Battling for Roster Spots

[supafly]

There would be no need for the "money" position if the New England Patriots roster incorporated two linebackers proficient in pass coverage.

Well, we know that isn't going to happen anytime soon...

At least not this year, and probably not the next unless we'd somehow hit gold in FA or the draft right off the bat.

 

[ATippett56]

At least not this year, and probably not the next unless we'd somehow hit gold in FA or the draft right off the bat.

I thought that was the reason why Bill Belichick drafted linebacker Jamie Collins.

 

[ATippett56]

Yeah he was limited way back in OTA's/minicamp with an undisclosed injury. He wasn't a full participant even then.

Not sure what the specific nature of the injury is of course.

I don't know if he played in the first game or not, but I don't think he did.

I'm putting you on the spot:

Patiently waiting to defend the next "bubble" player in this summer's training camp.....

Who is it this year?

 

[supafly]

I thought that was the reason why Bill Belichick drafted linebacker Jamie Collins.

Well, the thought was that we need 2 efficient LB's in coverage--so I was actually assuming that Collins may be one of those two. If he pans out of course.

 

[supafly]

I'm putting you on the spot:

Patiently waiting to defend the next "bubble" player in this summer's training camp.....

Who is it this year?

First let me explain that it was more of an inside joke due to my defense of Julian Edelman and Sterling Moore last summer--both of whom did indeed make it.

Now on to the question....I'm going to be a solid 3/3 in the past two seasons with my bubble players who everyone gave up on.

(Drumroll....)

TIM TEBOW--and no, I don't necessarily agree or "like" the choice.

 

[ATippett56]

Well, the thought was that we need 2 efficient LB's in coverage--so I was actually assuming that Collins may be one of those two. If he pans out of course.

Jerod Mayo is a three down linebacker, which is why Mayo gets paid the big bucks.

 

[ATippett56]

Now on to the question....I'm going to be a solid 3/3 in the past two seasons with my bubble players who everyone gave up on.

(Drumroll....)

TIM TEBOW--and no, I don't necessarily agree or "like" the choice.

You will have to excuse me, I need to go to the bathroom and throw up.

 

[supafly]

Jerod Mayo is a three down linebacker, which is why Mayo gets paid the big bucks.

A viable 3 down LB, yes...

An effective enough strength coverage LB at the moment? Not really. Not enough to do away with the need for the hybrid LB/S as you're suggesting.

On top of that, we'd still need Collins to completely pan out, so I'm not holding my breath that there will suddenly be TWO good coverage LB's.

 

[supafly]

You will have to excuse me, I need to go to the bathroom and throw up.

I'd also include A.Wilson in that group, although he isn't half as controversial as any of the 3 mentioned were/are.

Edelman and Moore were pretty much considered castoffs last summer. Strangely enough I'm not as confident this summer that Edelman definitely makes it as I was last summer--although I think he's earned a spot for sure. It was iffy a couple of wks ago though.

Yeah, after Tebow I'd have AWilson, and even one of Dowling/Cunningham, although those aren't exactly huge predictions like Tebow is.

 

[ATippett56]

On top of that, we'd still need Collins to completely pan out, so I'm not holding my breath that there will suddenly be TWO good coverage LB's.

With regard to Collins, you may have to wait for that year two progression.

 

[ATippett56]

A viable 3 down LB, yes...

An effective enough strength coverage LB at the moment? Not really. Not enough to do away with the need for the hybrid LB/S as you're suggesting.

The problem is Brandon Spikes is god awful in pass coverage and that was, once again, the case against the Detroit Lions in the third game of the preseason.

 

[supafly]

The problem is Brandon Spikes is god awful in pass coverage and that was, once again, the case against the Detroit Lions in the third game of the preseason.

Spikes is so completely overrated by the majority in my opinion. His awful coverage and inability to play all 3 downs is just one more reason why he won't be here next season.

Aside from his awesome run stopping ability and hard hits, he's lacking in many other areas such as coverage, maturity, leadership, injuries, and possibly even focus.

He'll likely want a pact that is much closer to one of the better 3 down LB's such as Sean Lee than what Belichick is willing to pay him.

 

[supafly]

As a matter of fact many here don't remember all of the thoughts that Spikes was a bust etc prior to his late 2011 run when he returned from injury. That provided a spark to the defense for the playoff run (then again, so did Chung) as that continued to carry over throughout the 2012 season.

Time will tell what kind of player Spikes will be this season, but to this point he's had more inconsistency that many are willing to remember, not only with injuries (starting only 28/48 games so far), but also mental lapses, lack of speed, horrible coverage etc--although to be fair that could be attributed to a learning curve for the 2010 and majority of 2011 season.

Either way I personally feel that he's overrated. That said I would still like to see him retained for the right price due to his strengths and my hope that he's made a nice turn, but my concern is that he seems to be the kind of player that goes where the money leads him. I hope that I'm wrong, that he continues to progress, and that he ends up staying for a reasonable price; but he'll always be nothing more than a 2 down run stuffer who is a liability in coverage. He can make a better case for himself by improving in certain areas and staying healthy.

 

[Nunchucks]

Spikes is so completely overrated by the majority in my opinion. His awful coverage and inability to play all 3 downs is just one more reason why he won't be here next season.

Aside from his awesome run stopping ability and hard hits, he's lacking in many other areas such as coverage, maturity, leadership, injuries, and possibly even focus.

He'll likely want a pact that is much closer to one of the better 3 down LB's such as Sean Lee than what Belichick is willing to pay him.

I think that some of Spikes inability to cover can be masked with scheme and film study. I think the Lions game was a "show me" game for Spikes. Belichick put him out there and let him do the best he could to cover...of course covering Bush is going to be next to impossible for any LB in the league.

Do not underrate the physical presence he brings to the defense, the swagger is noticeable, he is also a very effective run stopper and gap filler.

He is definitely worth bringing back, but if he is let go, that is fine too.

 

[Deus Irae]

The problem is Brandon Spikes is god awful in pass coverage and that was, once again, the case against the Detroit Lions in the third game of the preseason.

There's probably not a linebacker in the NFL who wouldn't be "god awful" in coverage against Reggie Bush.

 

[50-yard-line]

I thought this article regarding Adrian Wilson's troubles so far was relevant to the discussion. Although most of us have AWilson making the team without any problem, the reality may be that he's squarely on the bubble a lot more than we may think.

Of course the article also mentions the woes of Gregory at times, the obvious struggles that Tavon Wilson has had in his supposed regression from mediocre play of last season, and the "learning curve" that is involved with new rookie Duron Harmon and his growing pains that will come throughout his first season here.

In other words, the depth behind McCourty pretty much sucks at this point in time. Once thought of as a potential position of strength, safety looks like a major wildcard for the 2013 season in a lot of eyes.

Somewhere Deus Irae is still reeling from Belichick's decision to pass on a higher round safety who was more talented, and many of us likely agree with him. Any of AWilson, Gregory, and Harmon/TWilson would have been just fine for 3rd/4th/5th spots or rotational value, but none of the above appear to be sufficient starters opposite of Devin McCourty. We may be forced to go back to the drawing board once again at a high round pick in the secondary of the 2014 draft.

Veteran Adrian Wilson stuck on bubble | Boston Herald

Funny, though, that the article focuses on the 67-yard screen to Bush in the Lion's game. That play exploded because Jerod Mayo got smoked by Reggie Bush. Yeah, Wilson and a whole lot of other players looked caught, as well, but to be fair, the play was covered, and blown, by a pro-bowl linebacker.

Rumor has it that Mayo flew back to Detroit today, trying to find his jock.

 

[Froob]

Spikes is so completely overrated by the majority in my opinion. His awful coverage and inability to play all 3 downs is just one more reason why he won't be here next season.

Aside from his awesome run stopping ability and hard hits, he's lacking in many other areas such as coverage, maturity, leadership, injuries, and possibly even focus.

He'll likely want a pact that is much closer to one of the better 3 down LB's such as Sean Lee than what Belichick is willing to pay him.

with all due respect, how can you say he lacks leadership without being in the lockeroom? I'd say spikes is underated on this forum. most people would jump for joy if he got us a 5th round pick. guy could easily be the dif between a first round exit and a super bowl. remeber the fumble vs arizona, the pick in the 2011-12 afccg? or the hard hit on freddie jackson last season?

 

[IllegalContact]

My Picks with the last spot going to Dowling or Wilson

QB (2) Brady, Mallett
RB (6) Ridley, Vereen, Bolden, Blount, Washington, Develin
WR (6) Amendola, Dobson, Thompkins, Edelman, Boyce, Slater
TE (3) Gronkowski, Sudfeld, Ballard
C (2) Wendell, Stankiewitch
G (3) Mankins, Cannon, Connolly
T (3) Solder, Vollmer, Svitek
DE (5) Jones, Ninkovich, Francis, Benard, Buchanan
DT (4) Wilfork, Kelly, Forston, Vellano
ILB(3) Hightower, Spikes, Beauharnais
OLB(3) Mayo, Collins, Fletcher
CB (5) Talib, Dennard, Arrington, Ryan, Cole
SS (2) Wilson, Harmon
FS (2) McCourty, Gregory
ST (3) Gostkowski, Mesko, Aiken

I'm not seeing 6 RB's if gronk ain't ready week 1...... I'm not necessarily seeing it if he is ready to go......rest of it is pretty damned good...hopefully we can find someone better than vellano....

depending how the dennard hearing goes, I'd be on the prowl for a DB on the wire......I think dowling is done

 

[goheels22002]

QB (2) Brady, Mallett
RB (5) Washington, Vereen, Bolden, Blount, Ridley
WR (6) Amendola, Boyce, Edelman, Slater, Thompkins, Dobson
TE (3) Ballard, Sudfeld, Gronkowski
C (2) Wendell, Stankiewitch
G (3) Mankins, Connolly, Cannon
T (3) Solder, Svitek, Vollmer
DE (4) Ninkovich, Benard, Francis, Jones
DT (4) Wilfork, Forston, Vellano, Kelly
ILB(3) Spikes, Fletcher, Beauharnais
OLB(3) Mayo, Collins, Hightower
CB (6) Talib, Arrington, Ryan, Dowling, Cole, Dennard
SS (3) Wilson, Wilson, Ebner
FS (3) Gregory, Harmon, McCourty
ST (3) Aiken, Mesko, Gostkowski

Total players: 53
Created with Pats Picker: Pats Picker 2013

 

[fnordcircle]

I wanna know who the shocking cut will be, there seems to be someone every year we all expect to see on the final 53 who is shown the door.