Adalius Thomas dissing the coach - Page 17 - New England Patriots Forums

***MoLewisrocks*** · 11-17-2009, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deus Irae

There's no pot and kettle here, Mo. My only 'assumption' was that 16-0 would qualify as winning, particularly since the loss in the Super Bowl was because Samuel blew a coverage. That's clearly not truly an assumption. If you think otherwise, the difference is how we define winning, not in anything I'm theoretically assuming.

We win or lose as a team is a good motto to employ although some of us bear a little more of the responsibility than others. Asante was more at fault than Hobbs. But the OL was as if not more responsible than Asante IMO. And Bill didn't cover himself in glory on 4th and 13, and while he got the defense adjusted after a maddening opening series he never seemed to notice his powerful offense was floundering. And then there's HIS persistence in shifting to prevent late... Bend but don't break went out the door with age and injury or both to the majority of his core defenders long before he could replace them. You can't develop a new core of impact players in practice. As a result he has moved on.

My contention is that injury was far more devastating to the defense than age has been. Colvin's injury, the timing of Johnson's retirement and Bruschi's stroke were devastating blows to the team, regardless of age. , But that's neither here nor there. Seymour clearly was not washed up. Vrabel certainly had another year or more left in him. Those moves were calculated risks. Last night, for one game, they backfired. Seymour's absence has been noticeable all season, as the defensive line has clearly regressed without him.

I just don't see the noticeable regression. I see the development of a better and more versatile and younger defense that can stop the run and cover and when healthy they are showing signs of getting better pressure. It's a substantial turnover and things never gel overnight. But the team that faced the Colts last night is a playoff contender on both sides of the ball (if you actually watch the other crap that transpires on Sunday afternoons). And it's set up to only get better as this year progresses as well as over the next couple of seasons. It isn't necessarily remotely that if he hadn't moved on.

I agree that teams need to transition. I'm pretty confident that this team did plenty of that with this year's draft and has enough draft picks in 2010 and 2011 that the Seymour trade was an unneeded luxury that needlessly weakened the team in 2009, when the team has been without a Super Bowl victory for 4 years.

I'm more focused on continued contention than the win now mentality. Brady will be here for several more seasons and while Moss may not be there are enough other remaining and emerging positives on offense to remain excited going forward. Vollmer is a beast. Edleman is mini Welker. Bill will find another receiver one way or another in the next couple of seasons. The defense is younger and faster and gaining invaluable experience weekly. By the time the next draft class arrives they will be joining a young, battle tested group of veterans on both sides of the ball as a result of this season. He wants to win now. But he knows he has to balance that with wanting to contend to win every year for the forseeable future.

He couldn't "realize...." as you claimed, because Seau wasn't playing, so Belichick couldn't see it. Therefore, it had to be an decision that Seau didn't fit the game plan. I'm not making an assumption. I'm pointing out what BB must have been doing. However, for the sake of completeness, I'll concede the possibility that Belichick was covering up a Seau injury or illness, and admit that I'm assuming Belichick isn't violating league rules or hiding a disciplinary move against Seau. Given that caveat, I'm not making any assumption, but am analyzing what happened.

Semantics again...your forte. Fan analysis is fraught with assumption. Junior told him and us he has 6 games in him. Considering that fact and his lack of play since the week he arrived I'm assuming they are saving those games for when the may need them most - in weather against teams that rely on their run. BB sees things in practice and he also knows what Junior said...

The draft looks very good so far. But let's not have you pretending that you've been acknowledging BB's mistakes this season as if you're just laying them out there. You've been attacking pretty much everyone who's claimed he's made them.

I acknowlege there may or may not be some and I comment on what I think they may be. What I don't do is what you do, claim to be convinced they absolutely prove something absent context simply because that is my admittedly uninformed belief and insist anyone who doesn't see that is blinded by homerism or stupidity. The simple reality that Bill knows more than I do or ever will about the business and game of football and has succeeded at it more consistently than any of his present day peers when no one is 100% successful or correct 100% of the time is sufficient reason for me to comfortably assume he has made and will continue to make the best possible decision for this team the vast majority of the time.

Like Willie said with perspective after setting emotion aside, something distance from the present defense and more recent experience elsewhere allows him to better than Rodney and Tedy, that understanding and not mindless homerism is the basis for koolaid consumption and ultimately deciding IBBWT. The only alternative IMHO is arrogance driven by passion or ignorance. In the heat of the moment two passionate players who were on this defense a season ago or in Tedy's case just months ago lose perspective as quickly as fans. Given time they may see shades of grey that temper their initial reaction.

Believe me, when that game ended Sunday night my own kneejerk reaction was to want to strangle Bill. I still have a couple of issues with the way he performed down the stretch as I often do. But after taking a step back and thinking it through in context and listening to respected voices (including Bill's) on both sides of the argument within the hours following the game, I've come to realize there was no slam dunk right move there and the one he chose to go with probably made the most sense in that particular situation. In the final analysis it clearly had a better chance of succeeding than the alternative had they all simply executed that strategy better. Make that down and the game is over vs. miss it and face Manning from your 29 for the net two minutes or outright punt and face Manning for the next 2 minutes from the vacinity of his 39 at best and at worst across midfield (remember, this was Hansen punting...). He chose the only option that had a shot at keeping the ball out of Manning's hands and forcing him to the bench to stew for the final 2 minutes.

Past and present HC's among others admittedly admire his stones because they wish they had the cache to have done that themselves and some like Gruden openly admired the decision because when faced with the alternative themselves they punted and lost. Twice in the closing minutes of one game in 2003 in Gruden's case as he painfully recalled...

Back to AD, I thought he was an excellent signing that hasn't panned out for any number of reasons, although in 2007 he appeared to be coming on late and played valiently in 42. But something changed for him between then and now, kinda like what happened with Seymour who was never as dominant after 2004 and presented some issues on and off the field (in the locker room and with the media). You're either all in or all out here when paid at that level so my gut tells me AD is on the way out just as it told me Richard was even as they signed him to that short term extension in 2006. Which is why the trade didn't surprise me. My only complaint is it probably could and should have happened sooner. And the dropoff if it had....I don't know since we haven't won a SB since 2004 as you insist on pointing out...

Jimke · 11-17-2009, 12:25 PM

The only reason Adalius Thomas was not traded before the deadline

was that the salary cap hit was huge.

***patsinthesnow*** · 11-17-2009, 02:05 PM

I don't care about the 9mil, etc. Cut him, simple.

He has a prima dona attitude, hasn't performed, and is from the Superbowl 42 team.

scott99 · 11-17-2009, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patsinthesnow

I don't care about the 9mil, etc. Cut him, simple.

He has a prima dona attitude, hasn't performed, and is from the Superbowl 42 team.

Agreed, he hasn't done squat since 2007, except cash his paycheck.

SeymourTrophies · 11-17-2009, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scott99

Agreed, he hasn't done squat since 2007, except cash his paycheck.

Not true. Last year was his best despite the fact that he got hurt in November. I do agree that he doesn't hold much value on this team. I was hoping for a breakthrough once he started lining up on the end. Nothing.