newton_tom_cat

people have gotten too mesmorized with systems over the last few years. that in large part comes from the patriots upset SB victory against the rams, and subsequent winning of 2 of the next 3 SBs. in these cases - especially against rams - it was assumed pats had inferior talent and therefore bellichick's "brilliant system" won the game.

i disagree. i say pats talent was highly under valued. even madden pointed this out on monday night a few years ago in the season we beat eagles for SB #3, at the time, he said pats had the best SS (harrison), best DE (seymour), one of the best NTs (wilfork), the best big game QB (Brady), one of the best RBs (dillon), the best LB corp (vrabel bruschi, mcginnist & colvin), the best DB (law) and one of the best olines.

since then our running game has declined with the aging of dillon, harrison is oft-injured, law is gone, the LB corp has declined with bruschi's age and injury, and seymour and wilfork have also had more injuries. we also lost the best offensive play caller weis to ND. it's no surprise to me this coincides with the lack of super bowl appearances.

it's like seymour said "I never saw a system make a tackle."

that's why i am hopeful that pats will continue to use their cap space and upgrade in several areas and stop believing their own "bellichick's system can overcome anything" propaganda.

maverick4

I disagree. Keys to victory are COACHING, system, and talent. Yes talent is important, but the NFL is a coaches league more so than any other sports league.

A great coach like Belichick can take an inferior Giants or Patriots team and defeat the Bills or Rams.

The league where talent matters the most is the NBA, where 2 superstars pretty much gives you a ring regardless of mediocre coaching.

newton_tom_cat

if you want to include "talent evaluation and cap utilization" under coaching then fine, but pure "system" coaching is over rated. if not, how do u explain the last 2 years where we've had brilliant bill and not even made the super bowl? you telling me all of a sudden dungy and shanahan (coaches of teams eliminated us) became smarter? clearly the determinant variable has been loss of talent and loss of weis play calling. not saying bellichick is bad, just saying his "systems can conquer all" mentality that kraft has bought into has go to go if this team will ever get back on track.

bradmahn

Before I begin, I consider the coaching part of scouting and player evaluations.

COACHING is the most important thing in the NFL. You can have all the talent in the world, but without good coaching you are going to have nothing when it matters most (ask the Chargers).

The System is designed by the Coaching. The System does not make the coaching, good Coaching makes the System. The same can be said for Playcalling because the Coaches make the calls. Playcalling is part of the System and the System is part of the Coaching.

So...

Coaches are the most important. Then Talent.

If I had to break it down further I would say:
The System, Talent, Playcalling

This is all arbitrary, however, and a pointless discussion. Good coaching can overcome limited talent deficiencies, but if you have Chad Browns, Monty Beisels, and Duane Starks, all the coaching in the world will do you no good.

The Predator

without the coach you do not have a system. without a system you have no idea what type of talent you are looking for. your theory is debunked.

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Pucker up Peyton

Return of the Nizz

The best system in the world is not going to overcome injuries and turnovers. Football isn't like life where your pure talent at stupidity is all that is necessary to flood a messageboard with inane posts.

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I love the smell of Kool-Aid in the morning, that fruit-punch smell. It smells like... victory!

maverick4

Bill gives his assistants a lot of autonomy, and over the past two years our still growing OC has been impotent. He is improving though.

TeamPats

I don't know, while that is true of course, injuries can be crippling for most teams, the Patriots continue to do things no other team has ever done when it comes to overcoming injuries. The coaches make certain every player is prepared as if they are the starter, and since all 53 players of the Patriots team play and are a part of the gameplan, should someone go down the Patriots do not skip a beat. This is direct reflection of the coaching in my opinion.

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In front of his team after a 28-10 loss to the Packers in 2002, Belichick said: "We have a lot of smart guys in this room, but on the football field we play like a bunch of f------- morons. If you are one of the players flinching at the harshness of these words, you might as well begin packing. There is no way you are going to last as a New England Patriot."

Patriotic Fervor

LOL!!!! That was a good one!!!!!!

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....and that's the way I see it!

Yankees/Colts

That's true when you talk about the Colts, not the Patriots.

The Colts run the same plays over and over and over and over. They also do the same several simple things on defense over and over. I would add a few things and put it in this order. Colts:

Talent, preparation, timing, play calling, system

Now the Pats have always been completely the opposite. They go:

System, play calling, talent

The Pats haven't won because Brady reads and carves up defenses. They've won because a screen play was called at the perfect time, a draw was called at the perfect time, a trick play, a tackle eligible, a quick out, a quick snap. The Pats have always had beautiful play calling which kept the defense off balance. Same thing on defense. They weren't getting by as much on talent as they were Belichick confusing opposing offenses.

Both ways work, but the only problem is that Peyton has figured Belichick out, and maybe that's why the Pats are going nuts in free agency and perhaps trying to move into the Colts way of doing things.