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Old 09-13-2010, 10:26 AM   #21
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

There comes a point in the game where seconds off the clock are more valuable than points on the board. At this point in time the 1st down is worth more than the FG, so you go for it. Sometimes the D just can't stop you and you get blasted for running up the score :P
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Old 09-13-2010, 10:29 AM   #22
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

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Originally Posted by The Brandon Five View Post
PP (or anyone else with insights) to share. Any thoughts on why they didn't go for a fieldgoal near the end of the game? I was thinking that they were worried about a kick return for a TD, but the FG would have made it a three possession game again. Was he just giving the special teamers a break (they saw a lot of action today with all the scoring we did).
This came up repeatedly in 2007 when the Pats were blowing teams out and going for it sometimes on 4th down intsead of kicking FGs. When the situation makes it obvious that a FG is not needed to win the game, he thinks its stupid to just pile on points that aren't needed. Instead, he'd rather give the other team the chance to stop the drive and get the ball back.

In other words, he thinks its MORE insulting to the other team to kick the figgie than give them the chance to make the stop on 4th down.
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Old 09-13-2010, 10:30 AM   #23
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

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First TD: Here you see a boneheaded defensive alignment. On the top you see trips left with Gronk, Crump, and Welker and you know this is screaming bubble screen, but they only have the CB and Sam to cover their default assignments (this one is on the Bengals DC). But we have to credit Brady here for throwing a lot of fake audible out there and "pointing out the mike" (for effect) and this initially causes the FS to freeze, unsure of what is coming next and you can tell because he then spies on Brady for the read. By the time he figures out what is happening, it is too late to engage. Both TE's have effectively walled off Welker's route into the EZ.
Also frame 2 shows how fast NFL level defenders react. All the Bengals defenders have started strong moves towards Welker before the ball even reaches him!
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Old 09-13-2010, 10:41 AM   #24
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

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This came up repeatedly in 2007 when the Pats were blowing teams out and going for it sometimes on 4th down intsead of kicking FGs. When the situation makes it obvious that a FG is not needed to win the game, he thinks its stupid to just pile on points that aren't needed. Instead, he'd rather give the other team the chance to stop the drive and get the ball back.

In other words, he thinks its MORE insulting to the other team to kick the figgie than give them the chance to make the stop on 4th down.
I'm not sure he gives a damn about giving the other team a chance to stop the drive. The 1st down (seconds off the clock) is more valuable than the FG (3 points) when you have a large lead. It's actually quite basic strategy when you think about it. The media just sees it as an opportunity to pile on (see: 2007)
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Old 09-13-2010, 10:57 AM   #25
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

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I'm not sure he gives a damn about giving the other team a chance to stop the drive. The 1st down (seconds off the clock) is more valuable than the FG (3 points) when you have a large lead. It's actually quite basic strategy when you think about it. The media just sees it as an opportunity to pile on (see: 2007)
I disagree about passing up the FG in that situation. That's a chip shot, no way should it be blocked. Game is over with a 17 point lead, not so with a 14 point and 3+ minutes left. I was shocked we didn't take that FG and tried a 4th down play (which failed).
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Old 09-13-2010, 11:00 AM   #26
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

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I disagree about passing up the FG in that situation. That's a chip shot, no way should it be blocked. Game is over with a 17 point lead, not so with a 14 point and 3+ minutes left. I was shocked we didn't take that FG and tried a 4th down play (which failed).
A 17 point lead with 3 minutes left isn't nearly as secure as a first down, followed by 3 running plays, and giving them back the ball with 1:00 left down 14.
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Old 09-13-2010, 01:28 PM   #27
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

The fumble: I want to use this to point out a few things. For all the knocks that BB gets on this forum, some people need to realize a couple of things and this play is a perfect example to show what separates the truly elite coaches in this league from the rest. First off, this is a Bengals play that probably looks good on paper, and probably was drawn on a napkin somewhere in a restaurant and looks exciting, but when you put it into play, it really is not effective at all, and is even more disastrous when you don't really practice it, as was the case here. It is sloppily executed because first off you recognize that something is up because you have an illegal formation right off the bat, in the first frame, so you know there is a motion or adjustment coming because nobody is stupid enough to incur illegal formation unknowingly and cost themselves 5 yards. And in the second frame, you see that their plan is to flip the formation, and the Patriots D is well trained so they don't even flinch, because the illegal formation has tipped them off, because Spikes and Mayo flip without hesitation (2nd still), and they read low hat to recognize a strongside run and get a great flow to it. The Bengals OL pulls left, but the "new" LG and LT immediately mix up their assignments and allow Wright to one-gap shoot the strongside B gap unchecked, because they are already concerned with stuffing Spikes and Mayo who are already flowing before Palmer has a chance to hand off (3rd still). Wright doesn't knock Benson's block off, but he is able to get a hand in there to slow him down, just enough for Ninkovich to blindside him and that is what sets up the fumble. This is a carelessly and not well thought out play. It looks good on paper but contains such an unnecessarily complicated decoy to set up a simple play, something that BB will never do. Also it clearly was not well rehearsed, which is again something that BB will not do, so sometimes his genius is in what he doesn't do.
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Old 09-13-2010, 03:31 PM   #28
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

Into the 2nd half now.. did not really cover Guyton's interception because that was just a good defensive play. Guyton played perfect coverage and got on the inside of the route and got rewarded.

The last throw of the 1st half has been discussed elsewhere so not going to get into that.

Watching the return by Tate- he found the hole big time but has to learn to watch the big screen TV on top of the EZ to see who is behind him (old vet trick). Instead, he flips his head left-right-left which is a good way to lose speed or balance.

Working my way through the 2nd half now, if there is anything someone wants to get a closer look at, let me know.
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Old 09-13-2010, 10:55 PM   #29
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

Great great post. Can you do a few more? I never played football and only picked it up a few years back so I am not a student (but learning) of it at all and this explains things really well. I really appreciate the details. To be honest though, even I saw the first Welker touchdown pass coming.
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Old 09-13-2010, 11:32 PM   #30
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Default Re: Pats vs. Bengals: key plays analysis

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Originally Posted by Amnorix View Post
This came up repeatedly in 2007 when the Pats were blowing teams out and going for it sometimes on 4th down intsead of kicking FGs. When the situation makes it obvious that a FG is not needed to win the game, he thinks its stupid to just pile on points that aren't needed. Instead, he'd rather give the other team the chance to stop the drive and get the ball back.

In other words, he thinks its MORE insulting to the other team to kick the figgie than give them the chance to make the stop on 4th down.
Exactly correct
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