Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth...

[WhiZa]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Vince, I'm sure, knows that Haynesworth's contract is unreasonable and will not play out over the whole 7 years.

That's why all the players care about is the guaranteed money. There are plenty of bloated contracts, but they are all fluff. Just like Stallworth's deal with the Pats.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

The last part of your post is why we differ, I can see him leaving if the money isn't right for him. They prepared for him possibly leaving, even if they don't want him to.

If they were preparing for him to leave, they would have gone up and got Raji. Brace isn't nearly athletic enough to replace Wilfork. He'll be an adequate starter at best, which is great for a reserve guy.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Vince, I'm sure, knows that Haynesworth's contract is unreasonable and will not play out over the whole 7 years.

Haynesworht's contract not playing out over the 7 years is exactly what he wanted. He's owed a 20M bonus in the 5th year. He has a 30M cap hit that year.

he's going to make 48M in 4 years, Be a free agent at 31, and get another HUGE payday. In all probability, Haynesworth will make even MORE money than his contract.

 

[BPF]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

The didn't draft two guys who could replace him. They didn't even draft one guy who could replace him. They drafted a guy who could rotate with him and back him up.

I feel for these players. Nothing they say is exactly right enough...

Well said.....Wilfork couldn't be more straughtforward and classy about his intentons or this issue. If he was pulling a Sheldon Brown I would understand but this is the exact opposite. He wants to be here and he will get his new deal signed soon.

 

[BPF]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

This year he is the backup, but next year he could be the replacement if/when Wilford moves on.

Mike Reiss and others are calling him "insurance" and a "fallback plan" so to me that is clear that they view him as a replacement for Wilfork.

Only BB and the Pats FO know what their intentions are not Reiss or anyone else in the media. Brace is insurance if Wilfork gets hurt though and the Pats did have issues vs the run when big VW was being spelled last year. They had no one on the roster who has the size Brace has as a backup.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Brace is a huge space eater in the mold of a Keith Traylor. You don't have to be uber athletic to be an effective NT in the Pats system. You mainly need to be big and strong and play with discipline and leverage. The Pats traded UP with 3 picks to acquire Brace. BB described him as an explosive and powerful guy in his press conference. I think the Pats like him a lot more than people think. And if Wilfork's contract negotiations fall apart, his replacement is already on the roster.

 

[efin98]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Brace is a huge space eater in the mold of a Keith Traylor. You don't have to be uber athletic to be an effective NT in the Pats system. You mainly need to be big and strong and play with discipline and leverage. The Pats traded UP with 3 picks to acquire Brace. BB described him as an explosive and powerful guy in his press conference. I think the Pats like him a lot more than people think. And if Wilfork's contract negotiations fall apart, his replacement is already on the roster.

Don't call him a replacement or else the wrath of his fans will come down on you...

 

[Synovia]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Brace is a huge space eater in the mold of a Keith Traylor. You don't have to be uber athletic to be an effective NT in the Pats system. You mainly need to be big and strong and play with discipline and leverage. The Pats traded UP with 3 picks to acquire Brace. BB described him as an explosive and powerful guy in his press conference. I think the Pats like him a lot more than people think. And if Wilfork's contract negotiations fall apart, his replacement is already on the roster.

THe point is, while Brace would be effective against the run, hes not going to provide the sort of pressure that Wilfork does, nor is he going to be anywhere near as mobile as wilfork. Despite being a giant body, wilfork still makes a ton of tackles away from the middle. 50-60 tackles a year from a 3-4 NT is ridiculous.

 

[hwc]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Brace is a huge space eater in the mold of a Keith Traylor. You don't have to be uber athletic to be an effective NT in the Pats system. You mainly need to be big and strong and play with discipline and leverage. The Pats traded UP with 3 picks to acquire Brace. BB described him as an explosive and powerful guy in his press conference. I think the Pats like him a lot more than people think. And if Wilfork's contract negotiations fall apart, his replacement is already on the roster.

That's how I read the situation as well. Based on the draft and how much Belichick tried to rotate his d-line last year by sitting Seymour and so forth, I'm guessing that Belichick saw players getting gassed in the fourth quarter of games. It sure looks like he wants to be able to constantly rotate players (i.e. spell Wilfork) and keep a fresh d-line on the field.

Insurance for contract negotiation is always an added benefit of depth.

 

[fnordcircle]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

The didn't draft two guys who could replace him. They didn't even draft one guy who could replace him. They drafted a guy who could rotate with him and back him up.

Yeah. Vince Wilfork is hardly worried about his job because a guy who was lucky enough to be A) fat and B) play next to Raji is on the team now.

Brace has shades of Jonathan Sullivan to me.

 

[kierkegaard]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Well in my estimation Wilfork has earned the Seymour treatment and more. As I recall, our deal with Seymour was pretty player friendly. Vince has been way more durable than Sey and every bit as integral to our defense.

Gotta love the encouraging remarks you're hearing from his end.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Well in my estimation Wilfork has earned the Seymour treatment and more. As I recall, our deal with Seymour was pretty player friendly. Vince has been way more durable than Sey and every bit as integral to our defense.

Gotta love the encouraging remarks you're hearing from his end.

Way more durable? In Seymour's first 4 years here, he missed 2 games. In Wilfork's first 4 years here, he missed 3 games. In Seymour's fifth year here, he missed four games, versus zero for Wilfork, so I guess you could use thta to say that Wilfork's proven slightly more durable, but "way" is a massive overstatement.

Also, in Seymour's sixth year in New England, he played in all 16 games- if Wilfork misses any time this year, it could pretty easily even out again. A lot of people here seem to be fixated on Seymour being PUPed for the first half of 2007, due to one bad injury. Aside from his knee getting messed up under pretty random circumstances (I believe that it happened when he was being used as a FB), Seymour's been very durable for the Pats.

 

[PatsDparty]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Yeah. Vince Wilfork is hardly worried about his job because a guy who was lucky enough to be A) fat and B) play next to Raji is on the team now.

Brace has shades of Jonathan Sullivan to me.

When was Raji was on academic suspension for a year, Brace anchored the D and they were #2 in the COUNTRY against the run.

 

[Leave No Doubt]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

I feel for these players. Nothing they say is exactly right enough...

Truth.

Big Vince says what he means imo and by his original statement he completely distances himself from being lumped in with any other player's contract situation. He's done nothing in the past to make us disbelieve him or his motives now.

The Pats drafted a NT because that position is crucial to BB's defense. I have no idea how often a good NT appears on the draft board but it's probably not every year. The Pats would've been crazy not to snag one when they saw it. Depth would be really nice in that position and I hope he makes the team, but I don't think drafting a NT had anything to do with Big Vince's contract or age or anything else like that. Drafting a NT speaks to the value BB places on that position and that he intends to continue using it.

My take is Big Vince will mentor and help as much as he possibly can. There's no reason to think the Pats and Vince won't come to an equitable agreement.

 

[kierkegaard]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Way more durable? In Seymour's first 4 years here, he missed 2 games. In Wilfork's first 4 years here, he missed 3 games. In Seymour's fifth year here, he missed four games, versus zero for Wilfork, so I guess you could use thta to say that Wilfork's proven slightly more durable, but "way" is a massive overstatement.

Also, in Seymour's sixth year in New England, he played in all 16 games- if Wilfork misses any time this year, it could pretty easily even out again. A lot of people here seem to be fixated on Seymour being PUPed for the first half of 2007, due to one bad injury. Aside from his knee getting messed up under pretty random circumstances (I believe that it happened when he was being used as a FB), Seymour's been very durable for the Pats.

Hard to dispute that but when I said "durable" I wasn't speaking strictly of missing games. I am under the impression that Seymour has been hampered by significant injuries for most games of his career, and them having an effect on his performance. Obviously, to what extent, the latter is debatable but I don't recall seeing Vince's name on nearly as many injury reports as Seymour. Perhaps I'm wrong about that.

Do you think its appropriate to say that Seymour has had a relatively healthy career?

 

[BPF]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Brace has shades of Jonathan Sullivan to me.

Huh?? Sullivan had a really short college career and if you remember he ran well at the combine, was actually considered a "workout warrior" which caised him to shoot up draft boards. He was a better athlete than player at DL. No one would ever say big Brace runs well and he certainly is no workout warrior but he will be an excellent run stuffing NT in this league. 3rd and 1 will be tough on teams with a line of Warren-Brace-Wilfork-Seymour.

 

[Fencer]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

Hard to dispute that but when I said "durable" I wasn't speaking strictly of missing games. I am under the impression that Seymour has been hampered by significant injuries for most games of his career, and them having an effect on his performance. Obviously, to what extent, the latter is debatable but I don't recall seeing Vince's name on nearly as many injury reports as Seymour. Perhaps I'm wrong about that.

Do you think its appropriate to say that Seymour has had a relatively healthy career?

Right. His skill, effort, and health haven't ALL been outstanding in most recent seasons.

And didn't he also miss most of a post-season?

 

[ausbacker]

Re: Wilfork talks about contract, and Haynesworth..

I don't subscribe to the theory that Seymour and Wilfork want massive contracts and will walk out after the end of this season.

I believe if we pay them a fair price, the chance to become the greatest dynasty of all time is too attractive to these players to simply walk away like Asante.