OT: Colts lure Kerry Collins out of retirement... - Page 4 - New England Patriots Forums

***Clonamery*** · 08-24-2011, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patchick

Here's the crux of the problem: Manning, Wayne, Clark, Saturday, Mathis, Freeney. Just about every impact player on that team is over 30.

IMO it's not about an allocation of FA resources issue, or a "win now" mentality. It's about failing to develop through the draft. Last year the Patriots had six players drafted since 2004 named to Pro Bowl or All-Pro rosters, compared with zero for the Colts. Polian just has not reloaded.

Well, they are always drafting at the end of the first round, er.....uh......um....well.....Pass interference!!!!

***MoLewisrocks*** · 08-24-2011, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PATRIOTSFANINPA

Although its early in his career,it appears one of Polian's big mistakes was taking Jerry Hughes who has done little in protecting the franchise,and thats just for starters.

If you have a HOFer at QB you need to hit on ALL early OL draft picks like the Pats have done with Vollmer,Mankins and just recently Connelly who has proven to be starter quality. - Draft OL successfully and your QB will last healthy longer.

Hughes was drafted as a passrusher. You need those to pan out as drafted players too if you go cheap on LB's and DB's in cover 2. Ugoh was the blown pick at LT. He managed to get by with Charlie Johnson, who was an UDFA I believe, but let him walk this season because he didn't want to overpay for inferior talent. He's lost the old line coaches who helped develop a lot of the late round talent he got away with mining. He's also made some bad choices in FA (Simon burned him for $13M and only played in a handful of games) and some bad investments like bestowing a bundle on a talented but snakebit undersized safety. That was an odd investment for the guy who traded Marshall Faulk away due to injury concerns. He let his replacement (Edge) walk because he couldn't justify the imbalance on the roster any more but then Addai hasn't really panned out as a replacement for that level of talent and his defensive spending hasn't panned out either.

When you have an aversion to FA you have to hit on all your picks, not just the first rounders or linemen... And Polian thee draft genius has finally come back to earth with a thud.

***reflexblue*** · 08-24-2011, 03:29 PM

Thank God, i/we don't have to hear about the "legendary" Brett Farve. I was starting to think the man was like the Un-Dead.

***MoLewisrocks*** · 08-24-2011, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patchick

They've done even less than you think to "protect the franchise" -- Hughes is a defensive end.

Until this year, the Colts only drafted ONE o-lineman in the first 2 rounds during the entire Manning era. That was Tony Ugoh, who they traded their 2008 1st rounder for. Look for Ugoh in this week's game against Detroit; he's battling Corey Hilliard, of all people, for the Lions' final OT spot.

Polian built the prototype version of his Colts team with a lot of early round draft picks. As they've won and then aged out he's found it a lot harder to rebuild or retool drafting towards the bottom of the rounds... Maybe he should have taken a page out of Bill's book and done some trading down or out or back for value...but he never did. And the media loved to compare his strategy with our Bill's (frustrating strategy) until recently...

PATRIOTSFANINPA · 08-24-2011, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patchick

They've done even less than you think to "protect the franchise" -- Hughes is a defensive end.

Until this year, the Colts only drafted ONE o-lineman in the first 2 rounds during the entire Manning era. That was Tony Ugoh, who they traded their 2008 1st rounder for. Look for Ugoh in this week's game against Detroit; he's battling Corey Hilliard, of all people, for the Lions' final OT spot.

Duh,Yeah you are right

Well they sucked at drafting him anyway

***MoLewisrocks*** · 08-24-2011, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patchick

Here's the crux of the problem: Manning, Wayne, Clark, Saturday, Mathis, Freeney. Just about every impact player on that team is over 30.

IMO it's not about an allocation of FA resources issue, or a "win now" mentality. It's about failing to develop through the draft. Last year the Patriots had six players drafted since 2004 named to Pro Bowl or All-Pro rosters, compared with zero for the Colts. Polian just has not reloaded.

You can't develop if you make poor selections or you lack the coaching capacity to develop even marginal talent. Polian had that with the old coaching staff. Doesn't any longer. It's one of the drawbacks of being a GM or a HC as opposed to the whole enchilada... Bill isn't dependent on anyone. Even Pioli when he was here was just a guy Bill taught to fit his need. He knows what he wants/needs and he knows how to develop/utilize it. On and off the field.

Froob · 08-24-2011, 03:43 PM

Good move by the colts, I thought they might do this. He's not going to put up monster numbers but you can win with him. If he gets the playbook down the colts can still be a solid team with him throwing to reggie wayne and dallas clark. Although they better hope Peyton gets back soon, Collins is good enough to compete with the texans and probably beat the browns maybe the bucs & chiefs. Addai being healthy would be huge too.

***patsfaninpittsburgh*** · 08-24-2011, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoLewisrocks

Polian built the prototype version of his Colts team with a lot of early round draft picks. As they've won and then aged out he's found it a lot harder to rebuild or retool drafting towards the bottom of the rounds... Maybe he should have taken a page out of Bill's book and done some trading down or out or back for value...but he never did. And the media loved to compare his strategy with our Bill's (frustrating strategy) until recently...

Polian has historically drafted for need not best player.

As a debate, it hurts you two ways.

The need might be inferior.

We always draft.

We never give BB the credit he deserves for trading down and out if a player is not wanted at that spot. Building up extra picks is a multi year plan that requires discipline.

Since you always have needs, you can never do this if you fill.

The end of 2010 was disappointing. Yet to go 14-2 with over 50% of snaps taken by rookies/second year players is pretty monumental.

NinjaZX6R · 08-24-2011, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patchick

They've done even less than you think to "protect the franchise" -- Hughes is a defensive end.

Until this year, the Colts only drafted ONE o-lineman in the first 2 rounds during the entire Manning era. That was Tony Ugoh, who they traded their 2008 1st rounder for. Look for Ugoh in this week's game against Detroit; he's battling Corey Hilliard, of all people, for the Lions' final OT spot.

Lol. Ugoh got cut.

PatsBoy12 · 08-24-2011, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Froob

Good move by the colts, I thought they might do this. He's not going to put up monster numbers but you can win with him. If he gets the playbook down the colts can still be a solid team with him throwing to reggie wayne and dallas clark. Although they better hope Peyton gets back soon, Collins is good enough to compete with the texans and probably beat the browns maybe the bucs & chiefs. Addai being healthy would be huge too.

I agree with your points.