Asante Samuel and the "no franchise tag" agreement - New England Patriots Forums

Armen Da Pats Fan · 08-29-2007, 08:02 AM

Okay, so help me out here, those of you who are, admittedly, much more well-versed in NFL contracts and rules and such, than myself.

This whole holdout by Asante Samuel was over the Pats agreeing to NOT franchise Asante next season?

If a player is franchised, do they not get a salary that is averaged among the top 5 in the league or something like that, basically guaranteeing them big $$$$?

I mean, I love Asante, but is he really worth $7.79 million? Heck no. The franchise tag worked like a golden goose for him!

In that case, if I was a player like Asante, I would WANT my team to franchise me every year! I could play year-to-year and always be getting a top salary every time.

One arguement, I suppose, would be the security of the a long-term deal, but it's not like getting the long-term deal in the NFL really means anything, because these contracts are not guaranteed, correct? (See Drew Bledsoe's $100 million deal with the Pats a few years back.)

To me, this actually works out better for the Pats, in that, now that Asante has persuaded the Patriots to agree NOT to franchise him, he is basically playing for his big $$$ contract next year.

And what do the Pats give up? Not much. They just agree to NOT pay Samuel as one of the top 5 next season and it also gives them another full season, free agent period and draft to prepare for life without Asante Samuel.

Also, if last year was any indication, I guess that means we are going to get a HUGE season out of Asante!

http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal...ade_up_ground/

***BelichickFan*** · 08-29-2007, 08:08 AM

In terms of dollars it's even worse than you stated because a second Franchise (the last allowed) is a 20% raise = $9.36M next year.

You are correct that it puts the onus on Samuel to have another huge year - he's playing for his contract.

The reason I would have Franchised him is he will still want a long term deal so if he could find a team willing to do it, as he probably would, we could then sign and trade him which entails getting something for him AND controlling where he goes (aka not to the Jets, Chargers or Broncos).

As it stands we seem like we'll be getting a 2009 comp pick, a #4 or maybe a #3 depending on what he signs for.

RayClay · 08-29-2007, 08:36 AM

They do not get that one big contract with the big bonus.

Since they could be injured and washed up at anytime, they want that one multi year contract while they are a hot commodity.

naclone · 08-29-2007, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armen Da Pats Fan

One arguement, I suppose, would be the security of the a long-term deal, but it's not like getting the long-term deal in the NFL really means anything, because these contracts are not guaranteed, correct? (See Drew Bledsoe's $100 million deal with the Pats a few years back.)

http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal...ade_up_ground/

It all comes down to guaranteed money. there were a couple notable signing bonuses handed out to corners this offseason and Assante wants to capitalize on that development.

$20 million guaranteed is more than 7.79 million.

***cstjohn17*** · 08-29-2007, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armen Da Pats Fan

In that case, if I was a player like Asante, I would WANT my team to franchise me every year! I could play year-to-year and always be getting a top salary every time.

Pretty sure Samuel doesn't want you to be his agent. Players want big money up front so if the get hurt or have an off year they are taken care of. Getting franchised every year means you have to perform at a top level each year. The only player I can remember getting it year after year was Orlando Pace, and every year he help out causing a disruption to the team.

In the past three years the Patriots have:
1) given Seymour extra cash to come into camp
2) allowed Branch to leave and get the contract he wanted
3) given Samuel the potential for no Franchise tag next year

The Patriots are shrewd negotiators but they are not invincible. Each year they gave up something to get something.

1) Got Seymour back in camp
2) Got a number 1 pick and ended a distraction*
3) Got their top CB into the fold to help with a Superbowl run

*The whole Branch situation still leaves a mark, he would have helped the team in 06 and provided some stability at the position instead of the musical chairs that is now going on.

RayClay · 08-29-2007, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BelichickFan

In terms of dollars it's even worse than you stated because a second Franchise (the last allowed) is a 20% raise = $9.36M next year.

You are correct that it puts the onus on Samuel to have another huge year - he's playing for his contract.

The reason I would have Franchised him is he will still want a long term deal so if he could find a team willing to do it, as he probably would, we could then sign and trade him which entails getting something for him AND controlling where he goes (aka not to the Jets, Chargers or Broncos).

As it stands we seem like we'll be getting a 2009 comp pick, a #4 or maybe a #3 depending on what he signs for.

Obviously, it will be harder to get the deal he wants with the team he wants if he has to deal only with teams willing to trade something for him.

As has been said, I don't think we really wanted to re-franchise him and I personally think it's just not right to hold these guys hostage over the years.

We could have traded him if we wanted to this year.

Armen Da Pats Fan · 08-29-2007, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naclone

It all comes down to guaranteed money. there were a couple notable signing bonuses handed out to corners this offseason and Assante wants to capitalize on that development.

$20 million guaranteed is more than 7.79 million.

So it's really about the signing bonus.

But do you think anyone will give Asante Samuel a $20 million sigining bonus?!?!

I mean, in all truth, the guy has had one "star quality" season. Other than that, he has been good and solid, but not among the NFL elite.

He has to put a few of them together, ala Champ Bailey, Ty Law, et al, before we start talking about that kind of dough in Foxboro!

Armen Da Pats Fan · 08-29-2007, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cstjohn17

In the past three years the Patriots have:
1) given Seymour extra cash to come into camp
2) allowed Branch to leave and get the contract he wanted
3) given Samuel the potential for no Franchise tag next year

The Patriots are shrewd negotiators but they are not invincible. Each year they gave up something to get something.

1) Got Seymour back in camp
2) Got a number 1 pick and ended a distraction*
3) Got their top CB into the fold to help with a Superbowl run

*The whole Branch situation still leaves a mark, he would have helped the team in 06 and provided some stability at the position instead of the musical chairs that is now going on.

And in that sense, I like this deal.

So often, these players and agents lose sight of what a negotiation means.

A negotaition does not mean one side or the other seeks to bleed the opponent dry and get everything they can out them. It means that both sides come up with a deal that is agreeable and mutually beneficial to both of them.

patsox23 · 08-29-2007, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armen Da Pats Fan

do you think anyone will give Asante Samuel a $20 million sigining bonus?!?!

Um...yes. I do. AND I think they'd give up a #1 pick to do it. But now they won't. Because the Patriots caved despite having all the leverage.

Armen Da Pats Fan · 08-29-2007, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patsox23

Um...yes. I do. AND I think they'd give up a #1 pick to do it. But now they won't. Because the Patriots caved despite having all the leverage.

I think Pats fans might be a bit skewed about Asante's value or worth.

Let's not forget that this dude has really had one outstanding season.

He is not an elite CB in the NFL IMO. I can't even believe Nate Clement got the $$$ he got, and he's a proven veteran. The market is way out of whack.

I know he won't get that money here, and rightfully so.

Maybe from a desperate team (ie Bucs, Lions, Bills).

But in a sense, even if you feel like the Pats caved, and lost out on a #1, they DO get to use him for one more year and he will be playing his arse off for that fat contract. You know that.

So, it's not a total loss.