Don't give Peyton the credit - it wasn't him, it was business as usual for the Pats D - Page 2 - New England Patriots Forums

Ron Sellers · 11-22-2010, 07:18 PM

The context of those games needs to be looked at as much, if not more than the stats. In the Cincinnati and Pittsburgh games, the outcome was pretty much already determined when a large portion of the yardage and points were allowed.

And if you're going to look at stats such as yardage then you have to look at a much more important stat: turnovers. I'm willing to bet there's a better correlation to winning and a positive turnover differential than there is to winning and a positive yardage differential.

News flash, that Peyton Manning guy is pretty good - despite his three picks Sunday. As much as we may hate to admit it, he does deserve some credit.

It is starting to feel like Groundhog Day with these weekly (daily?) "Pats defense stinks" threads.

Shockt327 · 11-22-2010, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PATSYLICIOUS

Eh, I'd have to disagree there. The fact that needed to try an onsides tells you the game wasn't as close. Indy was able to kick to to us twice and on the last drive we even picked up a first down. Different situations IMO, especially considering Peyton did it to us last year too. Gotta give him some credit for that.

Again, the biggest difference between being up 21 (Steelers) or being up 3 (Colts) is whether the O can keep scoring .....

TheGodInAGreyHoodie · 11-22-2010, 08:34 PM

Three Colts drives ended in an int. I say the defense did its job.

Metaphors · 11-22-2010, 09:50 PM

Sigh.

The defense is young. They can throw out a realistic lineup where Meriweather (26 yo) is the grizzled vet. You think they may have a hard time closing out games against Carson Palmer (#1 overall pick), Joe Flacco (1st round pick), Phillip Rivers (1st round pick), Ben Roethlisberger (1st round pick, 2 titles), and Peyton Manning (#1 overall pick, 1 title)? How about giving them a little credit for holding those QBs to 17, 17, 3, 3 and 14 points after 3 quarters. Oh yeah...and the Pats won all 5 games.

The defense obviously has some improving to do. These experiences are helping a lot of these guys grow up right before our eyes. Given reasonable health, the defense could see significant improvement by the time the playoffs start. If that does happen, the rest of the AFC better hope that the road to the SB doesn't go through Foxboro.

Now remember that the only players of consequence not under contract for 2011 are Light and Mankins...and the likelihood of 4+ impact players being added in 5 months...and the return of Bodden and Warren...well, I'm just enjoying the ride. Even if it gets a little bumpy from time to time.

RayClay · 11-22-2010, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shockt327

Peyton almost scored 3 late TDs? Must be his usual magic, right?

Well, after getting three score leads against CIN and PIT - that Patriots D allowed both Roethlisberger and Carson Palmer's offenses to score an additional three TDs late in the game.

A 31-3 game against CIN (halfway through the 3rd) ended up being 38 - 24.

A 23-3 game against Pit (in the 4th quarter) ended up being 39 - 26

Also, A 14 -10 game against the Jets (late in the 3rd) ended up being a 28-14 loss

I won't even mention the 30 points that a Ryan Fitzpatrick lead Bills team managed to score against the Pats. Or the CLE game.

Again, the biggest difference between being up 21 (Steelers) or being up 3 (Colts) or losing the game (Jets) is whether the O can keep scoring -- which they always have to -- which is why they are ranked #1 in points (out of bare necessity). The D keeps leaking like a sieve.

Turnovers are nice, but they don't happen often enough to hang your hat on 'em...

Why would he want credit for a loss?

Turnovers happened three more times to them than us, which is a good thing.

Quote:

A 23-3 game against Pit (in the 4th quarter) ended up being 39 - 26

Is this some sort of secret code? What does it even mean? Do we have to fill out a Bingo card and win the game? Please, give me a clue.

We had a comfortable lead...OK

We won the game by a comfortable margin. What were we supposed to do?

VectorPrime · 11-22-2010, 11:26 PM

Lets make this clear since you are apprentlly too dumb to realize it.

Peyton Manning is good. Not just good but one of the best of all time. He WILL score on you NO MATTER WHAT. Did you know in the 03 game we were up 31-10 at one point? The game that was decided by a final goal line stand?

Look it was the offense who left the defense out to dry, the defense played great all things considered.

supafly · 11-22-2010, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metaphors

Sigh.

The defense is young. They can throw out a realistic lineup where Meriweather (26 yo) is the grizzled vet. You think they may have a hard time closing out games against Carson Palmer (#1 overall pick), Joe Flacco (1st round pick), Phillip Rivers (1st round pick), Ben Roethlisberger (1st round pick, 2 titles), and Peyton Manning (#1 overall pick, 1 title)? How about giving them a little credit for holding those QBs to 17, 17, 3, 3 and 14 points after 3 quarters. Oh yeah...and the Pats won all 5 games.

The defense obviously has some improving to do. These experiences are helping a lot of these guys grow up right before our eyes. Given reasonable health, the defense could see significant improvement by the time the playoffs start. If that does happen, the rest of the AFC better hope that the road to the SB doesn't go through Foxboro.

Now remember that the only players of consequence not under contract for 2011 are Light and Mankins...and the likelihood of 4+ impact players being added in 5 months...and the return of Bodden and Warren...well, I'm just enjoying the ride. Even if it gets a little bumpy from time to time.

Love this post. Great points, well written.

***AndyJohnson*** · 11-22-2010, 11:39 PM

The Patriots went ahead 17 points with 10:23 left.
A strategy that says if the Colts have 2 TD drvies and the Patriots have 2 drives that take up the rest of the 10:23 it is a total, complete success.

The Colts next 2 drives took a combined 4:44.
The Patriots 2 drives took a combined 3:14 which gave the Colts the ball back at their own 26 with 2:54 left.
The first drive of the 2 took 53 seconds.
Every Patriot drive prior to that resulted in a score except one which lasted 3:06 on only 5 plays.
Had the first drive gained 1 first down and taken 3:06, even with the second drive still being the worst of the day at 2:54, the Patriots would have taken up 6 minutes of the 10:23 remaining simply by gaining 1 first down on each drive and running 9 total plays. The Colts 2 TD drives took 4:44. At best the Colts would have had to burn all their timeout and had about 30 seconds left deep in their own territory, if only the offense had gained 2 first downs and run 9 plays in 2 drives. That same offense that had 4 TDs, 1 FG and one punt after a 3:06 drive in their 6 possessions so far.
It is ridiculous to say that playing conservative and playing the clock with 10:23 left and a 17 point lead is the wrong thing to do.

***AndyJohnson*** · 11-22-2010, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RayClay

Why would he want credit for a loss?

Turnovers happened three more times to them than us, which is a good thing.

Is this some sort of secret code? What does it even mean? Do we have to fill out a Bingo card and win the game? Please, give me a clue.

We had a comfortable lead...OK

We won the game by a comfortable margin. What were we supposed to do?

Why is a turnover consider a 'bad' stop?

***AndyJohnson*** · 11-22-2010, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shockt327

Actually PIT cameback and was in the game right up until the botched onside kick....

It was a 10 point game at that time.

Botched onside kick? What does that mean? Do you really think a team down 10 and onside kicking is in the game, and NOT recovering the onside kick is a fluke?