Dugger 4 yr extension $58 mil

Pet Mike Reiss

Good move by Bill Wolfe

Pape said:

I like it

Glad Dugger got paid

Sends the right message

Click to expand...

Yes, a great message indeed. "4 wins and everyone gets new deals!"

RxJock1120 said:

So basically we just resigned a bunch of players from 4-13 team, including Dugger who was a massive liability in coverage last year, this makes zero sense to me...

We have basically managed to blow the cap just to retain players who couldn't get us 5 wins...really hate this move!

Barmore would have made a ton more sense.

Click to expand...

There’s plenty of money for both Barmore and Dugger.

Did you think Dugger, Onwenu, Henry, Jennings and Uche were the problem last year? The team went 4-13 but that doesn’t mean everyone was bad. When we were winning, we feasted by picking up good players from bad teams who gave up on those guys — Moss, Welker, Hogan, Rodney, Blount, Dillon, Van Noy - just off the top of my head. Bad teams have talent too.

Let’s focus on who’s gone: Mac, Trent Brown, Parker, Gisecki, Wilson, Zeke, Bryant, Guy, Phillips, Board, Pharaoh Brown. Within that group you’ll find a who’s who of players everyone was complaining about last year. Not all of those guys were bad, and there are other bad players still on the team, but the point is you don’t want to throw the baby out with the bath water. They need to identify the problems and identify the non-problems, and it seems like they’ve done so. Who did they resign that seemed like a problem player? I wish they were able to bring more guys in, but I don’t have a problem with any of those they brought back.

RxJock1120 said:

So basically we just resigned a bunch of players from 4-13 team, including Dugger who was a massive liability in coverage last year, this makes zero sense to me...

We have basically managed to blow the cap just to retain players who couldn't get us 5 wins...really hate this move!

Barmore would have made a ton more sense.

Click to expand...

you def have a future in boston sports talk radio.

RxJock1120 said:

Yes, a great message indeed. "4 wins and everyone gets new deals!"

Click to expand...

If that's what you take away from it, then I don't know what to tell you except you're not seeing the bigger picture. It tells the players - play hard for us, you will get treated fairly.

So yeah, this was a four win team, So what? You want to dump the entire starting 53? Set yourself up like an expansion franchise?

It's important to the future of this team, for this complete rebuild, to cut the wheat from the chaff. To not make more holes in the roster if overpaying a bit for one of your guys who can play and play well fills a need.

zimmy said:

Feels a bit like an overpay at 4 years $58m ($66m max) given they had him for a year at $13m. You would have imagined that 4 years $48-52m max would have been the deal. He will be almost 29 next off season and his price is more likely to be less than $13m rather than more.

All said that, glad we have him long term. Another BB drafted player locked up.

Click to expand...

You have to figure in the 20% raise to tag him again next year. That would've been prohibitive.

Isn't this contract somewhat backloaded? He might not see the 4th yr unless the cap explodes.

Hammer of Thor said:

One of the reasons we’ve been told that Belichick wasn’t as aggressive in signing his own guys is because he wanted the players who craved winning, and sometimes once a player wins they lose their edge. Been there, done that, etc. Well, I guess that really isn’t a problem anymore anyway since they haven’t been winning!

Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing that. It's very interesting. I believe that... Bill really tried to maximize players while on rookie team friendly deals.. draft the next guy as it's cost effective for the organization in his eyes. That formula works only if you win. We did for so long so that too me is why lots of guys never got to a second contact. We need to keep the talent we have, and draft the talent needed offensively..

RxJock1120 said:

So basically we just resigned a bunch of players from 4-13 team, including Dugger who was a massive liability in coverage last year, this makes zero sense to me...

We have basically managed to blow the cap just to retain players who couldn't get us 5 wins...really hate this move!

Barmore would have made a ton more sense.

Click to expand...

He wasn't a massive liability. He was actually really good. You're basing this on a blown play against a TE.

This guy has deserved all league recognition the last 2 years. He really is a top player.

I recently watched the win over the Bills. He dominated.

People forget his 2022 highlights:

RxJock1120 said:

So basically we just resigned a bunch of players from 4-13 team, including Dugger who was a massive liability in coverage last year, this makes zero sense to me...

We have basically managed to blow the cap just to retain players who couldn't get us 5 wins...really hate this move!

Barmore would have made a ton more sense.

Click to expand...

You hate the move because it's for one of the players "who couldn't get us to 5 wins" but Barmore (who was also on the team that couldn't get us to 5 wins) "would have made a ton more sense"

I somewhat recognize this sort of ******** doublespeak. To help narrow it down, are you Felger or Mazz?

Real fan 02 said:

Thanks for sharing that. It's very interesting. I believe that... Bill really tried to maximize players while on rookie team friendly deals.. draft the next guy as it's cost effective for the organization in his eyes. That formula works only if you win. We did for so long so that too me is why lots of guys never got to a second contact. We need to keep the talent we have, and draft the talent needed offensively..

Click to expand...

You have to look at the actual players. This doesn't happen in a vacuum.

We got great production out of Trey Flowers, Jamie Collins, JC Jackson, several others. But they were not worth max contracts. They got those max contracts in the open market, then they were cut. That tells me Belichick evaluated the situation properly.

We did give big contracts to guys that were top performers. Not everyone left. Shaq Mason, Hightower, McCourty, Gilmore re-upped.

I can only think of one guy who we missed on, Thuney, and that's really because Mason ate up all the money for guard.

I have to think that we would've resigned Dugger, Onwenu and Jennings if Belichick had stayed, given the record of the previous 10 yrs.

maust said:

You hate the move because it's for one of the players "who couldn't get us to 5 wins" but Barmore (who was also on the team that couldn't get us to 5 wins) "would have made a ton more sense"

I somewhat recognize this sort of ******** doublespeak. To help narrow it down, are you Felger or Mazz?

Click to expand...

or bertrand or curtis or gresh or jones or mego or arcand or keefe......

RxJock1120 said:

So basically we just resigned a bunch of players from 4-13 team, including Dugger who was a massive liability in coverage last year, this makes zero sense to me...

We have basically managed to blow the cap just to retain players who couldn't get us 5 wins...really hate this move!

Barmore would have made a ton more sense.

Click to expand...

We didn't blow the cap we still have 40 mil or so.

We also still have over 100 mil next year.

Keep some decent players and draft well and this will have been an ok off-season. Get it right and we'll be in a position to make bigger moves.

Good for Dugger. He’s got a talent to separate money from the rich.

upstater1 said:

He wasn't a massive liability. He was actually really good. You're basing this on a blown play against a TE.

This guy has deserved all league recognition the last 2 years. He really is a top player.

I recently watched the win over the Bills. He dominated.

People forget his 2022 highlights:

Click to expand...

Was listening to sports talk this AM and some caller called in about the number of penalties that Duggar gets, one of the hosts then commented that in 3001 defensive snaps he has only gotten something like 5 penalties..
Good move to sign your own, now do Judon, Barmore and Peppers...

Bourne Again Christian said:

ok so QB, WR, OL, LBs have to be the focus of this draft.

Click to expand...

Agreed. A RB would be nice.

DarrylS said:

Was listening to sports talk this AM and some caller called in about the number of penalties that Duggar gets, one of the hosts then commented that in 3001 defensive snaps he has only gotten something like 5 penalties..
Good move to sign your own, now do Judon, Barmore and Peppers...

Click to expand...

I was listening to 98.5 this morning where Kendra said some wildly wrong things about Dugger and a caller said he's never made an impactful play. I had to turn it off.

DarrylS said:

Was listening to sports talk this AM and some caller called in about the number of penalties that Duggar gets, one of the hosts then commented that in 3001 defensive snaps he has only gotten something like 5 penalties..
Good move to sign your own, now do Judon, Barmore and Peppers...

Click to expand...

that sounds like alex barth and cerone battle ....one of the few listenable shows in boston....around 8 am on sundays before that dodo middleton. she's a jville fan so that kind of explains her hate for the pats.

Mayo needs captains for it to work.

upstater1 said:

He wasn't a massive liability. He was actually really good. You're basing this on a blown play against a TE.

This guy has deserved all league recognition the last 2 years. He really is a top player.

I recently watched the win over the Bills. He dominated.

People forget his 2022 highlights:

Click to expand...

Not really, I am basing his dismal pass coverage on the whole year: see attachment for his PFF pass coverage grade.

I'm ok with this all things considered. I think Dugger got put in kind of a losing situation last year. He's not a FS. He's a box SS/LB hybrid type but so is Peppers. They can't both do that full time unless you play dime all the time, so they had to kind of trade off there and it was to the determinant of Dugger's play relative to 2022.

I don't think extending Peppers again next year is the best use of resources now that Dugger is locked in. I think it should be either-or. I was on the fence... I think Dugger is the better player if both are put in their natural full time box SS/hybrid LB role, but I anticipate Peppers being cheaper because there isn't the perceived upside there is with Dugger. I think Peppers probably will be better value, but for a team starving for talent I'm ok splurging for the marginal upgrade. But re-signing both just seems a poor allocation of resources. We should, ideally, let Peppers go next year and spend it on a FS type instead (unless we've drafted/developed someone by then of course, in which case just spend it on another position). Particularly because we invested in Mapu who could handle the depth role when we do want to go dime with 2 box SS/hybrid LB types on the field.

Now, we have so much cap space because we haven't drafted a ton of guys worth paying big money to so maybe it makes sense to just keep Peppers too since you have the cash to burn. So they have to weigh that as well.