Wes Welker, Hall of Famer ? - Page 2 - New England Patriots Forums

Ivan · 10-16-2012, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PATRIOTSFANINPA

It took 8 long years for the great Art Monk to get in,Welker is not guaranteed anything.

I don't see anyone guaranteeing anything, they are just saying he's heading that way, and he clearly is.

BSR · 10-16-2012, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palm Beach Pats Fan

14,000 all-purpose yards, about 700 catches & closing in on 8,000 yards receiving
-listed in the NFL dictionary under the phrase "slot receiver"

If he adds 4 more years anything at all like the last 5, you can flat-out guarantee it.

How many wide receivers with 1,000 catches and 12,000 yards are not on the HOF? Two, Tim Brown and Chris Carter. They will get in, most people think. Carter would be in now, but for his personality.

Q: How many hall of famers period have more catches and yards than 1,000/12,000?
A: One: Jerry Rice

Only two HOF-ers have more than even 800 catches: Rice, Largent, and Art Monk.

None have even close to his return yardage.

A ring will help, though. Damn that Tyree...

Enshrinement » 2012 Finalists comparative stats: Wide Receivers

The problem is there are 8 receivers that have accomplished that feat and 7 aren't yet eligible to be in the Hall yet (except for Brown).

1. Jerry Rice
2. Tony Gonzalez
3. Marvin Harrison
4. Cris Carter
5. Tim Brown
6. Terrell Owens
7. Isaac Bruce
8. Hines Ward

Moss will probably also make this list before his career is over. This many receivers suddenly hitting this mark really highlights the difference in receiving statistics. It also speaks to a coming log jam at the position. It will take quite a bit for Welker to make it.

BSR · 10-16-2012, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ivan

People keep making that claim but there is absolutely nothing to support it, if anything he just continues to get better and better, and using the logic that he has to get worse doesn't make sense in a day and age where players are lasting longer because of training, medicine, and personal care. People can start talking of Welker's decline when there is evidence on the field of it, and so far there has been absolutely no evidence of that. People said the same things when he had the major knee injury a couple of years ago and he came back better, then they said the 2 TE's would eat up his production, and agin he just got better, so until we actually see Welker slowing down and not playing as well it makes no sense to me to attribute decline to him.

Imo the only reasons for people making these claims is their fascination with draft reviews and numbers and madden ratings, and they flat out ignore his actual play and production, which is off the charts. You simply do not get rid of a player of this caliber in their prime, and that is right where Welker is at. The fans who don't appreciate Welker are morons, plain and simple, he is one of the best players the patriots, and that is obvious, and should be obvious even to the idiot Maddenites who keep ripping on him.

Slow it down paco. Nobody is busting on your boy. I'm just saying that he isn't there yet. If he goes on for the next 10 years at this pace then sure no problem. He's in. The problem is that you can't just assume it and if you do then you have to assume it for others as well. There are another 5 receivers at around Welker's age that already have more catches and yards then he does in their career. Add that to the 8 or so Hall worthy candidates already waiting to get in and you are going to have bevy of WR waiting. There are only 11 WR already in and maybe a dozen or so that could have similar numbers when they are all set and done.

Palm Beach Pats Fan · 10-16-2012, 03:51 PM

4 more years like the last 4 and he will be up around 1300 receptions and 14,000 yards. That will top the contemporaries, even Marvin Harrison w. about 1100 catches, by a fair amount.

And that is ignoring his place as a return man.

Nobody but perhaps Tim Brown among all contemporary wide receivers who would merit consideration based upon receiving skills alone (so ignoring pseudo WR specialists like Hester) will come remotely close to Wes in all-purpose yards.

***patsinthesnow*** · 10-16-2012, 03:54 PM

Dont think about quantity, think quality. What is the record for 100+ reception seasons? Rice has 4 and Welker will have 5 after this year.

VJCPatriot · 10-16-2012, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSR

Slow it down paco. Nobody is busting on your boy. I'm just saying that he isn't there yet. If he goes on for the next 10 years at this pace then sure no problem. He's in. The problem is that you can't just assume it and if you do then you have to assume it for others as well. There are another 5 receivers at around Welker's age that already have more catches and yards then he does in their career. Add that to the 8 or so Hall worthy candidates already waiting to get in and you are going to have bevy of WR waiting. There are only 11 WR already in and maybe a dozen or so that could have similar numbers when they are all set and done.

21 wide receivers in the hall of fame currently. I expect Moss to be first ballet. TO and Harrison will also get strong consideration.

I am wondering about TO though - the guy has all the stats but he was also a consistent team cancer. Do voters take that into consideration? The guy had awesome stats and a great receiver on the field but he killed lockerrooms left and right wherever he went!

stcjones · 10-16-2012, 05:17 PM

I don't think he will....if he agrees to a deal after the season is over and sticks around...I would imagine he will get into the Patriots HOF though.....

Quote:

Originally Posted by scott99

What say ye all, will Wes wind up in the Hall of Fame ? 600+ catches in 6 seasons w/the Pats. I bet he winds up with at least 900+ catches in his career. I think he makes it to the Hall.

***BradyFTW!*** · 10-16-2012, 05:21 PM

I don't think that Wes will get in, because I think passing game stat inflation is going to raise the bar significantly enough that Wes' raw production won't be able to overcome the perception that he's "just" a slot receiver and essentially a system player. I'd like to be proven wrong, though.

If he leaves after this season, I think that will basically be the end of his chances to make the HOF. He needs Brady as much as Brady needs him.

***BradyFTW!*** · 10-16-2012, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stcjones

I don't think he will....if he agrees to a deal after the season is over and sticks around...I would imagine he will get into the Patriots HOF though.....

If he never catches another pass for the Patriots, he'll still belong in the Patriots HOF

Creative Username · 10-16-2012, 05:31 PM

This is a discussion I had with my dad a couple of weeks ago.

First off, let me explain that neither I nor my father thinks that he will get in the hall if he leaves New England, because he likely won't produce as much.

As it stands, he has nearly 700 receptions and 8,000 receiving yards.
Subtract 100 receptions and 1100 receiving yards (estimates from his Miami years) that gives him 600 receptions and 6,900 receiving yards IN 5 YEARS.
So assuming we sign him to a 2-3 year deal, and he keeps up his production, he'll end up with around 800 catches and close to 10,000 yards receiving. If we win a SB in that time, I don't think it's debatable. You also have to look at the situation. He will have surpassed Rice's record of 100 catch seasons and I'm willing to bet he'll have another 120 catch season under his belt, surpassing Cris Carter for the most seasons with 120+ catches in a season with three.

As we all know, the slot machine is not stoppable by man coverage, or zone coverage. If you're having trouble believing this, then you haven't watched him play enough. I remember a play last year against Revis (a.k.a. the "best shutdown corner" in the league) and he gave up something like a 76 yard pass play whilst covering Welker.

I don't know how the voters decide who is worthy and who is not... But you look at a 5'9, 185 pound receiver with this much production. Maybe I'm biased but he's a lock for me. If not the HOF, then the Patriots HOF for sure. There's no way they could keep him out.