Let’s talk special teams

Which players are you putting on your 53 man roster for the primary purpose of special teams contributions? These are the ones I have likely to make the roster:

Ryan Allen
Stephen Gostkowski
Danny Aiken
Matthew Slater
Nate Ebner
Tavon Wilson
Michael Buchanan
Brandon Bolden
Pat Chung

I just have not decided on the rest, kick returner, special teams linebacker, those are all up in the air.

For what it's worth, here are a couple of links to compare who received the most playing time on special teams for the Patriots the last two seasons. I'll take the first one from 2013 with a grain of salt in regards to accuracy; for example, they don't list Kanorris Davis at all, and he played in three games (plus two in the playoffs), and had 21 ST snaps in the Bengal game alone.

Special Team Player Snaps Count Stats: 2013 Season | Sporting Charts
489 total ST snaps




Patriots by the numbers: 2012 snap counts - Extra Points - Boston.com
495 snap counts

Brady6 said:

Which players are you putting on your 53 man roster for the primary purpose of special teams contributions? These are the ones I have likely to make the roster:

Ryan Allen
Stephen Gostkowski
Danny Aiken
Matthew Slater
Nate Ebner
Tavon Wilson
Michael Buchanan
Brandon Bolden
Pat Chung

I just have not decided on the rest, kick returner, special teams linebacker, those are all up in the air.

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Primary purpose of special teams contributions and then you adding Buchanan etc? Or do you mean WHO there could make the roster and be on ST ?
For ST only P - K - LS should be the only players, some would add Slater / Ebner to the list.

I do not understand the meaning of your list.

Clearly these are not the STers with the most rep. Collins and Chris White would be on that list.

It is not the special-teams-only list. Buchanan isn't on that list.

As much as it pains us, someone is our #3 safety. Unless that player is one of our corners, all of the backup safeties cannot be making the team based on special teams play.

As far as likely to make the roster, I disagree with you idea that we will keep 6 safeties.

Brady6 said:

Which players are you putting on your 53 man roster for the primary purpose of special teams contributions? These are the ones I have likely to make the roster:

Ryan Allen
Stephen Gostkowski
Danny Aiken
Matthew Slater
Nate Ebner
Tavon Wilson
Michael Buchanan
Brandon Bolden
Pat Chung

I just have not decided on the rest, kick returner, special teams linebacker, those are all up in the air.

Click to expand...

jmt57 said:

For what it's worth, here are a couple of links to compare who received the most playing time on special teams for the Patriots the last two seasons. I'll take the first one from 2013 with a grain of salt in regards to accuracy; for example, they don't list Kanorris Davis at all, and he played in three games (plus two in the playoffs), and had 21 ST snaps in the Bengal game alone.

Special Team Player Snaps Count Stats: 2013 Season | Sporting Charts
489 total ST snaps
Listed above

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Thanks JMT. really surprised at Collins. Looks like that list favors keeping some special teams LBs.

RayClay said:

Thanks JMT. really surprised at Collins. Looks like that list favors keeping some special teams LBs.

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Yes, 3 backup LB's have been near the top for the past couple of years, and I think for a long time before that. I have often thought of the 4 position LB's and the 2 STers as the normal set. Most of rosters seem to now include 6 linebackers. We should recognize that 3 need to top special teasers.

Curiously, excluding the 3 specialists, the top 10 group for 2012 and 2013 has include the same structure: 5 defensive backs, three linebackers, a DE/LB and Slater.

In addition to arguing for 6 LB's, this analysis also argues for 5 safeties, although we could have 4 if Harmon played more special teams than he did last year.

Either I haven't been paying attention or we lost a lot of ST snaps to ppl who left in offseason...there will be quite a few open ST spots, especially so if ppls final roster projections are close to correct, since even more names from last year will be gone

ALP said:

Either I haven't been paying attention or we lost a lot of ST snaps to ppl who left in offseason...there will be quite a few open ST spots, especially so if ppls final roster projections are close to correct, since even more names from last year will be gone

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I think that you haven't been paying attention.

Of the top TWENTY on the 2013 list, only Fletcher and Cole are gone.

There are several new backup LB's competing with Chris White for the 2-3 backup spots.

With regard to defensive backs, I suspect that Ryan and Harmon will get more ST reps than last year. I also expect us to keep at least 2 out of Chung, Wilson and Ebner.

mgteich said:

I think that you haven't been paying attention.

Of the top TWENTY on the 2013 list, only Fletcher and Cole are gone.

There are several new backup LB's competing with Chris White for the 2-3 backup spots.

With regard to defensive backs, I suspect that Ryan and Harmon will get more ST reps than last year. I also expect us to keep at least 2 out of Chung, Wilson and Ebner.

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Well Collins is gone, at least he won't be playing 75% of the snaps. combind that with Fletcher and that's a lot of snaps.

I find it interesting that the 1st link that JMT put up also doesn't have Justin Green on it. Green also took some of the ST snaps that had been Cole's after Cole was released last year.

I think that it will be interesting to see who gets snaps on special teams since Hooman and Gronk aren't on the field as TEs... That could explain why Chandler Jones got so many ST snaps last year.

Also, I'm fairly confident that Bolden's time with the Pats is nearing an end. Particularly with White getting so many reps and Finch getting time on KR/PR.

The Pats could, very well, go with 3 RB and 1FB/TE in Develin.

RayClay said:

Well Collins is gone, at least he won't be playing 75% of the snaps. combind that with Fletcher and that's a lot of snaps.

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LBs to watch for on Special Teams:
Darius Fleming, Cameron Gordon (if he plays), Taylor McCuller, James Morris and Deontae Skinner, James Anderson (if he plays).

McCuller could have an inside track since he's been taking snaps at FB as well. This could translate into him being a lead blocker in KRs.

DaBruinz said:

I find it interesting that the 1st link that JMT put up also doesn't have Justin Green on it. Green also took some of the ST snaps that had been Cole's after Cole was released last year.

I think that it will be interesting to see who gets snaps on special teams since Hooman and Gronk aren't on the field as TEs... That could explain why Chandler Jones got so many ST snaps last year.

Also, I'm fairly confident that Bolden's time with the Pats is nearing an end. Particularly with White getting so many reps and Finch getting time on KR/PR.

The Pats could, very well, go with 3 RB and 1FB/TE in Develin.

Click to expand...

Perhaps it's only regular season (not remembering exactly when Cole was cut).

DaBruinz said:

I find it interesting that the 1st link that JMT put up also doesn't have Justin Green on it. Green also took some of the ST snaps that had been Cole's after Cole was released last year.

I think that it will be interesting to see who gets snaps on special teams since Hooman and Gronk aren't on the field as TEs... That could explain why Chandler Jones got so many ST snaps last year.

Also, I'm fairly confident that Bolden's time with the Pats is nearing an end. Particularly with White getting so many reps and Finch getting time on KR/PR.

The Pats could, very well, go with 3 RB and 1FB/TE in Develin.

Click to expand...

I'm feeling Bolden's time is up, but I expected a short yardage replacement and they are/were both washouts IMO. I am surprised they're playing Finch, considering his fumbles and lack of size. Maybe they see him as a "special" player like a Sproles or Leon Washington, who wasn't recognized because of limited opportunities in college.

RayClay said:

Perhaps it's only regular season (not remembering exactly when Cole was cut).

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Cole was cut a three times last year. Once at the end of camp. Again on October 4th. And the final time came on December 23rd..

mgteich said:

I do not understand the meaning of your list.

Clearly these are not the STers with the most rep. Collins and Chris White would be on that list.

It is not the special-teams-only list. Buchanan isn't on that list.

As much as it pains us, someone is our #3 safety. Unless that player is one of our corners, all of the backup safeties cannot be making the team based on special teams play.

As far as likely to make the roster, I disagree with you idea that we will keep 6 safeties.

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6 safeties? I actually see Ebner as more of special teams linebacker than a safety.

Brady6 said:

6 safeties? I actually see Ebner as more of special teams linebacker than a safety.

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And why would that be?

DaBruinz said:

Also, I'm fairly confident that Bolden's time with the Pats is nearing an end. Particularly with White getting so many reps and Finch getting time on KR/PR.

The Pats could, very well, go with 3 RB and 1FB/TE in Develin.

Click to expand...

It is an interesting situation at RB. I see Ridley, Vereen, White (and Devlin) as pretty sure things, with Finch as a long shot. White replaces Blount but they are different kinds of backs. If they cut Bolden after letting Blount go, that leaves them very thin at lead back should Ridley get injured or drop the ball. One thing I'll watch tonight is how White and others look in pass protection.

Jamie Collins: 74.4%
Chris White: 67.1%
Nate Ebner: 66.5%
Dane Fletcher: 58.5%
Matt Slater: 51.9%
Tavon Wilson: 51.7%

Marquice Cole: 42.3%
Michael Buchanan: 41.1%
Devin McCourty(!): 38.0%
Kyle Arrington: 37.6%
Stephen Gostkowski: 37.6%
Danny Aiken: 33.1%
Ryan Allen: 33.1%
Chandler Jones(!): 32.5%
Brandon Bolden: 31.1%
Logan Ryan: 25.2%
James Develin: 24.9%
Michael Hoomanawanui: 23.1%
Duron Harmon: 21.5%
Julian Edelman: 19.8%
Dont'a Hightower: 18.4%
Steve Gregory: 17.8%
Matthew Mulligan: 17.8%
Ryan Wendell: 17.2%
Logan Mankins: 16.6%
Nate Solder: 16.6%
Dan Connolly: 16.4%
Joe Vellano: 16.0%
Rob Ninkovich: 14.9%
Marcus Cannon: 14.1%
Will Svitek: 13.9%
Chris Jones: 13.7%
Brandon Spikes: 12.1%
Kanorris Davis: 10.8%

Brady6 said:

6 safeties? I actually see Ebner as more of special teams linebacker than a safety.

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You list 6 safeties on your roster. Ebner is a safety competing with other safeties for backup safety positions. The #4 and #5 safety positions should always be a top special teamer. Ideally, the #3 should also be a top special teamer.

Backup safeties and backup LB's are almost always among our top special teamers. That is part of their job description

Now that most of us have settled on the likelihood of 6 linebackers and 5 corners (plus Browner), the OPEN question is the number safeties. And yes, I understand that one of the 6th LB could be beaten out by a safety.
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HOW MANY DEFENSIVE BACKS ACTUALLY PLAY
To me, the corps is 4 corners and 3 safeties. In most games, we need 3 corners, 2 safeties and a dime back. I think that we usually suit up a 7th and 8th defensive back, depending on opposing team, and who is the dime back. If the corner is the dime back, as expected, then I would expect to have 5 corners and 3 safeties active, with the 8th defensive back only playing in an emergency.
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HOW MANY SAFETIES
We need a 3rd safety who is the first safety off the bench. This role could be take by a corner. So, how many backup safeties do we need, beyond 3. Even if we move a corner if there is an injury, I think that we all are fine with at least 3 safeties.

The #4 safety should not be playing defensive back unless there are 2 injuries. He should be a top special teamer. If we have have a 5th, that player will be inactive unless he is a top special teamer.
I think that you are the only one with 6 safeties, for a total of 11 defensive backs, plus Browner.

Some posters think that we will keep 5 safeties, keeping 3 backups. I'm actually OK with that as long as our #3 and #4 safeties can actually be relied on to play the position if needed. I'm actually OK with keeping Chung, Wilson and Ebner. However, I suspect that we will keep 4 safeties. I used to think that we would keep a 5th for 4 weeks. With Butler here, I no longer take that view.

mgteich said:

You list 6 safeties on your roster. Ebner is a safety competing with other safeties for backup safety positions. The #4 and #5 safety positions should always be a top special teamer. Ideally, the #3 should also be a top special teamer.

Backup safeties and backup LB's are almost always among our top special teamers. That is part of their job description

Now that most of us have settled on the likelihood of 6 linebackers and 5 corners (plus Browner), the OPEN question is the number safeties. And yes, I understand that one of the 6th LB could be beaten out by a safety.
================================
HOW MANY DEFENSIVE BACKS ACTUALLY PLAY
To me, the corps is 4 corners and 3 safeties. In most games, we need 3 corners, 2 safeties and a dime back. I think that we usually suit up a 7th and 8th defensive back, depending on opposing team, and who is the dime back. If the corner is the dime back, as expected, then I would expect to have 5 corners and 3 safeties active, with the 8th defensive back only playing in an emergency.
===============================
HOW MANY SAFETIES
We need a 3rd safety who is the first safety off the bench. This role could be take by a corner. So, how many backup safeties do we need, beyond 3. Even if we move a corner if there is an injury, I think that we all are fine with at least 3 safeties.

The #4 safety should not be playing defensive back unless there are 2 injuries. He should be a top special teamer. If we have have a 5th, that player will be inactive unless he is a top special teamer.
I think that you are the only one with 6 safeties, for a total of 11 defensive backs, plus Browner.

Some posters think that we will keep 5 safeties, keeping 3 backups. I'm actually OK with that as long as our #3 and #4 safeties can actually be relied on to play the position if needed. I'm actually OK with keeping Chung, Wilson and Ebner. However, I suspect that we will keep 4 safeties. I used to think that we would keep a 5th for 4 weeks. With Butler here, I no longer take that view.

Click to expand...

I have the following DBs making the team:

1. Darelle Revis
2. Devin McCourty
3. Brandon Browner*
4. Alfonzo Dennard
5. Logan Ryan
6. Kyle Arrington
7. Tavon Wilson
8. Duron Harmon
9. Malcolm Butler
10. Pat Chung
11. Nate Ebner
12. Jamea Thomas

Technically it is 11 DBs because Browner is suspended for the first 4 games. We finished last season with 11 DBs on the roster, and we finished 2012 with 11 DBs on the roster. The majority of our special teams players are DBs.

Of the players I named I think that Ebner, Wilson, Thomas, Butler, Chung, and Arrington will play significant roles on special teams.