Curran:Patriots have deep-seated, and vexing, problems

IllegalContact said:

I'm telling you that the team is still in training camp

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So we're not only bad, but we're stupid. Great.

BadMoFo said:

So we're not only bad, but we're stupid. Great.

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Could be worse

We could actually be that bad.....I'll hold out hope for a few weeks

VrabelJr said:

I'm as down on our coaches as any other right now, but I'm trying really hard to figure out where the heck you are going with this.

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I'm just questioning whether some members of the coaching staff have the proper intelligence to do their job...because the coaching job last night looked the work of a high-schooler.

How? People forget that the Pats last year were a 4-3 defense and they let Talib play press man and follow the best receiver all over the field. This team is far better suited for a 4-3 man. Hopefully with Dennard and Browner returning, they will go that way.

Rob0729 said:

How? People forget that the Pats last year were a 4-3 defense and they let Talib play press man and follow the best receiver all over the field. This team is far better suited for a 4-3 man. Hopefully with Dennard and Browner returning, they will go that way.

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I just think our defense is suited for a far simplified scheme. All this nonsense of every player playing 3-5 different positions is too much on the players. There's nothing wrong with putting your best players out there and letting them do what they do best and see if the other team can stop you. We have the talent to be able to do that without all these wacky defensive play calls.

VrabelJr said:

I just think our defense is suited for a far simplified scheme. All this nonsense of every player playing 3-5 different positions is too much on the players. There's nothing wrong with putting your best players out there and letting them do what they do best and see if the other team can stop you. We have the talent to be able to do that without all these wacky defensive play calls.

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as curran implies

Too many bells, too many whistles, too much effort given to confusing the opposing quarterback instead of scaring the crap out of him. Just let the damn guys play.

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But this is belichick's defensive scheme. Its not going to change. He wants coverage and pressure with 4 linemen. And he doesnt have the players for it.

Lacking toughness - Spikes allowed to walk, Mankins traded
Lacking run stoppers and LB depth - Spikes allowed to walk
Lacking OL talent - Mankins traded, nothing but rookies and 'rookies' brought in
Lacking TE talent - a WR listed at a TE is brought in, scrubs compete for TE2 before that
Lacking WR talent - A WR3/WR4 is brought in
Lacking DT depth and health with multiple players post-op - Second best interior DL allowed to walk, rookie recovering from his second ACL surgery is brought in
Lacking DE depth - Jake Bequette is gonna save the day!
Lacking an S2 - Chung is brought back

Forgot one....

Don't trust your RB1 - Let the guy who took over the RB1 job last year just walk away

Deus Irae said:

Lacking toughness - Spikes allowed to walk, Mankins traded
Lacking run stoppers and LB depth - Spikes allowed to walk
Lacking OL talent - Mankins traded, nothing but rookies and 'rookies' brought in
Lacking TE talent - a WR listed at a TE is brought in, scrubs compete for TE2 before that
Lacking WR talent - A WR3/WR4 is brought in
Lacking DT depth and health with multiple players post-op - Second best interior DL allowed to walk, rookie recovering from his second ACL surgery is brought in
Lacking DE depth - Jake Bequette is gonna save the day!
Lacking an S2 - Chung is brought back

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I'd add misuse of Revis somewhere in the mix but you're spot on.

Deus Irae said:

Lacking toughness - Spikes allowed to walk, Mankins traded
Lacking run stoppers and LB depth - Spikes allowed to walk
Lacking OL talent - Mankins traded, nothing but rookies and 'rookies' brought in
Lacking TE talent - a WR listed at a TE is brought in, scrubs compete for TE2 before that
Lacking WR talent - A WR3/WR4 is brought in
Lacking DT depth and health with multiple players post-op - Second best interior DL allowed to walk, rookie recovering from his second ACL surgery is brought in
Lacking DE depth - Jake Bequette is gonna save the day!
Lacking an S2 - Chung is brought back

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Inspite of all these blunders , they are not playing their players to the best of their ability. We can add that to the list.

Blount carried the offense at the end of the year....so what do they do.....let him walk and entrust the big back role to the RB they had no trust in last year...AND STILL DON'T.....and allow a scat back to be the #1 guy. Arm tackles bring down Vereen.....WTF is BB doing.?? It defies logic!!
Ridley, Dobson, Amendola, Wright, Thompkins....5 playmakers wiped from game plans. WTF is BB doing???
And can we put an end to the Rutgers farm system

VrabelJr said:

SAT scores don't measure intelligence.

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Actually, they do.

ive said this in my other thread. but the coaching is mis-using players and not putting them in the best position to succeed.'

you have a bunch of press-man corners...and you have them playing soft read and react zone coverage? why?? it will be a complete misuse of revis/browner if we play this next week as well.

on offense, you activate 5 RB's, 3 TE's and only have 3WR's active but the gameplan is to spread them out??? who's bright idea was that? with that personnel, run the ball. or have thompkins/dobson active.

all these decisions come from the coaching. just like the rediculous notion of using chandler jones as a 3-4 DE vs. Miami. its like the coaches have the talent but are acting "too smart and cutesy" with their plays.

oh, lets play a soft zone!, lets run vereen the middle! maybe its time to simplify things? play 4-3 press man. have revis follow the best receiver. Run the ball heavily with Ridley a operate off play action. no more of this "vereen run up the middle on third down" inactivate our sophmore receivers.

belicheck thinks he is more clever than he actually is.

Jackson 2 said:

Actually, they do.

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"Intelligence" as a catch-all term is mostly meaningless. SAT scores measure one kind of intelligence (but not other kinds - spatial, street smarts, artistic, musical, etc.), but whether the intelligence it measures is actually at all a useful kind of intelligence is at best questionable. There's correlation between SAT scores and outcomes in college (this is why it's used) but that doesn't imply causation - there's also a ton of confounding factors in there as well (rich people do better on the SATs and better in college, for instance, so some of the "intelligence" the SATs are measuring is actually just straight up wealth).

Pointless aside, but I couldn't leave it. Would have been just as vexing as the Patriots' deep-seated issues.

primetime said:

"Intelligence" as a catch-all term is mostly meaningless. SAT scores measure one kind of intelligence (but not other kinds - spatial, street smarts, artistic, musical, etc.), but whether the intelligence it measures is actually at all a useful kind of intelligence is at best questionable. There's correlation between SAT scores and outcomes in college (this is why it's used) but that doesn't imply causation - there's also a ton of confounding factors in there as well (rich people do better on the SATs and better in college, for instance, so some of the "intelligence" the SATs are measuring is actually just straight up wealth).

Pointless aside, but I couldn't leave it. Would have been just as vexing as the Patriots' deep-seated issues.

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You're right, it does measure one type of intelligence, as I posted. There are other instruments which measure other intelligences. The SAT measures one's aptitude and likelihood of succeeding in college.

The team was bad last year in my opinion, they were just fortunate to have a crappy schedule. The media are using statistics to make their case, I am using my own eyes to make the case. The Patriots offense were out of sync and getting beat down by crappy teams and then making last minute come backs at the end. They shouldn't have been in close games against garbage like Cleveland, NYJ or the Texans as sorry as they were last year. The only reason we beat the Saints, is because the Saints were too busy celebrating their victory instead of finishing the game. We were able to beat Denver last year, because Manning couldn't get those old nerves warmed up in the cold and windy weather, when those nerves got warmed up in the playoff game, he insulted the Patriots defense, like everybody else seems to do, even the scrubs and jags for QB. I knew the Patriots offense would struggle this year or still be trash, but with the signing of Revis and returning players on D, I thought defense would at least be good. Turns out they are only good when they are facing garbage like Matt Cassel, that sh** QBs brother out there in Oakland or any of the crap that plays in the AFC East at QB right now.

Jackson 2 said:

Actually, they do.

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Actually, they don't. This is why an entire industry of SAT preparation has sprung up. If it actually measured aptitude or intelligence, all of the studying/prep in the world wouldn't change your score. It's a test to measure how likely you are to do in college. Here's some more reading: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/sats/test/what.html

Jackson 2 said:

You're right, it does measure one type of intelligence, as I posted. There are other instruments which measure other intelligences. The SAT measures one's aptitude and likelihood of succeeding in college.

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The SAT does not measure aptitude.

VrabelJr said:

Actually, they don't. This is why an entire industry of SAT preparation has sprung up. If it actually measured aptitude or intelligence, all of the studying/prep in the world wouldn't change your score. It's a test to measure how likely you are to do in college. Here's some more reading: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/sats/test/what.html

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Actually, they do, which is why all that entire industry is not producing gajillions of kids getting 100 percent correct every year. It's a flawed test on that basis, but that's different from being a non-starter.

Need this guy to phone Pats coaches

Not surprised at the offense because they didn’t do a single thing to improve it. I am surprised how bad the defense has played so far especially with all the talent they have.

My thoughts: the past few seasons pats have had a trip superbowl, two trips to the AFC championship. So I suppose we cannot deny overall how well they have played. However at some point it gets old making it so far then falling short year after year because BB is so stuck in his ways with letting key players go, trading away picks for a couple of picks 4 years from now, signing value players and overall believing that no matter who in on the field Brady will somehow find a way to win. Trading away key players, having 13m in salary space and not using it, not upgrading the offense and adding value picks have may finally cause this team to have and 8-8 or 7-9 season.

Year after year Manning has had a good line and some weapons while BB's game plan is just relying on Brady to make due with what he has. Maybe the Broncos won't win the SB but at Elway is not wasting Manning's last few year signing value players because it could possibly effect the team in 2018.