Pats are on the clock

[DW Toys]

Using the handy dandy Box has bad brain flatulence scorecard, Staley is the next BPA option. But, havng landed a rock solid value like Carriker already, you can go a little crazy if you like. That could mean Brian Leonard, or Lamarr Woodley, or a reach for Jason Hill who won't be there at 91, or a reach for the next best CB Josh Wilson. If you wanted to be really crazy you'd reach for Stewart Bradley and move him to ILB. If you felt one Ellis Hobbs was enough, skip Josh Wilson and take raw talent Jonathan Wade.

To recap:
BPA: Staley, not really a need, but a potential All-Pro LT.

More risk, but maybe more for need: Woodley at OLB isn't a pure need, but adds to the LB pool, he might even play ILB some day.
- Leonard at RB/FB is also not a pure need, but makes the RB pool deeper (remember dinged up RBs in January).
- WR Jason Hill had 143 career catches, 111 went for first downs, a deeper WR pool with two vets on one year trial contracts, yuh dig?
- Everybody loves CBs (I'm having flashbacks to that scene in Shrek, "everybody loves cakes."), Wilson is an instant nickelback day one; Wade is taller, as fast, more upside athletically, but rawer.
- Folks have been screaming for an ILB in the draft, if you want one, why not take one that already has the size and can play inside or out, Bradley (a dual purpose LB like Vrabes has to be worth more than a one trick pony, right ).

Lots of folks want a Safety, but you can get a slower CB later for FS and the big SS aren't here. Center is a nice safe pick, Kalil fits the new zone blocking scheme and backs up Koppen through 2011 in case Traylor lands on him again. If you wanted another WR option, Gonzalez is Welker.

Either way, job well done with Carriker, an outstanding choice in the BB mould - you've got a future kid! :rocker:

Cousin,
I know you gentlemen are more up to snuff on all of this, and I do not pretend to be a expert, but I beg to differ on some of your pics, or as others have shouted...waste!

Where does it say that the BAP is the correct way to go? Is it is the Bible? That drives me crazy. If you have needs and there is a player there, if the discrepancy is not night and day, just draft the sucker!

I beg to differ on these but I respect your knowledge. I just think stockpiling players in loaded positions doesn't address items of need. And I don't go for the BAP as I said:

Carriker-Great player. We spend a first on a back up to a young D Line?

Staley-We have 4 tackles with vatious skills. Down the road are they better than Staley? A draft choice is a crap shoot. Yes our 4 guys are better than Staley at this moment.

Wilson-We have Hobbs-Same player-Really a nickel back. To high a choice to waste.

Leonard-Better than Evans. Not right now.

Hill-Love to have him but perhaps a six on the depth cart? For a high choice? Not a good move IMO.

Kilil-Center? Not gonna happen on BB's watch for a first round pick.

I agree on Gonzales

You are on the something with Bradley. Excellent choice. He can play ILB as can Woodley!

DW Toys

 

[italia44]

Carriker would be a fabulous pick....BB is all about "value" picks.

BB/SP don't need a Safety or a CB or an ILB in round
one.....not if the value isn't there.

IMHO,we actually "need" two things:

1.A DE to spell Seymour and fill the Banta-Cain role(this is particularly important against LT and the Chargers)

2.A back-up Nose Tackle to Wilfork.....tough to find,but very, very important.

That's it,IMHO....the rest should be for value,not for position.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

You indeed must be one of my cousins!

Your "need" and my "need" are most likely two different things. I see no gaps in the starting line-up. I see room for reserves at LB, S, RB, and probably CB - there are 10 draft picks to accomplish that mission.

Carriker whom you dislike as waste is a rare talent, he'll move ahead of the Pats #4 & #5 DL on the depth chart if he isn't part of my proposed OLB experiment. (I'd still love to see teams run to their right with Warren and Carriker lined up together, you would force them to pass automatically.)

Staley is instant strong competition for all six Offensive Tackles on the roster (Mankins is a LT moved inside who can play the position if needed, and not on an emergency basis).

Leonard addresses one of my needs, and the only LB below top five whom I rank equivalent to Leonard is Woodley...and we already have OLB four deep.

I'll take another Hobbs any day, be silly not to, especially with Old Man Chad Scott penciled in at nickelback.

Hill's 111 first down catches in 143 career college receptions is an extravagence when the Pats will need to re-sign Caldwell and Gaffney for 2008, plus decide on large roster bonuses for Stallworth and Washington? I hope you weren't among those mooning over WRs in Free Agency.

Kalil not gonna happen, well the odds are against him, but I wasn't aware I had a cousin on BB's staff. What's the chance for sideline passes?

Cousin,
I know you gentlemen are more up to snuff on all of this, and I do not pretend to be a expert, but I beg to differ on some of your pics, or as others have shouted...waste!

Where does it say that the BAP is the correct way to go? Is it is the Bible? That drives me crazy. If you have needs and there is a player there, if the discrepancy is not night and day, just draft the sucker!

I beg to differ on these but I respect your knowledge. I just think stockpiling players in loaded positions doesn't address items of need. And I don't go for the BAP as I said:

Carriker-Great player. We spend a first on a back up to a young D Line?

Staley-We have 4 tackles with vatious skills. Down the road are they better than Staley? A draft choice is a crap shoot. Yes our 4 guys are better than Staley at this moment.

Wilson-We have Hobbs-Same player-Really a nickel back. To high a choice to waste.

Leonard-Better than Evans. Not right now.

Hill-Love to have him but perhaps a six on the depth cart? For a high choice? Not a good move IMO.

Kilil-Center? Not gonna happen on BB's watch for a first round pick.

I agree on Gonzales

You are on the something with Bradley. Excellent choice. He can play ILB as can Woodley!

DW Toys

 

[DW Toys]

You indeed must be one of my cousins!

Your "need" and my "need" are most likely two different things. I see no gaps in the starting line-up. I see room for reserves at LB, S, RB, and probably CB - there are 10 draft picks to accomplish that mission.

Carriker whom you dislike as waste is a rare talent, he'll move ahead of the Pats #4 & #5 DL on the depth chart if he isn't part of my proposed OLB experiment. (I'd still love to see teams run to their right with Warren and Carriker lined up together, you would force them to pass automatically.)

Staley is instant strong competition for all six Offensive Tackles on the roster (Mankins is a LT moved inside who can play the position if needed, and not on an emergency basis).

Leonard addresses one of my needs, and the only LB below top five whom I rank equivalent to Leonard is Woodley...and we already have OLB four deep.

I'll take another Hobbs any day, be silly not to, especially with Old Man Chad Scott penciled in at nickelback.

Hill's 111 first down catches in 143 career college receptions is an extravagence when the Pats will need to re-sign Caldwell and Gaffney for 2008, plus decide on large roster bonuses for Stallworth and Washington? I hope you weren't among those mooning over WRs in Free Agency.

Kalil not gonna happen, well the odds are against him, but I wasn't aware I had a cousin on BB's staff. What's the chance for sideline passes?

No problem. Call me.
DW Toys

 

[DaBruinz]

Cousin,
I know you gentlemen are more up to snuff on all of this, and I do not pretend to be a expert, but I beg to differ on some of your pics, or as others have shouted...waste!

Where does it say that the BAP is the correct way to go? Is it is the Bible? That drives me crazy. If you have needs and there is a player there, if the discrepancy is not night and day, just draft the sucker!

I beg to differ on these but I respect your knowledge. I just think stockpiling players in loaded positions doesn't address items of need. And I don't go for the BAP as I said:

Carriker-Great player. We spend a first on a back up to a young D Line?

Ty Warren is going to be a UFA after 2008. Vince Wilfork and Richard Seymour after 2009. Having Carriker there allows the Pats to replace Hill and have someone who is truly capable of stepping in during the event of an injury. The Pats could ALSO explore a trade of Jarvis Green or Mike Wright.

In addition, having Carriker on the roster for 2 years would allow him to learn the position without him feeling pressured. Kinda like how Ty Warren was behind Bobby Hamilton.

Staley-We have 4 tackles with vatious skills. Down the road are they better than Staley? A draft choice is a crap shoot. Yes our 4 guys are better than Staley at this moment.

Lets review the Pats OTs (excluding Mankins):
- Matt Light - 29 - Been the starting LT except when injured. A classic over-achiever since everybody and their brother said he couldn't be a LT in the NFL.

- Nick Kazur - 28- He is a year younger than Light. Can play both LT and RT, though LT actually seems to be his better position, at least based on the limited play from last year. Shoulder injury ended his rookie season and the recovery took him through most of TC last year.

- Wesley Britt - 25- Was highly touted coming out of college as a RT. Was drafted by the Chargers but released. Spent almost 1.5 seasons on the practice squad for the Pats. Saw some playing time, but is mostly a reserve.

- Ryan O'Callaghan - 24 - Highly touted RT coming out of college. Fell to the 5th round because of injury issues. He beat out Britt for the starting job with Kaczur on the TC PUP. Held onto the starting job until about half way through the season. Had 2 concussions last year, the 2nd one basically ending his season. Has a history of concussions and other injuries.

- Sean Bubin - 26 - A starting LT out of college who many projected could be a LT in the NFL. Was a 5th round pick by the Jaguars in the 2004 draft. Went to the Jags practice squad and then the Lions roster. Spent 2005 on the Vikings practice squad and went to TC with the Vikings in 2006. Was cut and signed by the Pats in October. In other words, he hasn't panned out.

Bubin is out of options. He either makes the team or is gone. I think that Britt MIGHT be eligible for the PS, but I am not certain. Your 5 OTs just got cut to 3. So there would be a space for another OT since the Pats have used 4 OTs every year since BB came to the team.

Wilson-We have Hobbs-Same player-Really a nickel back. To high a choice to waste.

Hobbs is a starting CB for us. Wilson would be a good back-up for Hobbs. How is that too high of a pick to "waste"?

Leonard-Better than Evans. Not right now.

Leonard is better than Evans and could replace Faulk as the 3rd down back. Particularly with his ability to run pass patterns and potentially to pick up the blitz.

Hill-Love to have him but perhaps a six on the depth cart? For a high choice? Not a good move IMO.

The Pats have Stallworth, Washington, Gaffney, and Caldwell who could ALL, potentially, be UFA after this season. With Jackson potentially on the PUP, Troy Brown on the mend and not signed, Childress not proving he can earn a roster spot over newcomers like Jonathan Smith and Kelvin Kight, Its actually a good move for the Pats. I prefer Chris Davis, myself, but Hill provides the Pats a receiver that they may not have after this season.

Kilil-Center? Not gonna happen on BB's watch for a first round pick.

Not to mention that they just re-signed Koppen to a long term deal.

I agree on Gonzales

He could be an option, just like hill.

You are on the something with Bradley. Excellent choice. He can play ILB as can Woodley!

DW Toys

I have my reservations about Woodley playing ILB. But, if BB grabs him in the 2nd round with that idea, I am not going to complain. I think that Bradley and DeOssie are better options, personally.

 

[dryheat44]

well said box.

well said.

I would change Hill to McKnight from ND. (Got Givens written all over em)

The Givens here is Brandon Myles of WVU. Except Myles has a higher skill level than Givens did coming into the league. He's a talented WR held back by that sandbox offense they've been running down there. If Myles had chose to go to a school that had a Pro-Style offense, maybe Louisville or Florida, or even Notre Dame with Weis, he'd be one of the top half dozen or so WRs taken. Instead, he's looking like a 4th-6th rounder.

 

[dryheat44]

Leonard is better than Evans and could replace Faulk as the 3rd down back. Particularly with his ability to run pass patterns and potentially to pick up the blitz.

I think there are a lot of us who are overstating Leonard's abilities based on what he achieved playing against Big East competition. Could he be better than Evans? Perhaps. However, I have watched Evans have success as a blocker and receiver, and even rip off a 100 yard game in a pinch, against NFL competition. It seems silly to suggest Leonard is going to come into training camp the better player.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I think there are a lot of us who are overstating Leonard's abilities based on what he achieved playing against Big East competition. Could he be better than Evans? Perhaps. However, I have watched Evans have success as a blocker and receiver, and even rip off a 100 yard game in a pinch, against NFL competition. It seems silly to suggest Leonard is going to come into training camp the better player.

Yes, and I'd be surprised if they were used the same beyond the baseline backfield skill set. I've seen Leonard as a hybrid of all the various backs the Pats have carried the past couple years, some power, some quicks, some blocking, some receiving, some Special Teams, some active games, and some inactive. After doing that favorite draft exercise for MWP last night I'm struck by how many second day backs don't have what I would perceive to be the right measurables to work behind a zone line (as I understand the needs). Leonard is looking more and more important due to my uncertainty.