VJCPatriot

Stallworth is 6-0 196 lbs. He is no lumbering giant, but he is no smurf either. He has pretty good size and speed for the position though. Here is a link to his stats.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302227

The numbers don't pop out but he is a big play receiver that can stretch defenses which is what we are looking for. If he won't sign I think we need to think WR in the draft. Who knows when Chad Jackson will get healthy again? And he will be behind the curve again if he misses significant amount of training camp due to having to rehab that ACL.

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AzPatsFan

But the total number of passes that he catches is not high. Could it be that the ONLY thing he does well, is run deep? Teams then wouldn't use him as a regular receiver, since he stinks at it.

A sort of self selecting one-dimensional effect.

Patten was that way, but not as talented. The Pats disn't use him much to move the chains, becasue you couldn't run an offense on relying on his short and intermediate ability for getting open, and catching the ball.

JoeSixPat

Probably not the best analogy, but during the Cold War, was it pointless to have nuclear weapons because they weren't used? Or did they have a positive impact as a deterrent.

The deep threat is a deterrent. Safeties stay back because they don't know whether its coming. It's the home run ball. In baseball, if every player were a ground ball hitter, outfielders would come in just behind the infield (okay now I'm mixing my metaphors but you get the point)

When your deep threat averages 12.5 yards a catch (which includes those rare ground balls that got through to the outfield) the outfield/secondary would be stupid not to come in with such a low deep ball threat.

Actually Stallworth's 70 and 60 catch seasons I think show he CAN be used as an all around player - but he has a much greater impact for a team catching just 30-40 passes at 20 ypc.

Again - don't focus solely on his catches and yards - what would it mean to Ben Watson not to have safeties draped on his back a split second after (or during) the time he makes a catch.

What would it mean to Cadlwell to not to be double teamed on so many plays. What would it mean to RBs to have defenders more spread out?

And what would it mean to Brady to have fewer LBs and safeties gunning for Brady's head who ordinarilly would be dropped back in coverage if the field were adequately stretched?

Everyone seems so focused on Stallworth's low catches they seem to forget that football is a game of chess.

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PatsFaninAZ

1. He's available.

2. He runs good, clean, deep routes.

We need a guy like that.

We didn't have a single receiver who averaged more than 10 yards a catch last year. When that happens, you shorten the field for the defense, and it's easier for them to make plays like the critical play where we couldn't pick up a first down against the Colts with 2:00 to go.

Stallworth has consistently played in offenses that have good run/pass balance. In his 5 years, the average pass attempts per game by his teams have been 33, 33, 34, 34, 34. In that environment, he's been good for about 4 catches a game, averaging 15 yards per catch. 70 percent of his catches in his career have been for first downs. 30 percent have been for more than 20 yards. (Also, he's had over 250 total touches and lost only 2 fumbles.)

Put a guy on this team who is good for 4 15 yard catches a game, and the whole offense gets better. We shouldn't break the bank for him. But of the players available, he's a good fit.

Big Bucks

How much money does Caldwell get, take his numbers last year for the Pats which were quite simalar to Stallworth's, is the money that Stallworth would get worth that extra 10yds per catch. I'm thinking not..... 32million is way overpaying for a player that brings the stretch the field ability to the team.

sebman2112

I agree. Stallworth already has more yards, has missed one less game, ten more TD's, and a better ypc than Branch, so I can't see why he wouldn't perform well in NE's system.

JoeSixPat

Caldwell's contract was offered and signed at a time when Caldwell had never caught more than 28 passes in a season or ever stayed healthy.

I really don't want to fill my roster with a lot of guys with that resume, hoping they over achieve. So comparing the contract of a career underachiver with a proven deep threat is an apples to oranges comparison.

I wouldn't put a lot of stock in a 6 year $32 million contract report - supposedly we're offering a 1 year deal, though I do think we'd need to go a little further than that. Even if it were there's no way the full amount of that contract would be "real" - probably more like 3 years at $3 million a season rather than 6 years at $4 million.

I guess the question is, do you want 5 WRs who are 10ypc guys - and accept the fact that your TE, RBs, WRs & QBs are all going to be facing an incredible amount of pressure, taking hits, never having a chance to break a big play?

Or do you think there might be some benefit to stretching the field to keep everyone productive and healthy.

Stats involving solely catches and yards don't take that into account. Clearly, BB & SP recognize this, hence their clear interest in adding a deep threat.

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salty

First off, that 6 year, 32 million dollar deal we supposedly offered has got to be bogus. I am sure that Belichick and Pioli envision Stallworth coming here on a one year deal to prove himself.

Perhaps they would (or did) offer a longer deal with that kind of money, but I can guarantee you that it would be loaded with incentives and structured in such a way that the Patriots could easily part ways if it didn't work out. After all, the guy has injury concerns attached to him, he has not always been entirely dependable (fantastic one game, dissapears the next), and now there is the substance abuse trouble to boot.

That said, I think Stallworth would be a good fit, if the contract were very short or easy to offload. We need a deep threat on this offense. I really wonder about the people that question this assertion. Didn't they notice that last year, by mid-season, pretty much every team we faced was stacking the line of scrimmage to take away the first 10 yards? I'm amazed it didn't cripple our offense even more, because teams were able to cue up against the run and pretty much sit on our short timing routes.

The reason they were able to do that is because they had virtually no fear of being burned by a deep threat or a playmaking wide receiver that could make something happen after the catch. The timing offense will always be our bread and butter, but the potential of a deep passing game would really open up what we do best. The Patriots would be foolish not to try to get a guy that fit the deep threat/playmaker mold for next year. I'm not saying anybody will do (big fat NO to Randy Moss), but I am sure glad they are at least examining their options.

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AzPatsFan

Salty,

I agree that defenses were collapsing on our WRs and running game. But Gaffney wasn't ready to contribute until the last three games and they were playoff games. Before that it was Caldwell, and Caldwell, and Caldwell some more, and sometimes Troy Brown, occasionally.

Yet Caldwell had to run the move-the-chain routes and did so; Troy at 35 could only do short routes and only, occasionally. CJ was an injured rookie, too wet behind the ears to contribute.

This season is already different. Gaffney is now part of the equation, and he has 50 catches a season on the resume`. Welker is now part of the equation, and he has 60 catches on the resume`. Caldwell now has 60 catches on the resume`, too. I maintain Wes is a two-for-one acquisition. He can reliably catch the short ones, and Gaffney and Caldwell will be free to catch those and more of the deeper ones,as well. That pair has already proven they can reliably catch short ones and on occasion catch the deeper ones too. CJ might contribute more than last year especially in the second half. Simply having three NFL level receivers, two of which have some deep catches already, will mean they get more intermediate deep routes to run and catch.

Yet they were reliable enough to get open often enough, and catch the move-the-chains passes; and they did.

The Pats moved the chains. Enough to get within 60 seconds of the Super Bowl, without having Gaffney, except for three games. Without having Welker. Without getting anything from CJ, or Kight or Bam. Forget Stallworth or Moss.

I'd rather add another couple of LBs for depth. Don't you realize that a single injury, and undrafted, raw, near-rookie, scrubs, like Mays or Alexander are starting! Sign Asante and gets some backup LBs...

Its about building a complete Team, not signing talent.

shakadave

Marvelous post, whether the analogies apply or not!

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