Asante Samuel was 20th ranked CB coming out of 2003 draft

[Ring 6]

This is a classic chicken/egg argument.
Is the 20th corner nearly as good as the top few, or did the COACHING he received make him that good?
The variable is that where whoever made this list ranked these players is much less important than where BB ranked them, because he knows an awful lot more than the guys putting these lists together.
Assuming it is somewhere in between: Samuel was better than his rating, and the Pats coached him very well, they also would have gotten more out of someone they rated higher (assuming the rating was correct)
I believe that Samuel's success was more related to what happened AFTER the draft than the unfinished product he was at the time of the draft. I think there were better players taken early that would have been better players for us if they walked into camp in Asante's shoes. I also believe that if asante were drafted by someone else, his entire career would have been very different. My inclination is it would have been worse, because I think he got tremendous coaching here.

I think Asante's Pat career compared to his draft slotting is evidence we should draft corner VERY HIGH because we have a system and coaching staff in place to get the most out of his abilities.

 

[captain stone]

I remember thinking at the time that SMU's Kevin Garrett, a consensus Top-100 player, was the best CB available when Samuel was chosen in the 4th round, 120 overall. Score one for the FO.
I also thought that Dan Klecko, at 117, was taken two rounds too early; and that RT Tony Pashos or FS Terence Holt would have been a wiser choice. Score one for me.

2003 was the last great draft for the NEP. Had they stayed at #50 and taken Kelley Washington (instead of throwing away a 4th-rounder [Pashos/Holt?] in order to move up 5 spots to take Bethel Johnson); and had they drafted Pashos/Holt instead of Klecko; and had they drafted FB/RB Cecil Sapp with one of their other 7th-rounders (instead of Spencer Nead or Ethan Kelley), 2003 would have been one of the all-timers.

The lesson of ***ante Samuel, relative to the 2008 draft, is that the FO needs to draft CBs this year, both early and often.

 

[LiveShot]

Samuel was taken in the 4th round, just goes to show you BB and Piolli are good judges of skill and character. BB and the coaching staff probably had a big hand in the maturation of Samuel as one of the top corners in the league.

I was fine with them not signing Asante, he was just asking for too much money.

took the words right outa my mouth

 

[MoLewisrocks]

This is a classic chicken/egg argument.
Is the 20th corner nearly as good as the top few, or did the COACHING he received make him that good?
The variable is that where whoever made this list ranked these players is much less important than where BB ranked them, because he knows an awful lot more than the guys putting these lists together.
Assuming it is somewhere in between: Samuel was better than his rating, and the Pats coached him very well, they also would have gotten more out of someone they rated higher (assuming the rating was correct)
I believe that Samuel's success was more related to what happened AFTER the draft than the unfinished product he was at the time of the draft. I think there were better players taken early that would have been better players for us if they walked into camp in Asante's shoes. I also believe that if asante were drafted by someone else, his entire career would have been very different. My inclination is it would have been worse, because I think he got tremendous coaching here.

I think Asante's Pat career compared to his draft slotting is evidence we should draft corner VERY HIGH because we have a system and coaching staff in place to get the most out of his abilities.

I don't think Bill thinks we need that though. And if we do draft it and it works out whose to say it doesn't want out 4 years into it's expensive 6 year rookie deal.

I think if they stay a #7 they don't take a corner. But I also don't think they will stay at #7 if they can help it - unless a special player is dropping to them there. I don't think any of the corners are that special player.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't think Bill thinks we need that though. And if we do draft it and it works out whose to say it doesn't want out 4 years into it's expensive 6 year rookie deal.

I think if they stay a #7 they don't take a corner. But I also don't think they will stay at #7 if they can help it - unless a special player is dropping to them there. I don't think any of the corners are that special player.

Anyone we draft is subject to wanting more $$ at some point. Theoretically, drafting a player at position where avg cap hits or top cap hits are highest does make sense though.
The rookie contract is based on slot. In other words, if top corners make 8 mill and top LBs make 5, and your draft slot says you pay the guy 4, he is a bigger bargain if he is a corner.

I agree trading down makes sense, but who are you taking at 7 that fits your description of who is worth the 7th pick? I dont see anyone, particualrly, people are hyped about Ghoslton, but my opinion is very strong that he is not a good fit for our system, much less our needs.