2024 NFL Draft Thread (Continued..)

[jmt57]

One week, there were five QBs starting games in the NFL, who got their start with the Pats.

This was back when Ryan Mallet was still in the league since he was one of them.

The Pats have had a great history of developing useful QBs.

Ryan Mallett (RIP) was another selection that I didn't care for at the time; again, it just seemed too early, in my opinion. Brian Hoyer was a capable backup, and was still young.

That draft would have been fantastic (Solder, Vereen, Ridley, Cannon) if the injury concerns about Ras-I Dowling (#33 overall) hadn't turned out to be valid.

 

[PatsFan2]

Here is a thought question.

If Daniels, Maye and McCarthy were not in this draft, how high would Penix and Rattler be projected to go?

Certainly both would be 1st round.

Penix would likely be top 5.

Also, of all of the top 4 QBs, assuming they are not busts, which one has the longest career?

Now it would depend on who drafts them of course, but I worry about Daniels’ longevity.

Whoever drafts him is going to hold their breath every time he takes a hit.

To answer your question I will say not all a shot out to my man State. People are Sleeping on the Second Tier QB's from this group like Penix Jr - Spencer Rattler and Michael Pratt. Yeah the word is many of those guys flame out but sometimes there might be a Jimmy G or Purdy in that group.

 

[ScottishPatriots]

I need a list of teams in the past 20 years who traded out of the top 5 and found a franchise quarterback by doing it.

The trade down strategy sounds like more of the same crap turning 1 big lottery ticket into 3 smaller ones without any historic proof of it actually working, what if you trade down and draft a tackle and he's a bust?

Everyone talks like it's some automatic the LT and WR you get from this trade is some sort of guaranteed hit, there's been plenty of bad offensive linemen picked in the top 15 in the last 15 years, the hit rate is slightly higher than QB but it's still far from a sure thing.

If you trade away the 3rd pick and Drake Maye becomes a pro bowler, you're as likely to be fired as you drafting him and him busting at least you tried to hit a quarterback, i would rather miss trying than give one away to build some middler.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Is a Kirk Cousins or Jared Goff Potential type QB a bad thing?? What if we build by loading up similar to what Detroit and Atlanta did with Elite players then try to get a QB that make it all work I'm all for that approach. I don't want to Draft QB @ 3 and sit him a year might as well take one @ 23 or 34 if you're going to do that.

Yes because you can't always surround a QB with the best receivers, TE's, RB's and OL. At some point, the QB needs to be able to make others better. No matter how good the coaching is. Even if you have two to three studs on offense. Just ask SF about that.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

To answer your question I will say not all a shot out to my man State. People are Sleeping on the Second Tier QB's from this group like Penix Jr - Spencer Rattler and Michael Pratt. Yeah the word is many of those guys flame out but sometimes there might be a Jimmy G or Purdy in that group.

And that's not enough to actually win a SB against an elite QB who doesn't make many mistakes.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

I need a list of teams in the past 20 years who traded out of the top 5 and found a franchise quarterback by doing it.

The trade down strategy sounds like more of the same crap turning 1 big lottery ticket into 3 smaller ones without any historic proof of it actually working, what if you trade down and draft a tackle and he's a bust?

Everyone talks like it's some automatic the LT and WR you get from this trade is some sort of guaranteed hit, there's been plenty of bad offensive linemen picked in the top 15 in the last 15 years, the hit rate is slightly higher than QB but it's still far from a sure thing.

If you trade away the 3rd pick and Drake Maye becomes a pro bowler, you're as likely to be fired as you drafting him and him busting at least you tried to hit a quarterback, i would rather miss trying than give one away to build some middler.

And if they are a hit...who cares if a team doesn't have a top flight QB.

Going for short cuts (Penix, Nix) to get other picks, isn't a good strategy imo. Because you end up like the Tua Dolphins or Cousins Vikings. Always a QB short.

 

[PatsFan2]

And that's not enough to actually win a SB against an elite QB who doesn't make many mistakes.

C'mon Mahomes there's only so much of those Guys not everybody is going have that one Mahomes possibly Burrow if his hand is ok.

 

[PatsFan2]

And if they are a hit...who cares if a team doesn't have a top flight QB.

Going for short cuts (Penix, Nix) to get other picks, isn't a good strategy imo. Because you end up like the Tua Dolphins or Cousins Vikings. Always a QB short.

Wasn't Kirk Cousins one of the Highest paid FA's in 24??

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Penix Jr #1 Daniels #2 Maye #3 Bo Nix #4 JJ McCarthy #5 Rattler #6.

If you pass on Maye/Daniels for this guy, he better be a pro bowl QB within two years max imo. Other wise, Mayo/Wolf are gone.

That would be one of the biggest teaches in NFL history. Not that I believe there is a chance that they have him rated ahead of Maye/Daniels.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

C'mon Mahomes there's only so much of those Guys not everybody is going have that one Mahomes possibly Burrow if his hand is ok.

The problem isn't just who they play. It's that they haven't proven anything without weapons surrounding them.

Guys like Burrow & Allen don't necessarily need weapons everywhere to win. And this QB at 3 will need to be in that Burrow/Allen tier to win in the AFC imo. Anything less than that probably won't be enough.

So no, he doesn't need to be Mahones. But he needs to be in that tier below.

 

[PatsFan2]

If you pass on Maye/Daniels for this guy, he better be a pro bowl QB within two years max imo. Other wise, Mayo/Wolf are gone.

That would be one of the biggest teaches in NFL history. Not that I believe there is a chance that they have him rated ahead of Maye/Daniels.

Just to be Clear I think the Best Guy is Daniels bar none but you can't tell me that Maye is better than Penix Jr right now. Put Talent around Penix Jr and you're in good hands his last College game ain't going to sway me nobody was beating Michigan.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Wasn't Kirk Cousins one of the Highest paid FA's in 24??

Yeh...he's great at getting paid. But he's not so great against equal or better competition.

He is the worst type of QB to have. He will keep you relevant enough to sniff/make the postseason. But not good enough to beat at least three great teams to win a SB imo.

Organizations won't go away from him though because he does just enough. Which is why I phrased it as "worst type of QB."

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Just to be Clear I think the Best Guy is Daniels bar none but you can't tell me that Maye is better than Penix Jr right now. Put Talent around Penix Jr and you're in good hands his last College game ain't going to sway me nobody was beating Michigan.

I'd personally go for Maye over Penix every day of the week. Patriots aren't contending for a SB anyways next year. So Maye can afford to sit.

Maye's ceiling is such that he won't need talent at every position to succeed. Sometimes, you have to take risks.

 

[Ivan]

Is a Kirk Cousins or Jared Goff Potential type QB a bad thing?? What if we build by loading up similar to what Detroit and Atlanta did with Elite players then try to get a QB that make it all work I'm all for that approach. I don't want to Draft QB @ 3 and sit him a year might as well take one @ 23 or 34 if you're going to do that.

If just being good is your goal then they will be just fine. If being great is your goal then you are never going to get there with those kinds of QB’s. Both have been surrounded by really good players, neither has won a Super Bowl.

I want them to build a great team, that requires a great QB.

 

[Ivan]

Yeh...he's great at getting paid. But he's not so great against equal or better competition.

He is the worst type of QB to have. He will keep you relevant enough to sniff/make the postseason. But not good enough to beat at least three great teams to win a SB imo.

Organizations won't go away from him though because he does just enough. Which is why I phrased it as "worst type of QB."

Right on the money.

 

[Ivan]

I need a list of teams in the past 20 years who traded out of the top 5 and found a franchise quarterback by doing it.

The trade down strategy sounds like more of the same crap turning 1 big lottery ticket into 3 smaller ones without any historic proof of it actually working, what if you trade down and draft a tackle and he's a bust?

Everyone talks like it's some automatic the LT and WR you get from this trade is some sort of guaranteed hit, there's been plenty of bad offensive linemen picked in the top 15 in the last 15 years, the hit rate is slightly higher than QB but it's still far from a sure thing.

If you trade away the 3rd pick and Drake Maye becomes a pro bowler, you're as likely to be fired as you drafting him and him busting at least you tried to hit a quarterback, i would rather miss trying than give one away to build some middler.

Agree completely. And the “ trade down for a haul” crowd always leave out the fact they will have to turn around and give up the same haul to go up and get their franchise QB.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Right on the money.

Thx.

I don't know how people can watch the SB and decide to just get a decent QB. Surround him with weapons. And things will work out.

In the end, it did not work out for the 49ers. Twice.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Agree completely. And the “ trade down for a haul” crowd always leave out the fact they will have to turn around and give up the same haul to go up and get their franchise QB.

This isn't being emphasized enough.

Why collect picks to move up for a lesser QB when you can get one free now?

 

[Ivan]

Thx.

I don't know how people can watch the SB and decide to just get a decent QB. Surround him with weapons. And things will work out.

They are more interested in just being good, and hopefully make the playoffs next year, than they are in building a great team that will win Super Bowls. It’s all about immediate rewards. And almost all of them have a raging boner for Marvin Harrison Jr., and seem to believe that WR is the most important position on the team.

 

[PatsFan2]

I'd personally go for Maye over Penix every day of the week. Patriots aren't contending for a SB anyways next year. So Maye can afford to sit.

Maye's ceiling is such that he won't need talent at every position to succeed. Sometimes, you have to take risks.

Who do you think is the better prospect J Daniels or D Maye?? The Commanders are going to tell us but going off a hunch I'd say J Daniels.