Brace brushes aside media criticism

[randomk1]

Yeah, BB hasn't been around long enough to see film at the level of depth you do.

Indeed...with his flawless record of drafting on D and with those guys playing at such a high level it is inconceivable that he might have made a mistake when he drafted them.

 

[supafly]

Yes, we all do.

That is not a reason not to keep him on the team as one of our DL's.

I certainly agree with this statement, and can only hope that Brace shows what is needed to make another couple of steps this year.

However, I think until that happens people right or wrong will certainly have the opinion that he has been an underachiever up to this point, so I can understand that too.

There are a handful of players this year who must be able to take another step or two in the progression chain to keep their spots for the season and prove some of their doubters wrong. Those would include Cunningham, Brace, Pryor, etc.

Personally, I am pulling for all of them, and think that is the reasonable thing to do rather than going to route of the disgruntled fan, but I can also respect the higher expectations of my fellow posters.

 

[Ring 6]

Indeed...with his flawless record of drafting on D and with those guys playing at such a high level it is inconceivable that he might have made a mistake when he drafted them.

You speak as if mistakes are never made in the draft, and that his record is supposed to be flawless.
Everyone who drafts makes mistakes. If you were drafting with the limited knowledge you have there is no doubt you would make more than anyone.
To imply that the reason a player was drafted was the Bill Belichick was too ignorant about film study and player evaluation to take into account how and why plays were being made, defenses were being attacked and schemes were used, as some kind of idea that you would have recognized and BB was too naive to is ridiculous. But you know that, which is why you turned your argument to the silly 'BB must be flawless' strawman.

 

[Ring 6]

I certainly agree with this statement, and can only hope that Brace shows what is needed to make another couple of steps this year.

However, I think until that happens people right or wrong will certainly have the opinion that he has been an underachiever up to this point, so I can understand that too.

There are a handful of players this year who must be able to take another step or two in the progression chain to keep their spots for the season and prove some of their doubters wrong. Those would include Cunningham, Brace, Pryor, etc.

Personally, I am pulling for all of them, and think that is the reasonable thing to do rather than going to route of the disgruntled fan, but I can also respect the higher expectations of my fellow posters.

Actually, while it would be disappointing, Brace and Pryor need not take any steps forward to make the team. They made it last year and don't have any more competition, in fact they have less, than they did last year.
Its nice to say as fans we aren't happy with them and they need to get better, but to make the team they only need to fill a role. Who do we have that will take their jobs away? We have added absolutely nothing, and subtracted Haynesworth during the year, and Ellis since.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

It is not Brace's fault that he was drafted too high. He is a good guy and he tries hard; he would have been a fine 5th or 6'th round pick. As a second round pick he has been a disappointment.

I am suspicious of the motives behind the pick of Brace. Wasn't Wilfork threatening to hold out? I wonder if Brace was supposed to be leverage again Wilfork in the contract negotiations; it certainly seemed that way. The pick certainly seems amateurish; on paper he seemed like massive plugger and his real value was inflated by BJ Raji; the Patriots should have known that--it is not that he played a long way away from Foxboro.

I called the Brace pick a disaster. I was killed on this board but I was right. He was a sixth-round pick taken in the second. Of course I exaggerated but it was a horrible pick. The real disaster came later when the Patriots picked "Sharon" Tate and the very next pick the Stealers took Mike Wallace; now that is a disaster.

 

[supafly]

Actually, while it would be disappointing, Brace and Pryor need not take any steps forward to make the team. They made it last year and don't have any more competition, in fact they have less, than they did last year.
Its nice to say as fans we aren't happy with them and they need to get better, but to make the team they only need to fill a role. Who do we have that will take their jobs away? We have added absolutely nothing, and subtracted Haynesworth during the year, and Ellis since.

I certainly agree with Pryor, but then again I am a bit higher on him than most. I actually feel that Myron Pryor is pretty close to being a lock, as long as he is healthy of course.

Brace to me is still somewhat of a question mark of sorts, and sometimes it's hard to get a good read on certain situations. I will agree that it is certainly a valid point that his competition is lessened this year, although that could/should change somewhat with the probable addition of at least 1-2 players on the DL prior to the end of the summer (just a gut feeling due to the lack of enough bodies and competition, but I obviously could be wrong). One could also make the argument that the placement of him on PUP last year may have helped with that competition, then again I suppose that one could also make the argument that his being injured in the first place may have hurt him a bit--so it's probably a wash. I'm going to assume that they wanted to continue to allow him to progress another year, and that is the point that may be pushing me to wonder if this could be his last TC. This will be the 4th yr here if he makes the roster, and I don't know if we've seen enough to warrant that spot. As you say, current lack of DL competition is certainly favoring him at this point.

I think that this is a very important TC for Ron Brace personally, but it should certainly be noted that he has looked impressive at times in run support when healthy, so there is a strong possibility that he may have not fully reached his potential due to injuries etc.

I think he is one of the more controversial players on defense, along with Cunningham (who I see making the team, unless M.Carter really shows us something). Both will be worth keeping a close eye on during the month of August. As I said, I am certainly pulling for Brace to make the team.

 

[supafly]

The real disaster came later when the Patriots picked "Sharon" Tate and the very next pick the Stealers took Mike Wallace; now that is a disaster.

Hindsight is always 20/20, Freddie boy.

It's a lot easier to say that now, along with all of the Clay Matthews angst, but at the time some work out and some don't.

 

[Deus Irae]

Hindsight is always 20/20, Freddie boy.

It's a lot easier to say that now, along with all of the Clay Matthews angst, but at the time some work out and some don't.

There are draft threads where people say things before, during and immediately/soon after the draft. Despite the frequent attempt of many here to use the "hindsight" argument as a way to crush dissent, the reality is that these players are generally questioned from the get go by some percentage of posters.

 

[BradyFTW!]

There are draft threads where people say things before, during and immediately/soon after the draft. Despite the frequent attempt of many here to use the "hindsight" argument as a way to crush dissent, the reality is that these players are generally questioned from the get go by some percentage of posters.

True. FWIW, I didn't like the Brace pick even when it was announced, for the admittedly imprecise reason of "if he and BJ Raji are both so good, then why wasn't BC's defensive line better?" By the same token, though, I was neutral on the Chung pick, and liked both Butler and Vollmer. Sometimes you're right, sometimes you're wrong. Sometimes, you're even right when Belichick's wrong. I think some people here take it a little too personally when that last case happens, but I don't really understand why. They're worthwhile cases to investigate.

I think that, in the case of both Brace and Cunningham, Belichick may have gotten wrapped up in identifying a player who fit the physical description of everything that he was looking for, but whose production was perhaps inflated by playing alongside better players. If Brace and Cunningham both complete their likely path to bust-dom, then I'm sure that Belichick will take these data points into account for future decision making, and that will make him a better draft evaluator.

 

[Observer]

Armchair captains should not slander those whose talent and work ethic has brought them to work alongside those at the highest level of their fields.

 

[supafly]

There are draft threads where people say things before, during and immediately/soon after the draft. Despite the frequent attempt of many here to use the "hindsight" argument as a way to crush dissent, the reality is that these players are generally questioned from the get go by some percentage of posters.

I think in most cases we have seen people question the picks, as you said--sometimes immediately, and as general as the "hindsight" argument is (valid point), there isn't any use crying over spilled milk either.

Yeah, we took Tate instead of Wallace, but there have also been some great picks to offset that too.

For all we know, Wallace is a total moron who would never have grasped the system here.

 

[Deus Irae]

Armchair captains should not slander those whose talent and work ethic has brought them to work alongside those at the highest level of their fields.

This is a message board about football. If you think it's not right to question players, blogging may be more your thing.

I think in most cases we have seen people question the picks, as you said--sometimes immediately, and as general as the "hindsight" argument is (valid point), there isn't any use crying over spilled milk either.

Yeah, we took Tate instead of Wallace, but there have also been some great picks to offset that too.

For all we know, Wallace is a total moron who would never have grasped the system here.

Why should we be celebrating good players when there have been plenty of lousy picks? Your argument works both ways.

 

[supafly]

Why should we be celebrating good players when there have been plenty of lousy picks? Your argument works both ways.

I have no problem questioning picks, Deus. That's the great thing about the freedom of speech, and also the messageboard here..we can freely express our opinions.

I respect almost all of anyone's opinions, except for the real "out there" ones that we all see from time to time, but that is what this forum is for, so who am I to judge?

To be honest, I questioned the pick of Brace, but I was completely fine with the choosing of Tate.

My only point is that there is not anything at all that can be done after a pick is made, and it is indeed very easy to see someone like Wallace excel in someone else's system, and ask "what if?"

 

[Deus Irae]

I have no problem questioning picks, Deus. That's the great thing about the freedom of speech, and also the messageboard here..we can freely express our opinions.

I respect almost all of anyone's opinions, except for the real "out there" ones that we all see from time to time, but that is what this forum is for, so who am I to judge?

To be honest, I questioned the pick of Brace, but I was completely fine with the choosing of Tate.

My only point is that there is not anything at all that can be done after a pick is made, and it is indeed very easy to see someone like Wallace excel in someone else's system, and ask "what if?"

But that's the whole point of message boards. I don't bust on the Tate pick itself, because I felt that BB had earned a 'flier' pick by that point in the draft, but that's exactly what Tate was.

As for Wallace and the "system" argument, I'll ask you the same question I've asked others: Which players have failed as a WR in New England and gone on to great things as a WR for another NFL team?

 

[supafly]

But that's the whole point of message boards. I don't bust on the Tate pick itself, because I felt that BB had earned a 'flier' pick by that point in the draft, but that's exactly what Tate was.

As for Wallace and the "system" argument, I'll ask you the same question I've asked others: Which players have failed as a WR in New England and gone on to great things as a WR for another NFL team?

Basically none, besides some semblance of an argument for Deion Branch with the Seahawks. That said, aren't you looking at it a bit backwards though? My thought was that Wallace may have a much easier time with the simplicity of the Pittsburgh 'backyard' football scheme, as opposed to the read/react route tree system of the NEP.

In other words, Wallace may have proven to be a complete bust here too. Just b/c he picked it up in Pittsburgh certainly doesn't equal the capacity to learn it here, especially in a much more complex system.

With those thoughts in mind, it's hard to project whether or not certain players would have been as productive if drafted by the NEP.

I'm all for the debate though, as you're right, that is what the boards are for.

 

[Ring 6]

I certainly agree with Pryor, but then again I am a bit higher on him than most. I actually feel that Myron Pryor is pretty close to being a lock, as long as he is healthy of course.

Brace to me is still somewhat of a question mark of sorts, and sometimes it's hard to get a good read on certain situations. I will agree that it is certainly a valid point that his competition is lessened this year, although that could/should change somewhat with the probable addition of at least 1-2 players on the DL prior to the end of the summer (just a gut feeling due to the lack of enough bodies and competition, but I obviously could be wrong). One could also make the argument that the placement of him on PUP last year may have helped with that competition, then again I suppose that one could also make the argument that his being injured in the first place may have hurt him a bit--so it's probably a wash. I'm going to assume that they wanted to continue to allow him to progress another year, and that is the point that may be pushing me to wonder if this could be his last TC. This will be the 4th yr here if he makes the roster, and I don't know if we've seen enough to warrant that spot. As you say, current lack of DL competition is certainly favoring him at this point.

I think that this is a very important TC for Ron Brace personally, but it should certainly be noted that he has looked impressive at times in run support when healthy, so there is a strong possibility that he may have not fully reached his potential due to injuries etc.

I think he is one of the more controversial players on defense, along with Cunningham (who I see making the team, unless M.Carter really shows us something). Both will be worth keeping a close eye on during the month of August. As I said, I am certainly pulling for Brace to make the team.

My point was simply in response to you saying he needed to make big strides to make the team. I do not agree since he was on the team last year, and there is really no additions and at least 1 subtraction. If he is the same, he should make the team. That doesn't bode well for his career, which needs that improvement to worthy, but in terms of making the team he'd have to regress to not make it.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Brace needs to brush aside the buffet table.

 

[Guimond3434]

Is Brace on the final year of his contract? I can't recall what his rookie year was for.

 

[Triumph]

solid team player.......LOL

He is a Cheerleader like Ocho.

 

[Triumph]

Time is running out for old Ronny Brace.

He is on the team because he was a relatively high selection (value draft pick) and was hurt last season. Its rare for BB to outright cut a "Value Pick" without giving him at least 3 years.