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Old 05-02-2012, 07:40 PM   #61
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Well isn't that the perspective we should be having considering we're talking about a player drafted in the 6th round? To me if a low round guy like Pryor does something like this once or twice a game or so, I think that's acceptable. Pryor will never be a probowler but he can be a decent rotational subpackage DT.
No, I dont think 'good' is defined by doing more than was expected, its defined by being good. When the ball is snapped I am not happy that we only got mediocre play out of a guy because he was a 6th round pick.
If Pryor did that twice a game he would be a stud. Sadly he has done it only twice in 3 years.
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Old 05-02-2012, 07:55 PM   #62
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Everyone talks about the 3-4 BB used back in 07-08, my real question is if that was the defense BB wanted to run why did he basically blow it up right after the super bowl loss to the Gaints.
He didn't.

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If we wanted players like Richard Seymor and Ty Warren we would of kept them or drafted similar players in the last 6 years. BB used a 4-3 and then shift to a 3-4 to utilize Wilfolk, Seymor and Warren best. This season we will actually see a defense that BB built from the ground up. It's going to be something innovative and unique.
We let Seymour go because the Raiders offered a first round pick for a guy who we were going to lose in a year anyways. I personally disagreed with the move at the time, but that was the rationale. Warren's gone because he didn't show up to offseason workouts, got hurt and missed a full season when he did show up, then was out of shape when he finally came back. Due to injury, he hasn't played a regular season snap of football in two years. There's no mystery to why he's gone- you're grasping at straws when the answer literally could not be more obvious.

The reason why the Patriots haven't drafted another Richard Seymour in the last few years is, quite simply, because there hasn't been another Richard Seymour to draft. Guys with his unique skills don't come along often, and when they do they're gone long before the Patriots are drafting.

The rest is just conjecture, and every defense since 2003, at least, has been one that BB built "from the ground up".

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Bequette was not brought in to back up Jones and Hightower. Spikes and Mayo will not be ridding the pine and Nink was arguably our best defensive player behind Wilfolk last year.
Jake Bequette was picked 90th overall. Ryan Mallett was selected 74th overall last year. If it's so implausible to you that the 90th pick could be spent on a backup, then how do you explain the Mallett pick? Was he brought in to start right away, too? If so, someone ought to tell Brady to start packing his bags any day now.

You keep saying this, but you have yet to give any real reason why. A backup--one one at a critical role who would figure prominently into sub packages, no less--is a very reasonable role for a pick at the tail end of the third round.

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Bequette will be playing LDE and standing up a LOLB in a 2-4 front. You will see Deaderick on short yardage and other run situations but in the pass happy NFL you will see Bequette 65% + of the time in that position

If somebody can suggest any reason other then he doesn't weigh enough or he is Ty Warren or Richard Seymor I would love to hear it but if you watching game film of our 2005 defense and making a mock draft based on that you need to stop and read the pass stats last season across the league.
I can suggest a reason: because you still have to be able to stop the run, and putting Bequette at DE all but guarantees that you'll have offensive linemen taking it to linebackers on the second level on every running play. Opponents would simply run it directly over Bequette for 5+ YPC until the Patriots were forced to remove him from the game.

The Patriots have no reason to make that sacrifice, especially when they finally have the horses to generate a real pass rush from their linebackers.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:02 PM   #63
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Default Re: Ron Brace

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Originally Posted by Marqui View Post
Well isn't that the perspective we should be having considering we're talking about a player drafted in the 6th round? To me if a low round guy like Pryor does something like this once or twice a game or so, I think that's acceptable. Pryor will never be a probowler but he can be a decent rotational subpackage DT.
Whether or not he's outperformed his draft position and whether or not he's worth a roster spot are two entirely different--and only marginally related--questions.

Pryor's provided excellent value for where he was picked, but he's still a replacement-level player at best.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:21 PM   #64
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Adam - I see your view point and can understand you points some I even agree with but my thoughts are this,

1. I believe he blew it up. But we can agree to disagree on that.
2. Our offense is built to score 30+ a game doesn't matter who our 5 technique LDE is the running game will not be a huge concern and if it is then we can simply sub in Deaderick.
3. Fanaene is 292lbs and Bequette is 274, 18lbs does not make someone a definitive run stopper or not. Also I'll note that just about any college athlete will add strength and muscle without losing speed and agility working with a NFL training team. Almost a guarantee.
4. Bequette played 3-4 LDE in college.
5. Ryan Mallatt was a special situation BB saw a QB whom he could either develop to take over for Brady in 5-6 years or the more likely is he could improve upon the value of the 3rd round pick in upcoming drafts via trade. I don't see a 2nd string OLB bringing 1st or 2nd round value in any upcoming draft.
6. If you projecting Hightower at the LOLB at 265lbs he can more then make up for any running game woes Bequette may have.
Most important the Patriots ran a hybrid and are expected to run a hybrid next year. A hybrid 3-4 is generally utilizes more or a 4-3 LDE ala Baltimore who used McPhee and Cory Redding. Bequette meets those players specification well.
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:57 PM   #65
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By the way when did it become the trend to call height length?
I wasn't aware that it had, although the two are obviously highly correlated.

Perhaps you're confusing the two concepts with each other?
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:19 AM   #66
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Whether or not he's outperformed his draft position and whether or not he's worth a roster spot are two entirely different--and only marginally related--questions.

Pryor's provided excellent value for where he was picked, but he's still a replacement-level player at best.
Pryor was starting before he got injured.
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:33 AM   #67
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I bought that up until his invisible 2011
I would admit that 2011 was a lost year,. almost as bad as 2009. However it looked like he was just coming into his own when he hurt his elbow at the end of 2010. Coming off surgery, with noo off season connection to the team due to the lockout. Missing training camp and starting the season on PUP, he was so far behind by the time he was activated in the 10th week of the season that its not hard to see why he had so little impact.

AJ, Brace is 2 gap 3-4 NT/DE, and that kind of player was not in high demand in last season's defense. It might be in more demand this season. Like I said before Brace has the skills to be the back up NT and/or run stopping DE on first down, and in SY/GL situations. It might not be the impact role we'd like to think we would get from a 2nd round pick, but its a useful role nonetheless. It looks like he will be battling the recently re-signed Gerard Warren for that role.

With Pryor coming back, plus Fanene Scott ,Jones, Bequette and probably Carter added to the mix, the competition at this camp will be extraordinary to watch.
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:48 AM   #68
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Pryor was starting before he got injured.
Not that the "starter" designation means much in this defense, but Pryor never started for the Pats last season. Feel free to check out the game books yourself, if you're so inclined:

http://prod.static.patriots.clubs.nf...2_gamebook.pdf

http://prod.static.patriots.clubs.nf...8_gamebook.pdf
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