Bizarre hold Belichick has on the Cleveland Browns…20 years after last playof...

[1960Pats]

Re: Bizarre hold Belichick has on the Cleveland Browns…20 years after last playoff wi

Well ... duh ... that's why it's the dog pound ... one stinky kennel of a fandom.

I've met many Browns fans over the years, and they have all been very respectful to me. Any problems they have now are because of the hatred they have for Belichick. It's too bad too, because I think an earlier poster was correct that the Browns are special to Belichick.

 

[1960Pats]

Re: Bizarre hold Belichick has on the Cleveland Browns…20 years after last playoff wi

I didn't know the owner intentionally tried to recreate the magic. I still think Romeo and Ratfredo would have taken better jobs if they could have. The Browns management has royally sucked for a while.

Lombardi has been with quite a few teams since the Browns, too.

It's interesting that Belichick's coaching tree has mostly been a bust, while Parcells has been incredible.

Of course, I'd rather have the great coach who wants stability and consensus over the guy who chooses brilliant guys who will challenge him because he likes the give and take (and somebody else to do the work, I guess).

What damn good does it do us to have a former coach do well elsewhere? None!

Parcells progeny have to be the best ever, I'm guessing.

This coaching tree stuff is nonsense to me. All coaches pick things up from all over the place. Why don't we hear more about the coaching tree of Ray Perkins? He was the one who took in Parcells and Belichick wasn't he? Belichick was there 4 years before Tuna took over.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Re: Bizarre hold Belichick has on the Cleveland Browns…20 years after last playoff wi

Art Modell completely screwed the fans, coaching staff and players in 1994 after refusing to participate in the city's master plan which wound up building Jacobs Field. Belichick and his band of future NFL coaches and GMs had the team on the right track but were derailed by the announcement of "The Move."

After watching "A Football Life- The 1995 Cleveland Browns" I did some reading as I had forgotten the chain of events that forced Modell to leave CLE. I think if you read the articles below, you'll come up with a couple of different views on the set of circumstances that forced Art to move the team.

1) Modell agreed with a sin tax to fund a new stadium- not refurbish CLE Stadium

2) Initially, CLE did offer Modell a stadium deal, but made him second fiddle to the Indians & Jacobs.

3) Once CLE figured out how much Jacobs and Gund area would cost taxpayers, it proposed a renovation deal to Modell.

4) With the Indians move to Jacobs Field, his team started losing money as he grossly miscalculated the amount of revenue he would lose when the Indians moved to Jacobs Field.

5) He started talking to BAL and his banker buddy Al Lerner in March of 1995.

6) After learning of the BAL's deal, there was no way in hell the City of Cleveland was going to be able an match the deal Modell was getting from City of Baltimore...Stadium deal. Revenues, etc....no way.

7) I don't think you can say that Art didn't negotiate in good faith because...well, he didn't really negotiate at all.

When Art Modell moved his Cleveland Browns team to Baltimore: How The Plain Dealer reported it | cleveland.com

Art Modell was offered a stadium for the Cleveland Browns and passed: Mark Naymik | cleveland.com

After moving to BAL he went from an operating loss of $21m over two years to operating in the black by approx $30m a year. Plus the valuation of his franchise went from $200m to worth I think around $800m when Biscotti bought 49% in 2000 and the remaining for $325 in 2004..

 

[RayClay]

Re: Bizarre hold Belichick has on the Cleveland Browns…20 years after last playoff wi

I think the biggest failures were RAC, Weiss, and JMD. Although I thought Mangini did an ok job at NYJ and wasn't given enough time in Cleveland.

In college, however, Saban, Ferentz, and the job BO'B did to bring Penn State back have been excellent.

I thought RAC did a good job, especially standing up to Winslow. He brought them to 10-6 at one point. He got undercut by his GM, which is the type of thing that happens in bad programs.

 

[AQPE]

Re: Bizarre hold Belichick has on the Cleveland Browns…20 years after last playoff wi

Arguably it's better for us if they fail. Mangina or Romeo or JM succeeding could/would have had a direct negative effect on the Patriots success.

As to why BB's tree has had much less success? IMHO it has to do with BB the man being a freak of nature. An almost bizarre ability to be machine like in method and action (I think it was Brady who said "BB is the most consistent person I have ever known'). Others trying to mimic this coaching style will probably have a hard time succeeding with it if they don't possess a similar robotic ability. That's my guess......

I agree with you that BB's success here in comparison to that of his "progeny" is almost entirely attributable to his unique skill set. I think, however, that an underrated factor relative to this success is whom BB works for. I think his relationship with the Krafts is a key element that has the others elsewhere have not had. That and Ernie Adams of course.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

1. Holy crap almost 20 years since the Ravens came to Baltimore. Time flies.

2. Guys, isn't the premise here the glassiest of all glass houses for Pats fans? THINK people: what team, based on prior personal history, might be described as having a "bizarre hold" over the Patriots/Belichick? (Hint: There's a Manning there and it's also where the Yankees are from.)

3. Coaching trees: I think we adopted this model in regards to Bill Walsh because the tree was so prolific, and started so quickly w/Seifert, who was quickly successful, and who spawned so many successful (super bowl winning) "offspring"....
Greatest NFL Coaches - The Bill Walsh coaching tree - ESPN

It also has a branch of walrus-like coaches who might better be described as a sub-species than a coaching tree in Holmgren & Reid.

I don't remember hearing anything about "coaching trees" before the 9ers back in the 80s... now it's become something every "great coach" is supposed to have.

Feh. For right now I'll take another ring, right now, this year, when it's supposed to be a Manning year. I want Peyton's poor little fingers and tootsies to get too cold and I want his O-line to get badly beat, so he can do Manning Face, then throw the line under the bus at the presser. I want to roll into MetLife Stadium in New York, perhaps in the snow, and, smack in the middle of the city that never sleeps b/c the JEST and Yankees fans now see the Pats/Sox in their nightmares and keep people awake screaming, I want the Pats to get Ring #4.

Only trees I care about are the ones JEST fans have been hanging themselves from ever since Belichick scribbled the fatal line on a napkin after a one-day stint at the helm: "I resign as the HC of the NYJ." A tree grows in Brooklyn just so that this can happen.