.

 

[Brady6]

2010 and 2013 were extensions.

2012 was a restructure.



Stop acting like restructures and extensions are about team firs Brady didn't lose apenny of his money. They just moved it around for cap purposes.

Brady doesn't make as much as other QBs and his willingness to restructure and take team friendly deals is a huge difference maker.

 

[mgteich]

I agree that Brady took much less than market. HOWEVER, top players freeing up cap space through re-structures and extensions is not unusual at all.

Brady freed up about $7M a year. Mankins could free up $3.5M. Wilfork could free up $4M on an extension. It happens all the time. It's part of the game.

When Wilfork signed his last deal, it was cap-friendly.

I don't know how convincing players to sign cap-friendly contracts is anything but good cap management.

Brady restructured his contract in 2013, 2012, and 2010 to free up cap space for this team, would our cap situation be as good if he did not do that, Brady’s cap hit is 13th amongst and 14th amongst APY for all NFL QBs, the team first QB certainly helps the cap hit, if Brady had a $22M cap hit like Eli Manning we’d be in a totally different situation.

 

[Archeryaddict12]

2010 and 2013 were extensions.

2012 was a restructure.



Stop acting like restructures and extensions are about team firs Brady didn't lose apenny of his money. They just moved it around for cap purposes.

They were because it helped free some cap space. He is all about winning

 

[borg]

More horses, less ponies

 

[Brady6]

I don't know how convincing players to sign cap-friendly contracts is anything but good cap management.

I do not think anyone is convincing Brady to sign anything, I think that he is in a situation where he is married to a woman who is worth an estimated $290 million, and he makes a substantial amount of money modeling. This allows him to sign at a lower cost to give the team the ability to build a better team. The question you have to ask yourself is how does Brady feel about the decisions made with the money he is willingly freeing up for the Patriots?

Keep in mind that 32/53 players on our roster at the end of the season were on rookie contracts, that is going to change we will have to pay our starting RB, X-WR, LT, RDE, MLB, OLB, RCB, FS and others over the next few years. What happens then?

Do you think we can retain –

• Devin McCourty
• Chandler Jones
• Nate Solder
• Shane Vereen
• Stevan Ridley
• Donta Hightower
• Alfonzo Dennard
• Brandon Spikes
• Marcus Cannon
• Ryan Mallett

All of them will be looking for their second contract over the next few off seasons, look at the situation we are in with players like Edelman, Talib, Spikes, and Blount. We have been able to go make mistakes like Fanene, Lloyd, Amendola, Arrington, Washington, Johnson, and others over the past 2-3 years because we had so many players on rookie contracts but if we keep making those mistakes and eating up our cap space we are going to be screwed in the next few years and watch all our top players walk out the door.

 

[mgteich]

Believe it or not, best practices is NOT keep all your players. It is important to get lots of value from those in their rookie contracts. It is also important to get value out of relatively low-priced free agents.

After that, you can choose where to spend the real money. We choose where to spend money and resources. The patriots emphasize the lines. I think that it is a good thing.

We will always lose some out good players coming off their rookie contracts. We will always be deciding about inexpensive free agents who have played well for us for cheap (Edleman and Blount).

Brady decided on the extension for peanuts because he wanted to retire here. The reality is that the patriots might not have paid out $20-25M a year for an extension.

I do not think anyone is convincing Brady to sign anything, I think that he is in a situation where he is married to a woman who is worth an estimated $290 million, and he makes a substantial amount of money modeling. This allows him to sign at a lower cost to give the team the ability to build a better team. The question you have to ask yourself is how does Brady feel about the decisions made with the money he is willingly freeing up for the Patriots?

Keep in mind that 32/53 players on our roster at the end of the season were on rookie contracts, that is going to change we will have to pay our starting RB, X-WR, LT, RDE, MLB, OLB, RCB, FS and others over the next few years. What happens then?

Do you think we can retain –


• Devin McCourty
• Chandler Jones
• Nate Solder
• Shane Vereen
• Stevan Ridley
• Donta Hightower
• Alfonzo Dennard
• Brandon Spikes
• Marcus Cannon
• Ryan Mallett

All of them will be looking for their second contract over the next few off seasons, look at the situation we are in with players like Edelman, Talib, Spikes, and Blount. We have been able to go make mistakes like Fanene, Lloyd, Amendola, Arrington, Washington, Johnson, and others over the past 2-3 years because we had so many players on rookie contracts but if we keep making those mistakes and eating up our cap space we are going to be screwed in the next few years and watch all our top players walk out the door.

 

[Patsrock]

Of course, all of Brady's money is guaranteed.

This is my point. There is no way Brady signs any of the extensions or restructures the last 4 years with having 100% guaranteed deals.

 

[TonyTucker]

More horses, less ponies

The only thing I'll agree with those two idiots F&M on is their money paid at the top. Brady is a phenomenal deal, but Mankins is way overpaid (routinely gets his lunch eaten in the big games), Gronk can't stay healthy, Amendola can't stay healthy, Connelly is overpaid. Wilfork and Mayo are as well, but they come closer to what they're getting paid than the others. Gostowski is the next highest paid, eh, whatever.

But there's also Hernandez, who as we know was not exactly the best cap management on their part, plus the absurd contract they gave him to begin with. I never understood the fascination, he was just a big receiver. He had one move, that one jump stop thing that everyone kept falling for. Was he good in the red zone? Not really. People actually claimed he was more valuable than Gronk.

 

[Brady6]

Believe it or not, best practices is NOT keep all your players. It is important to get lots of value from those in their rookie contracts. It is also important to get value out of relatively low-priced free agents.

After that, you can choose where to spend the real money. We choose where to spend money and resources. The patriots emphasize the lines. I think that it is a good thing.

We will always lose some out good players coming off their rookie contracts. We will always be deciding about inexpensive free agents who have played well for us for cheap (Edleman and Blount).

Brady decided on the extension for peanuts because he wanted to retire here. The reality is that the patriots might not have paid out $20-25M a year for an extension.

The next 3 free agent periods we will be faced with the following:
• Aqib Talib - LCB
• Ryan Wendell - OC
• Brandon Spikes - MLB
• Julian Edelman - ZWR
• LeGarrette Blount - RB 1B
• Michael Hoomanawanui - 2nd TE
• Vince Wilfork - NT
• Stephen Gostkowski - PK
• Dan Connolly - RG
• Tommy Kelly - DT
• Steve Gregory - SS
• Nate Solder - LT
• Devin McCourty - FS
• Matt Slater - Gunner
• Shane Vereen - 3rd Down RB
• Stevan Ridley - RB 1A
• Ryan Mallett - Backup QB
• Marcus Cannon - 6th OL
• James Develin - FB
• Sealver Siliga - Backup NT
• Brandon Bolden - Backup RB
• Chandler Jones - RDE
• Donta Hightower - OLB
• Alfonzo Dennard - RCB
• Ryan Allen - P

Which will leave us with the following starters or primary role players on our team:
• Brady - QB
• Dobson - XWR
• Gronkowski - TE
• Mankins - LG
• Vollmer - RT
• Ninkovich - LDE
• Mayo - OLB

 

[BelichicksHoodie]

The next 3 free agent periods we will be faced with the following:
• Aqib Talib - LCB
• Ryan Wendell - OC
• Brandon Spikes - MLB
• Julian Edelman - ZWR
• LeGarrette Blount - RB 1B
• Michael Hoomanawanui - 2nd TE
• Vince Wilfork - NT
• Stephen Gostkowski - PK
• Dan Connolly - RG
• Tommy Kelly - DT
• Steve Gregory - SS
• Nate Solder - LT
• Devin McCourty - FS
• Matt Slater - Gunner
• Shane Vereen - 3rd Down RB
• Stevan Ridley - RB 1A
• Ryan Mallett - Backup QB
• Marcus Cannon - 6th OL
• James Develin - FB
• Sealver Siliga - Backup NT
• Brandon Bolden - Backup RB
• Chandler Jones - RDE
• Donta Hightower - OLB
• Alfonzo Dennard - RCB
• Ryan Allen - P

Which will leave us with the following starters or primary role players on our team:
• Brady - QB
• Dobson - XWR
• Gronkowski - TE
• Mankins - LG
• Vollmer - RT
• Ninkovich - LDE
• Mayo - OLB

That's not a unique problem to us, virtually every team in the league will go through a litany of free agents like that in the next three years. Very few teams have guys signed through 2016. Just look at Seattle and San Francisco, they're probably worse off FA wise than we are.

 

[Miguel]

The only thing I'll agree with those two idiots F&M on is their money paid at the top. Brady is a phenomenal deal, but Mankins is way overpaid (routinely gets his lunch eaten in the big games), Gronk can't stay healthy, Amendola can't stay healthy, Connelly is overpaid. Wilfork and Mayo are as well, but they come closer to what they're getting paid than the others. Gostowski is the next highest paid, eh, whatever.

Wilfork signed his contract in March, 2010. It was known then that his 2014 cap number would be $11.6 million. If it takes 4 years for them to complain about Wilfork's contract, then it was a good one.

Mankins signed his contract in August, 2011. It was known then that his 2014 cap number would be $10.5 million. If it takes 2.5 years for them to complain about Mankins' contract, then it was a good one.

Shame on them for not disclosing that they were using my cap page as a reference.

I have the Patriots listed on my cap page in descending order by cap number. When McCourty's cap number increased I forgot to move him up to 8th place. I noticed that today when I am updating my net cap savings column. Gost does not have the 8th highest cap number. He has the 9th.

It is easy to opine on contracts with 20-20 hindsight.

I do not recall that many people thinking that the contracts of Mankins, Wilfork, and Gronk were bad when they were executed. If Connelly is overpaid, then he gets cut with a dead money hit of $1,083,334.

Every NFL team carries dead money. It is the cost of business. Until someone can document that the Patriots have been carrying dead money at a higher rate than the NFL AND that the dead money has helped prevent the Pats from winning a Super Bowl since the 2004 season I would just believe in the Patriots business model.

 

[1960Pats]

The four major contracts in question are:
LLoyd, Fanene, Chad Johnson and Leon Washington. One looks to be a case of fraudulent representations, one was a misfit (Lloyd) with good first year performance, and two were gambles that failed.

The fifth (Ras-I Dowling) is the one that can come back and bite us in the rump if he stays healthy for the Jets. He was good enough in his limited time to warrant another chance. The same goes for the TE they picked up from us, Sudfeld. They gave up on him awfully fast. That makes this a roster question and not a cap question, as some here have already mentioned.

 

[1960Pats]

This is my point. There is no way Brady signs any of the extensions or restructures the last 4 years with having 100% guaranteed deals.

He didn't have to sign anything. It was because he wanted to stay here that he gave up the opportunity to make a lot more on the open market. That is what I think people refer to when they say he gave up money. As the cost of top NFL QBs goes up, the cost of ours will be going down. Just another reason to like the kid.

 

[1960Pats]

That's not a unique problem to us, virtually every team in the league will go through a litany of free agents like that in the next three years. Very few teams have guys signed through 2016. Just look at Seattle and San Francisco, they're probably worse off FA wise than we are.

In three years those two teams will have tons of cash tied into Wilson and Kaepernick, while we'll have Tom Brady going for his 4th or 5th SB title for cheap money. Then we'll understand the break the kid gave the Pats.

 

[Miguel]

but Mankins is way overpaid (routinely gets his lunch eaten in the big games).

Did F&M mention what they would do with Mankins or did they just complain?

 

[Deus Irae]

The only thing I'll agree with those two idiots F&M on is their money paid at the top. Brady is a phenomenal deal, but Mankins is way overpaid (routinely gets his lunch eaten in the big games), Gronk can't stay healthy, Amendola can't stay healthy, Connelly is overpaid. Wilfork and Mayo are as well, but they come closer to what they're getting paid than the others. Gostowski is the next highest paid, eh, whatever.

But there's also Hernandez, who as we know was not exactly the best cap management on their part, plus the absurd contract they gave him to begin with. I never understood the fascination, he was just a big receiver. He had one move, that one jump stop thing that everyone kept falling for. Was he good in the red zone? Not really. People actually claimed he was more valuable than Gronk.

Routinely meaning "Two or three times over the course of 8 years".