And the pats draft - mglist 4-22

[mgteich]

I expect a trade for a WR this week
I expect a CB signing; in any case I draft DE instead,
I still think a strong alternative is to move up to 13 to get a stud like Hill or Greenway.

21) Tamba Hali DE (or trade up to 13)
could be almost any of the DE's:Lawson, Kiwanuka or Wimbly
or Greenway if he drops.

52) Joel Klopfelstein TE
or Fasano or Lewis or Byrd (all TE's)
could go NT if we want to sign a fa TE (Watson or McCargo)

75) Derek Hagan WR
or Jennings, Stoval, Avant, Robinson (all Wr's)

86) Ryan Cook C
or Eslinger or Chester or Degory
We haven't extended Koppen or Hochstein
could be gone as part of trade up(then center at 136)

106) Parys Harylson DE
or Oshinowo NT or Shlagel DE

118) traded for WR or part of trade up

136) Skyler Green WR/PR
or Ross C, Montgomery C

 

[shirtsleeve]

Another excellent pick at #21, imo. But if one of these "sduds" (you never know till they strap it up) isn't available, BB will trade down. He will NOT pay elite money for what he doesn't value as elite talent. Then I see a whole bunch of names on a sheet of cardboard. You have the team picking for positional need. BB has said he absolutely will not do that this year. He stated that if the player does not work well, then the team is left with the same problem next year and is a year further behind not only there but in other areas as well. He says that all you have then is a name on a sheet of cardboard. Doesn't sound like he plans to pick the best available at any position at all. Just the best value he can get with the picks he has, regardless of position. His words. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/patriots/home.htm

 

[rookBoston]

mg,
I imagine you project Hali into the Willie McGinest role. 6'3 275# is shorter but a bit stouter than McGinest. Difference is, McGinest was a star in college, and Hali is a bit more of a one-year wonder.

Is Hali intended to play DE or OLB for us?

For 4-3 teams, players like Lawson and Wimbley (250#) are tweeners. But for us Hali (275) is the prototypical tweener. His height is about the same as Daniel Graham, and his weight is on par with Dan Klecko. That makes him a bit small at DE, and heavy and somewhat slow OLB.

I can easily envision it happening, but I do think it's a big gamble. He could be a total bust for us at #21.

 

[Ceresco]

I'm not a big fan of Hagan I'd much rather take Stovall in the 2nd, Also no RB's?

 

[Pats726]

It is interesting..evreryone has their theories and ifs and buts about players..but in the end, I am sure we all will be surprised. There will be a move he makes..OR does not make that will have all stunned. Not bad picks at all..in fact very good!! Maybe a TE a BIT too high, but one is needed.

 

[patsfan13]

Hali was the Big Ten D POTY, I would see him as an OLB in the Pats system.

I would sign up for this draft right now, especially if the WR we trade for is Stallworth.

 

[PonyExpress]

What if this week the Pats trade #86 for RB Thomas Jones and sign Ty Law to a two year deal at 7 million + incentives, including the 3 mill signing bonus, with an option for year 3? That would completely throw off all our draft plans. Hmmm...

 

[PATSNUTme]

Don't like Hali for the Patriots 3-4 defense. Again, the PAtriots want players who can do more than one thing and Hali is not it.

I think we can do better than Hagan. If we do take him I will be happy to be proven wrong.

The other picks are fine.

 

[mgteich]

Frankly, I'm more concerned with anylyzing what position we shoujld take that the players. We seem to have a few very specific needs.

I would be fine with any of the tweeners. Lawson is the prototype being much faster than the rest. And we may need to trade three picks to move up where we want in the first. I just want a stud tweener, because any one of them is a serious risk because they will need to change position. Comparing directly to McGinist is a diversion I think. McGinist was one fo the top picks in the draft. In this draft, I would be comparing Hawk to McGinist. McGinist are Bruschi are the premier tweeners. I don't think others should be expected to measure up.

The Bottom Line for me on linebackers is that I want a larger linebacker (rather then the 220-235 types), and I don't expect the top ones to be available at 21. I am GUESSING that the best place to pick a tweener for our needs is in one of three groupings: #13. #21, or #106.

I picked Hagen. You picked Stoval. I also like Jennings. The important thing for me is that #75 is about the right place to get a wide receiver because there should be one we want there.

 

[ilduce06410]

i like the groupings

Frankly, I'm more concerned with anylyzing what position we shoujld take that the players. We seem to have a few very specific needs.
I would be fine with any of the tweeners. Lawson is the prototype being much faster than the rest. And we may need to trade three picks to move up where we want in the first. I just want a stud tweener, because any one of them is a serious risk because they will need to change position. Comparing directly to McGinist is a diversion I think. McGinist was one fo the top picks in the draft. In this draft, I would be comparing Hawk to McGinist. McGinist are Bruschi are the premier tweeners. I don't think others should be expected to measure up.
The Bottom Line for me on linebackers is that I want a larger linebacker (rather then the 220-235 types), and I don't expect the top ones to be available at 21. I am GUESSING that the best place to pick a tweener for our needs is in one of three groupings: #13. #21, or #106.
I picked Hagen. You picked Stoval. I also like Jennings. The important thing for me is that #75 is about the right place to get a wide receiver because there should be one we want there.

mgteich, i'm inclined to agree with your suggestion that patriots look at players in groupings---where they believe there are no tangible differences in the likelihood of a player's being successful. who knows who they want among the ILBs rated 1, 2, or 3 on their board? i gave up trying to figger it out after logan mankins last year. after the draft, when i looked at the scouting reports on him it seemed obvious that he was a BB/.SP kind of player. but i don't read the reports closely enough, i guess, to have seen that.
hell, who knows if lawson, kiwanuka, anderson, or wimbley will turn out to be the impact player?
what BB/SP seem to concentrate on is making sure they get 1 (or 2) out of that group. IMO it gets easier to guess who they'll try to get out of a group by looking at certain descriptors. you know my mantra: BB/SP select guys who are 1. smart, 2. leaders, 3. good character, 4. a little mean, 5. football-aholics. they trade up or down to be sure they get to select from a certain group in the positions they like.
i would not be surprised to see them draft a pass catching TE, either. fauria is gone. patriots could become very troublesome with 2 TEs covering the OTs and watson in the slot.
i'd not be surprised to see them select a really quick 230-lb ILB. vilma is successful. he's too fast for OGs to get a good shot on him. so is lofa tatupu.
i will miss willie ray all this season. i wonder if they'll actually try to draft a player like him. lawson seems the type. look out for adeynanju out of indiana.
this draft and FA season bb/sp will kinda reinvent the patriots. seems we can all see that, which is why the discussions are intense this year.

 

[patsfaninpa]

Hali was the Big Ten D POTY, I would see him as an OLB in the Pats system.

I would sign up for this draft right now, especially if the WR we trade for is Stallworth.

Nothing could be farther from from the truth. He was a 3yr starter
at PSU. PSU didn't do very well in 04. But, they were the only defense
that didn't give up more than 21 pts in any game. Their offense sucked.
Tamba played very well that year too. Just didn't get any props because
of team record. His performance on the field in 05 speaks for itself.
Team came within 1 second of an unbeaten season after two dreadful
seasons. I don't think he's a great fit for a 3-4 team. But, a 4-3
team that likes to turn it's ends loose and get upfield would be wise
to draft him. He started in 03 at dt and lost weight to move to de.
I doubt if he's ever played standing up. Just too much of a projection
to see him in a 3-4 as an olb.