List of guys the Patriots will NOT take

[FredFromDartmouth]

This list is a lot easier than trying to predict who they will take. Here are some off the top of my head:

Will Hill S Florida: Why get another gangsta to replace the current one?
Johnny Patrick CB Louisville: Too bad; he could be effective opposite McCourty
Phil Taylor DT Baylor: Can this refrigerator keep in shape?
Nick Taylor: DT Auburn
Titus Young WR Boise State

 

[BradyBranch39]

I think you can add fairly safely Fairley to the list. (pun intended)

 

[sbpatfan]

A good pass rusher?

Ba-dum-tssshh

 

[conway]

Jimmy Smith

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

This list is a lot easier than trying to predict who they will take. Here are some off the top of my head:

Will Hill S Florida: Why get another gangsta to replace the current one?
Johnny Patrick CB Louisville: Too bad; he could be effective opposite McCourty
Phil Taylor DT Baylor: Can this refrigerator keep in shape?
Nick Taylor: DT Auburn
Titus Young WR Boise State

So, why is Johnny Patrick on this list again?

 

[WesWelker83]

So, why is Johnny Patrick on this list again?

Does not have a great work ethic off the field (film study, weight room). Light came on with new coaching staff but still has some maturing to do.

Suffered a shoulder injury against Cincinnati in 2010. Left that game but returned the following week. Sat out the Senior Bowl with an undisclosed injury. Suffered a left MCL injury at the combine and did not finish all drills. Not known for toughing it out when in pain.

- ESPN Scouts Inc

Bad work ethic, doesn't like watching tape, and doesnt play through injuries = STRIKE 3 WE WONT DRAFT YOU!

 

[WesWelker83]

This list is a lot easier than trying to predict who they will take. Here are some off the top of my head:

Will Hill S Florida: Why get another gangsta to replace the current one?
Johnny Patrick CB Louisville: Too bad; he could be effective opposite McCourty
Phil Taylor DT Baylor: Can this refrigerator keep in shape?
Nick Taylor: DT Auburn
Titus Young WR Boise State

Add these guys to this list:

Jimmy Smith - character questions
Ryan Mallett - No need and character questions
Chykie Brown/Rashad Carmichael - The two worst tacklers in the draft in space. BB hates guys who cant tackle.
Chris Rucker - this guy spent some time in jail this season! No way we take him.
Brandon Hogan - arrested three times in college
Jonathan Baldwin - attitude/character issues.
Greg Little - maturity, character, attitude, and work ethic questions. Lied to teams at Combine about thew reasons for his ineligibility according to CNNSI.
Edmond Gates - character issues like most guys from Abilene Christian
Terrance Toliver - character questions
DeAndre Brown - character questions

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Does not have a great work ethic off the field (film study, weight room). Light came on with new coaching staff but still has some maturing to do.

Suffered a shoulder injury against Cincinnati in 2010. Left that game but returned the following week. Sat out the Senior Bowl with an undisclosed injury. Suffered a left MCL injury at the combine and did not finish all drills. Not known for toughing it out when in pain.

- ESPN Scouts Inc

Bad work ethic, doesn't like watching tape, and doesnt play through injuries = STRIKE 3 WE WONT DRAFT YOU!

Ah, the source explains why I hadn't seen this information since I don't subscribe to them. First I had heard.

What makes this interesting is New England did have a private workout with him, so the work ethic and playing through pain issues weren't significant enough to eliminate him upfront, not to say they are pure fiction or even minor, but the new coaching team getting him to step up clearly says there may be mitigating factors to consider. If he put in the effort with the new staff beginning last spring, rather then making a late surge the closer draft day drew near, I'd say he didn't hurt himself too badly. The private workout says he was still in the running.

As far as an MCL strain and not finishing drills, to what effect? CBs are big change of direction guys, an MCL seriously can impact their game and resting up for his Pro-Day or for private workouts is the smart decision to make. I can't down check him on that decision, which apparently NE didn't either.

I'd suggest if ESPN's reporting is the information Fred is using to take him off the list, he may wish to reconsider. If he wants one NE won't draft: Cam Newton.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Add these guys to this list:

Jimmy Smith - character questions
Ryan Mallett - No need and character questions
Chykie Brown/Rashad Carmichael - The two worst tacklers in the draft in space. BB hates guys who cant tackle.
Chris Rucker - this guy spent some time in jail this season! No way we take him.
Brandon Hogan - arrested three times in college
Jonathan Baldwin - attitude/character issues.
Greg Little - maturity, character, attitude, and work ethic questions. Lied to teams at Combine about thew reasons for his ineligibility according to CNNSI.
Edmond Gates - character issues like most guys from Abilene Christian
Terrance Toliver - character questions
DeAndre Brown - character questions

FWIW - all three bolded had private workouts.

If the character questions were that significant, that would not have happened unless the full background information had not yet been received/processed (which I'm suspecting wasn't the case given how late into the draft process they were worked out).

I wondered about Chykie given all the tackling reports too, but maybe they saw more on tape to justify a closer look given the 'can't coach speed' standard. :confused2:

 

[Sciz]

Marcus Cannon - not athletic enough
Adrian Clayborn - too small to play end, too big/doesn't want to play LB
Corey Liuget - too short
Christian Ballard - soft, lacks ball awareness
Any TE in the first two days - stocked there
Any ILB in the first two days - stocked there

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Marcus Cannon - not athletic enough
Adrian Clayborn - too small to play end, too big/doesn't want to play LB
Corey Liuget - too short
Christian Ballard - soft, lacks ball awareness
Any TE in the first two days - stocked there
Any ILB in the first two days - stocked there

I dunno Sciz, if NE at least gave the kids a private workout I'm hard pressed to see why you'd say the Pats won't draft them? I know why I wouldn't for NE, but a private workout which all too often is a position coach, is a lot of trouble to go to for a guy you've already written off for other reasons, such as measurables or game tape. To that end, Clayborn and Liuget seem odd choices.

I don't see a Day Two TE either, but then again I like Virgil Green and can see NE looking at him around #92 and saying, why not? Or for that matter Luke Stocker if he was still there in the third is an excellent blocking TE with some pass catching potential (I'd prefer Lee Smith, but I want him for OL anyway).

Martez Wilson was worked out, which surprised me when I read it, then again some folks around here claim he can rush the passer, so maybe he's an OLB prospect? I can't see the value in him for ILB with the Pats, I'll agree there. BB did work some with Colin McCarthy, I can see him as a passing down/STs option right away, whom BB & Co. might feel could bulk up and slide into Guyton's role in time. I wouldn't want to draft him Day Two, but if his instincts and playmaking at LB are that good, maybe BB is willing to pay a premium to get him in a relatively down year for ILB?

Cannon - you convinced me.

 

[Wilfork#75]

I wondered about Chykie given all the tackling reports too, but maybe they saw more on tape to justify a closer look given the 'can't coach speed' standard. :confused2:

Chykie Brown is a really interesting guy because he has 1st round athletecism and off the field/character wise he is exactly what you look for in a player. He is a hard working, team player with a great motor and who just loves playing the game. But his footwork is raw and his tackling is horrendous. Maybe BB takes a late round flier on the kid because these are issues that are correctable with good coaching. I certainly would take a chance on him in the late 5th/6th round hoping his just a guy that is developing a little late.

 

[RussFrancis]

We had private workouts last year with Dez Bryant and Tim Tebow. Now, had Tebow slipped to the 2nd round, maybe.....maybe we grab him. Id say very safely we had no intention whatsoever of drafting Dez Bryant. We knew Dallas was all over the kid, and ended up making the deal with them. Visits/workouts dont always translate to actual interest in the player.

 

[mcsully]

Cam Newton

 

[tricktak]

You shouldn't be putting too much stock into character issues, as far as picks for the patriots. They traded for Moss and Dillon, who both had character issues at the time and they've drafted guys like Tate, Spikes, Meriweather and even Brandon Deaderick all had some character concerns heading into the draft and the Patriots still took them. My point is is that if these guys interview well and the Patriots believe they can be productive players and help the team they will put those few character issues aside.

 

[Calciumee]

Cam Newton

I was just about to put him, I can't see it!

 

[WesWelker83]

FWIW - all three bolded had private workouts.

If the character questions were that significant, that would not have happened unless the full background information had not yet been received/processed (which I'm suspecting wasn't the case given how late into the draft process they were worked out).

I wondered about Chykie given all the tackling reports too, but maybe they saw more on tape to justify a closer look given the 'can't coach speed' standard. :confused2:

For every guy who is brought in for an official visit there is a reason behind why we are bringing him in. Some guys its character reasons and others its medical. I also think other guys we bring in to throw out a smokescreen (Tebow last year, Locker and Mallett this year). We are trying to build value with our picks at 17 and 28 by making teams think we have interest in a QB so they overpay for our pick to move up like Denver (Tebow) and Dallas (Bryant) last year.

I also don't think that just because we didn't bring a guy in for a visit doesn't mean we aren't interested in him. Last year we drafted Cunningham and Hernandez based off a pro day and not an official visit.

 

[DaBruinz]

You shouldn't be putting too much stock into character issues, as far as picks for the patriots. They traded for Moss and Dillon, who both had character issues at the time and they've drafted guys like Tate, Spikes, Meriweather and even Brandon Deaderick all had some character concerns heading into the draft and the Patriots still took them. My point is is that if these guys interview well and the Patriots believe they can be productive players and help the team they will put those few character issues aside.

Moss and Dillon were interviewed prior to the Pats pulling the trigger on them.. And they had years in the league with clean noses.

Meriweather had the one on field issue. The off-field incident was him protecting a friend.

Spike had the porn tape, but that came out after he was taken and then the ADHD meds, but, again, after he was taken. If you are referring to the 2009 incident with the GT RB, Spikes got Kudos for manning up and extending the suspension from a half game to a full game so as to not be a distraction.

Tate had a positive test for POT at the combine. Beyond that, he had no issues. In fact, it was noted that he was excellent at taking coaching and was willing to put in extra time when needed.

Deaderick's is the one who had an issue, though, he was made team captain his senior year. But he showed his immaturity again with the Pats.

The Pats have shown they are willing to tolerate certain things that can be written off to immaturity if you have shown improvement since that time. But there are certain "character" issues they don't tolerate. Like an unwillingness to be coached. Or an unwillingness to watch film. Things that dramatically impact your performance on the field.

That being said, the Pats have also parted ways with problems that can become a smudge on the team. Especially since the Krafts bought the team. Willie Andrews, Christian Peter and Kenyatta Jones all come to mind.

 

[DaBruinz]

I also don't think that just because we didn't bring a guy in for a visit doesn't mean we aren't interested in him. Last year we drafted Cunningham and Hernandez based off a pro day and not an official visit.

That's because Belichik was present at that Pro-Day..

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

For every guy who is brought in for an official visit there is a reason behind why we are bringing him in. Some guys its character reasons and others its medical. I also think other guys we bring in to throw out a smokescreen (Tebow last year, Locker and Mallett this year). We are trying to build value with our picks at 17 and 28 by making teams think we have interest in a QB so they overpay for our pick to move up like Denver (Tebow) and Dallas (Bryant) last year.

I also don't think that just because we didn't bring a guy in for a visit doesn't mean we aren't interested in him. Last year we drafted Cunningham and Hernandez based off a pro day and not an official visit.

I believe we are talking apples and grapefruit, the three I highlighted were private workouts. The on-field activities can last anywhere from 20 minutes to 2 hours, while film room time and other interview/knowledge testing could take an additional several hours or not take place at all. A visit to Gillette is often an all day thing and could extend over two days - see Locker and Mallett - where they meet multiple coaches, spend film room time with position coaches and coordinators sometimes together, sometimes separately, meet executives and towel boys, and get medically examined top to bottom and back again. generally a more exhaustive effort to get past the agent's coaching and get into the kid's mind and attitude.