Bedard: Dont blame Welker, blame the pass

[patsderoer]

Re: Bedardont blame welker,Blame the pass

I think he's right...it's after he hit the ground the ball came out after twisting his body. The writer also said "Brady only threw four back-shoulder throws downfield to Welker all season."

And some clown here was claiming that it was a routine catch for Welker. Yeah right. Only 4 back-shoulder throws all year, and none of them thrown high. So Welker was surely expecting the pass on his right shoulder or close to his chest. Brady decided to experiment and test new things right at the most crucial time in the Superbowl. Great timing. He made the catch as difficult as possible for Welker, when there was absolutely no reason for it, as the safety had no hope in hell of making a play on the catch, as he was too far away.


Until now I claimed that the blame lies 90% with Brady for the incompletion, now I will claim that the blame lies 100 % with Brady for the incompletion.

 

[Bella*chick]

Was BB banging at their door and they said "Begone! I REFUSE YOU!"?
The truth is sometimes you almost have to overpay. We could have drafted too.
We have been in need of a legit WideOut since Moss left. BB knew that which is why he got 85. At a point, we all knew Ocho wouldn't work yet he kept him.

Welker is an elite WR. Does Calvin Johnson do what Welker does? The man had 1500yrd and is a 100reception WR. If he doesn't deserve top $, then who does? He is the best Slot Receiver in the game

Who was available?

We got Ocho and yes, it was apparent it wasn't working out but if they got rid of him, what happens to that six million he was being paid! Do we get it back? I somehow doubt it.

 

[IllegalContact]

He needs to be paid according to his skill set. He is a great player but he flubbed that pure and simple. Know one knows that better than him. It hit him on BOTH HANDS. You can't call yourself an elite anything if you can't make a catch that hits you on both hands.

ok...... it sounds like he will be free to go to someone like the lions where he would be a perfect complement. obviously, based on your opinion, the pats aren't going to tag him.


brady threw a ball behind branch....is he no longer elite?

 

[JFK]

I understand this.

Welker is an inside the numbers, shallow and intermediate option-- a slot receiver.

But he still needs to catch the ball if it hits both his hands. He said it himself that it's a catch he's made a 1000 times in his career.

The warrior in him said that. Welker doesn't make those catches very often. At least not in games. I have seen him drop those passes. It's just not his strength. Yes he has made them sometimes but not enough for me to expect him to make them consistently.....Anyways such is life

 

[Bella*chick]

ok...... it sounds like he will be free to go to someone like the lions where he would be a perfect complement. obviously, based on your opinion, the pats aren't going to tag him.


brady threw a ball behind branch....is he no longer elite?

I don't know what the Pats should do. Personally, I want to keep Welker. However they decide to do that is up to them. I'm sure they'll make the best decision for the team.

As for Brady's bad throws, well, many are claiming the magic to be gone, the clutchness, the whatever based on these last few years. Thing is, he's earned that reputation over and over. He's been part of championship squads, and made the plays he's needed to. Welker has too, over the years, but never on the biggest stage. This was the chance and he dropped it. He knows it, why don't you see it?

 

[Elijah T.]

Wes deserves at least 7mil a year. Brandon Lloyd deserves about 5mil a year. We can afford both. I was optimistic about Edelman but he simply isn't as reliable as Welker. He is greater after the catch though.

I don't know if I would want to do that.

I like Lloyd, but he's going to be on his 6th team in 10 years. That says something to me. Is he a hard worker? Reliable? I don't know if I want to pay him 5 million a year with the guaranteed money.

Again, as good as Wes is, I would rather invest 8-10 Million a year in Marques Colston (Top 5 at his position) and let Branch and Edelman play inside for 3 or 4 million total the next two seasons.

We still have Hernandez and Gronk to think about in 2013.

 

[BigHoss28]

The blame lies with both players, to make any other claim is just wrong.

 

[patsderoer]

Who was available?

We got Ocho and yes, it was apparent it wasn't working out but if they got rid of him, what happens to that six million he was being paid! Do we get it back? I somehow doubt it.

Six million to Ochostinko? When Welker made only 2mil? Madness. Pure madness.

If ochostinko got 6mil, Welker deserves at least as many money, if not more.

 

[reflexblue]

while it wasn't the easiest ball to catch (the throw wasn't the greatest) i still think he should have caught it., he had his hands on it.

 

[BradyManny]

Bedard has been trying too hard to standout recently. I'm rather disappointed.

Maybe his Globe colleagues are rubbing off on him.

He could've, like Mike Reiss, just made a quick, salient point about why this was a tough catch for Welker. Instead, he's trying to make the story about himself and pretend he's somehow more analytical than the rest of us.

Everyone knows Brady rarely throws back shoulder to Welker. You don't need to cite rewatching all 185 targets or whatever to make that obvious. Greg - everyone else here saw all 185 tosses to Welker, too - and we didn't get paid to do it because we have jobs. I really like this guy, but does he want a medal for performing his occupation of actually watching NFL football? Gimme a break.

Moving on, the reason the back shoulder pass seemed high - and if you watch it again it's clear - is because Welker slowed up as the pass came in order to jump. It wasn't necessary. And that's b/c Welker is not used to that throw.

So, no, I don't know why Brady threw back shoulder. He probably had time to zip it in there before the safety was there.

Questionable decision by Brady.

Bad pass catch attempt by Welker.

Not worthy of three paragraphs of self-important over-thinking.

Greg, please do not follow the Albert Breer path to the dark side, where intelligent analysis intended to educate is quickly replaced by overwrought analysis intended to draw attention to oneself.

The only thing I agree with in Bedard's mental gymnastics is that Brady should've stepped up and deflected blame from Welker post-game. I am disappointed in Brady for that. Welker is a close friend, and a teammate. And there would be no downside in Brady saying "I made a poor throw." I expect that from Brady and he normally does it.

 

[BigHoss28]

Re: Bedardont blame welker,Blame the pass

And some clown here was claiming that it was a routine catch for Welker. Yeah right. Only 4 back-shoulder throws all year, and none of them thrown high. So Welker was surely expecting the pass on his right shoulder or close to his chest. Brady decided to experiment and test new things right at the most crucial time in the Superbowl. Great timing. He made the catch as difficult as possible for Welker, when there was absolutely no reason for it, as the safety had no hope in hell of making a play on the catch, as he was too far away.


Until now I claimed that the blame lies 90% with Brady for the incompletion, now I will claim that the blame lies 100 % with Brady for the incompletion.

It's flat out wrong to not place some blame on Welker.

 

[IllegalContact]

Re: Bedardont blame welker,Blame the pass

It's flat out wrong to not place some blame on Welker.

its wrong to blame anyone at this point......what does it serve? what's the point? OK......its welkers fault, the solution is simple.....just don't re-sign him. except that if it weren't for welker, they would not have gotten to the SB.

better to just thank him for a good season

 

[BigHoss28]

Re: Bedardont blame welker,Blame the pass

its wrong to blame anyone at this point......what does it serve? what's the point? OK......its welkers fault, the solution is simple.....just don't re-sign him. except that if it weren't for welker, they would not have gotten to the SB.

better to just thank him for a good season

I agree. But I'm talking about the context of this article and subsequent thread.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I understand what Bedard is saying and why he's saying it. But at the end of the day that's a throw that is clearly good enough and a catch you have to make as an all pro. He's decrying the route on one hand and saying TD if the throw is better. All they needed there was a catch for a first down. Brady can't always make the ideal throw for a lot of reasons. If he could life would be easy... Welker and every successful receiver on this team will tell you Tommy gets them in position to make plays better than any QB in the league - often despite their own limitations - and that is a big part of their success (just ask those who have left) and their job is to catch the ball when it's clearly close enough to and not just when it's perfect. Brady has never had the kind of prototype elite WR's some of his near peers and even not remotely peers have who make consistently tough catches in pressure situations. He may have a TE emerging in that role, but he wasn't a viable option on Sunday night. Welker and Moss have been the closest to it, but Moss wasn't that player for long here and Welker's wheelhouse (like Brady's options) is limited and something better defenses increasingly focus on which is why he was running that route in that game. The missed catch was on a catchable throw. Brady and Welker both know that. It is what it is. Aweful for Welker and all concerned. But it's what happens when you have little or no margin for error.

 

[JMarr]

I understand this.

Welker is an inside the numbers, shallow and intermediate option-- a slot receiver.

But he still needs to catch the ball if it hits both his hands. He said it himself that it's a catch he's made a 1000 times in his career.

Can we stop with this nonsense already? His statement is pure hyperbole. He's trying to be accountable by saying this. That's the Patriot Way. Nothing more. To use the statement to bolster your argument that the catch should have been made is borderline asinine.

In spite of what Welker might have said, anyone thinking that is anywhere near an easy catch for any receiver clearly has never played football competitively at any point in their life.

The fact that we probably win the Super Bowl if Wes makes that catch is causing normally sensible posters to make ridiculous assessments of that play.

 

[Elijah T.]

Can we stop with this nonsense already? His statement is pure hyperbole. He's trying to be accountable by saying this. That's the Patriot Way. Nothing more. To use the statement to bolster your argument that the catch should have been made is borderline asinine.

In spite of what Welker might have said, anyone thinking that is anywhere near an easy catch for any receiver clearly has never played football competitively at any point in their life.

The fact that we probably win the Super Bowl if Wes makes that catch is causing normally sensible posters to make ridiculous assessments of that play.

It's simple..Welker takes a half step on the back shoulder throw after his turn with the ball hitting his hands, he falls back with the ball dropping into his chest as he secures it. He falls onto his back...He did it in the first game against Buffalo and again mid-season. Same throw.

Instead Welker decides to hop and attempt to 'hands catch it' while maintaining his balance. He made the catch harder on himself then he needed to.

I understand he was giving a hyperbole answer, but the point remains, it's a catch he's able to make and it's a catch he's made in the past.

Either way, I'm not concerned with debating who was at fault. They both had part in it.

Welker shouldn't be labeled because of that catch. He made a 100 catches we needed this year.

 

[BradyManny]

Actually, Triumph in the Welker thread has the best breakdown I've seen - and a much better breakdown than Bedard's, which seems very pedestrian by comparison now.

Bottom line - given the coverage, Brady was supposed to throw back shoulder there. But it's still a really difficult catch for Welker.

I think that says it enough. Brady still should've taken blame off Wes.

 

[patsderoer]

Wes never did make that catch in his best season, this season. Only 4 back-shoulder throws, and none of them high. Brady experimented in the worst possible moment. If Brady throws it anywhere near Welker's chest or stomach, Welker makes the catch.

Blame Branch for his two drops. Those were really drops, if only Welker was there instead of Branch he would had caught those throws.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

Don't blame the pass

I disagree with Bedard. Freeze this video at the 1:24 mark:

Patriots Stand By Welker - ESPN Video - ESPN

If Brady throws to Welker's right shoulder, #21 is going to knock Welker into next week, assuming he doesn't just knock the ball down. He had to throw to Welker's left shoulder to lead him away from the defender.

The "problem" is that Welker initially looked over his right shoulder for the ball. If he had looked over his left shoulder he could have kept stride.

 

[letekro]

I'm willing to go out on a limb and say both guys were less than stellar on that particular play. Whatever the cosmic reason for it, 2004 and before we made all the big plays at the biggest moments, after 2004, we piss ourselves at the biggest moments.