Wetzel: Patriots were naive to walk into Goodell's trap

[Dr Pain]

But a better PR effort Brady could be dictating the message than responding to it.

This is impossible as he is being accused, you can't preemptively respond to an accusation yet to be made. They did not realize the depths of the corruption in the NFL. I was shocked as well. I live in a world of big boys and colossal $ deals and come across some bad people at times but Goodell runs the NFL like he is a king and is surrounded by incompetents who are trying to please an incompetent king. After reading the NFLPA document it is even clearer just how out of touch with the legal realities and boundaries of his role Goodell is. Goodell honestly just feels like he is god. He has all ass kissers there and it has warped his little mind. They guy was born with a silver spoon in his mouth, his daddy took care of him and he has never grown up.

 

[TommyD4207]

Sadly, that is what I fear as well.

I think the NFL did their best to secure their "victory" yesterday, no matter what the outcome of the case yields. As you mentioned, people often bring up the taped walk through to this very day--not even realizing that it was proven false.

People will point to the technicalities which occur inside a courtroom, and the language in the labor agreement, should Brady manage to win.

We need some damning evidence to come out in the case.

Why?

As long as Brady doesn't miss a game, that's the best you can hope for under any circumstance, thanks to the owner.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Goodell can levy any penalty on a team. He [obviously] can levy a penalty on a player, then act as an impartial arbitrator. If he couldn't, we wouldn't all be here.

We are hoping, because the players have a union, that his succession of lies, leaks and arbitrary rulings will be found to violate the CBA.

But he, indisputably, cannot levy any 'legal' punishment he wants. He can say in a nicely worded and on NFL letterhead that Tom Brady will be executed at sunrise. I just want to know there is a viable legal remedy which clearly there is. With his prior punishment decisions smacked down, I interpret that to mean whatever 'power for punishment' decisions Goodell thinks he has, he in fact is limited by the CBA (either by CBA's wording or by its lack of wording). Ultimately these prior smackdowns say the wording of the CBA does not give you immunity from abuse of discretion (and they have determined abuse of discretion quite unfavorably for Goodell on at least one occassion).
So is the power to decide guilt equivalent to his power to decide punishment? Put another way, is 'deciding of guilt' and 'deciding of punishment' in the same paragraph or worded similarly, or are these different sections with distinctly different wording?
IMHO this is a massive! point for the upcoming court case. Will the judge say "the CBA and Precedent says I have the power to rule on the validity of level of punishment, however, the CBA is clear that Goodell can all but throw darts at a dart board to decide guilt. He has virtual absolute discretion".
If that is the case then this Brady lawsuit is a fight over degree, little more. Tom is legally guilty now and for all time. There is no remedy for that (which sucks!).
IMLO, abuse of discretion is the key for Brady and his legal team.....specifically abuse of discretion of 'deciding guilt'. If allowed to move forward it will mean a judge/authority will hear evidence on what Goodell used for his decision of guilt, what evidence Brady has to offer, maybe even the sleazy reeking backroom interactions of Goodell's brown shirts/office (all put on record). Maybe best of all, a judge simply ruling that Goodell's power for 'decision of guilt' can be overruled by a judge will be a BFD in the NFL office and just desserts for that crud.

 

[supafly]

Why?

As long as Brady doesn't miss a game, that's the best you can hope for under any circumstance, thanks to the owner.

Damning evidence would obviously show how incorrect the NFL has been, as opposed to Brady simply weasling his way through the language of a labor contract, which will be the popular narrative spun in the media.

Of course we'll take anything at this point, but some strong damning evidence showing that Goodell is a liar and fraud would be a whole helluva lot better. That was my point.

 

[SVN]

Brandt thinks this wwas not surprising considering Brady's team defense has always been around science and nothing else new
http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/07/29/tom-brady-appeal-packers-financial-report-nfl-prosperity

 

[supafly]

This is impossible as he is being accused, you can't preemptively respond to an accusation yet to be made.

His point is that if Don Yee and company really knew that the "destruction of evidence" issue was coming as he suggested yesterday, then why in the hell would they not have made a better attempt (or ANY attempt), at being out in front of such an enormous accusation?

For example, they could have reiterated the fact that they provided new evidence in the appeals process, along with the fact that they carefully provided a spreadsheet account of all calls and messages. It would've taken some of the sting out of the NFL statement in an attempt to be on the other side of things, as opposed to allowing the NFL to dictate their offensive attack.

 

[Ring 6]

He should have repeated himself more loudly.

He didn't say anything to repeat, which was the plan. Any comment he made could be used against him, as we are seeing it is a witch hunt to take anything that means nothing and give it meaning to bury Brady.
I'm talking about the end result, not what would have made us feel better.

 

[Ring 6]

His point is that if Don Yee and company really knew that the "destruction of evidence" issue was coming as he suggested yesterday, then why in the hell would they not have made a better attempt (or ANY attempt), at being out in front of such an enormous accusation?

For example, they could have reiterated the fact that they provided new evidence in the appeals process, along with the fact that they carefully provided a spreadsheet account of all calls and messages. It would've taken some of the sting out of the NFL statement in an attempt to be on the other side of things, as opposed to allowing the NFL to dictate their offensive attack.

They did that.
Are you suggesting that they should have gone to the media and told them what case they presented while Goodell was waiting to rule? I don't think that would be a good idea, and they would have appeared desperate.

The phone is so much a non-issue. They were never getting the phone. You can't destroy evidence that isn't evidence. Brady was not compelled to give up the phone. Brady was advised by counsel that he should not. Brady was never informed that not doing so constituted any punishable action.

The crux of the appeal is that the CBA does not allow you to punish a player without giving them notice in advance what a punishable action is. That argument won the Peterson and Rice cases.

 

[supafly]

They did that.
Are you suggesting that they should have gone to the media and told them what case they presented while Goodell was waiting to rule? I don't think that would be a good idea, and they would have appeared desperate.

The phone is so much a non-issue. They were never getting the phone. You can't destroy evidence that isn't evidence. Brady was not compelled to give up the phone. Brady was advised by counsel that he should not. Brady was never informed that not doing so constituted any punishable action.

The crux of the appeal is that the CBA does not allow you to punish a player without giving them notice in advance what a punishable action is. That argument won the Peterson and Rice cases.

I'm speaking solely in regard to the massive PR hit, not the specifics of the actual court case. As we've seen in the past, even when facts are proven to be false (taping practices), they are still often brought up. In the case of Brady "destroying" his phone, this is no different.

Unfortunately, they allowed the NFL to go on the offensive. If Yee really knew that this bombshell was coming, it could have been handled in a better way, although you seem to disagree and that's understandable.

 

[TommyD4207]

I'm speaking solely in regard to the massive PR hit, not the specifics of the actual court case. As we've seen in the past, even when facts are proven to be false (taping practices), they are still often brought up. In the case of Brady "destroying" his phone, this is no different.

Unfortunately, they allowed the NFL to go on the offensive. If Yee really knew that this bombshell was coming, it could have been handled in a better way, although you seem to disagree and that's understandable.

The Patriots and Brady had a 0% chance of winning any PR battle, and haven't from the beginning. It doesn't matter how Kraft, Brady, Yee or the NFLPA would have handled it.

 

[IllegalContact]

It's just words..........there have been no possible actions by the patriots that would have them in a better position today.........the NFL set a course for the duration that they would be calling the shots.

 

[supafly]

I'm talking about the end result, not what would have made us feel better.

Most feel as though the end result is about Tom Brady's legacy and reputation. It's often been stated that he's got plenty of money, and that his reputation is what means everything to him.

One would think that they may have attempted to take the sting out of such eye opening news by getting out in front of it. After all, it's clearly the most damning news we've heard in the entire 6 month ordeal, even if it eventually means **** all in the court room.

Either way--whatever. They are the experts, so it's hard to question their moves, but that is my concern, and the reason for the comment.

 

[supafly]

The Patriots and Brady had a 0% chance of winning any PR battle, and haven't from the beginning. It doesn't matter how Kraft, Brady, Yee or the NFLPA would have handled it.

I get where you're coming from, but there's a difference between not winning the PR battle and sitting back like a ***** and allowing them to dictate every single move, especially knowing that it's coming as Yee claimed.

Again--we've seen the damage that this created, and the concern is that no amount of technical labor contract language will change it. I suppose it's just gotta be let go, but in my opinion Tuesday's news will haunt him forever. I certainly hope that isn't the case.

 

[TommyD4207]

I get where you're coming from, but there's a difference between not winning the PR battle and sitting back like a ***** and allowing them to dictate every single move, especially knowing that it's coming as Yee claimed.

Again--we've seen the damage that this created, and the concern is that no amount of technical labor contract language will change it. I suppose it's just gotta be let go, but in my opinion Tuesday's news will haunt him forever. I certainly hope that isn't the case.

I'd suggest letting it all play out and seeing if you feel the same way.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm speaking solely in regard to the massive PR hit, not the specifics of the actual court case. As we've seen in the past, even when facts are proven to be false (taping practices), they are still often brought up. In the case of Brady "destroying" his phone, this is no different.

Unfortunately, they allowed the NFL to go on the offensive. If Yee really knew that this bombshell was coming, it could have been handled in a better way, although you seem to disagree and that's understandable.

It would not have been any different PR-wise if Yee announced the day before the appeal hearing that Brady would not be bringing his phone because he got a new one and destroyed the old one.

 

[BradyFTW!]

This is impossible as he is being accused, you can't preemptively respond to an accusation yet to be made. They did not realize the depths of the corruption in the NFL. I was shocked as well. I live in a world of big boys and colossal $ deals and come across some bad people at times but Goodell runs the NFL like he is a king and is surrounded by incompetents who are trying to please an incompetent king. After reading the NFLPA document it is even clearer just how out of touch with the legal realities and boundaries of his role Goodell is. Goodell honestly just feels like he is god. He has all ass kissers there and it has warped his little mind. They guy was born with a silver spoon in his mouth, his daddy took care of him and he has never grown up.

That's what it really comes down to. The NFL always fires off the opening salvo, and therefore they control the narrative. That's inherent in this process. Brady's team can play good defense or bad defense, but they can't change the fact that they're playing defense on the PR front. They're stuck in a purely reactionary position.

Even if they did go out and preemptively address an issue that Goodell was planning on making a huge deal out of, he'd just pivot from that and fabricate outrage over some other nonissue instead.

 

[supafly]

It would not have been any different PR-wise if Yee announced the day before the appeal hearing that Brady would not be bringing his phone because he got a new one and destroyed the old one.

I'd suggest letting it all play out and seeing if you feel the same way.

Fair enough. I disagree, as does Florio (someone seen as quite fair to our side), as well as many other attorneys, but we'll have to agree to disagree and move on.

 

[supafly]

Even if they did go out and preemptively address an issue that Goodell was planning on making a huge deal out of, he'd just pivot from that and fabricate outrage over some other nonissue instead.

I think that's a fair point.