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People are conflating two separate issues regarding the Patriots and their spending habits. The Patriots are not cheap as a franchise, they routinely spend to the cap and are never 40 and 50 million under, like the truly cheap teams like Cincinnatti. On the other hand the Patriots are very tight and tough when it comes to individual deals with players. Other than a few players, like Brady, they don't want to give market deals to their players and almost always go lowball when dealing with both their players and free agents.
The first part of this is true.
The 2nd part, not exactly. If they always "lowball" players they would never sign anybody. They are, however, disciplined in sticking to what they believe players are worth -- that's smart, not cheap.
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Right me calling people like you homers is worse than you just stating everyone who doesn't agree with your opinion is stupid. Get off your high horse.
Actually many posters here for years have stated that we need a CB, WR, and pass rush and that signing old cooks won't get it done, before the fact. And guess what? Every year it doesn't get it done because we come to the offseason saying we need corners, receivers, and a pass rush. Funny how that works?
I don't know what a homer is? Aren't you the guy who can't even spell hypocrite? You're actually one the biggest going to every thread calling all people that see the obvious flaws with this team morons while spouting how BB is the best. He's the best coach, his GM side has let him down the last 5 years.
And don't give you that TB crap? Matt Cassel with one of the easiest schedules we have ever had as a team with essentially the same team that went 18-1 accounted for 7 less wins. TB was worth 7 wins EVEN THEN. The defense has fallen off even worse since you put Matt Cassel on last year's team they win 3-4 games MAX. TB is the team.
They spend to the cap they aren't cheap in terms of dollars. They are cheap in terms of getting top end talent when they desperately need it and opportunities to do so were there this off season for reasonable years and $$.
Also all those contingencies this team tried to make, how'd the tight end or wide receiver contingencies work out? The ones they were sooo smart about signing by "spreading the wealth" which I call being cheap.
Oh ya here's how it worked out
Shianco- cut
Hooman- garbage player
Winslow- cut
Fells- lucky to play 5 snaps
Gaffney - cut
Stallworth - cut, resigned, IR after 1 game!
This is what happens when you become too obsessed with spreading the wealth you pay for a bunch of marginal talents that get cut because they suck or hurt because they're old.
I dont think the Pats being a superior franchise to all the others is an opinion though. I dont need a high horse to see it. It is a fact. I see the holes. I want the awesome WR just as much as you do. We all do...I guess instead of the pink hat sheep people who probably post here once a month and just say THE PATS ARE THE BEST!!!!! and all that garbage. Ok whatever...
Most people in the stands just go and root for the team and couldnt name 5 players.
I still dont get your gripe? We diddnt get Peppers. Most here would have rather not. So why is that an issue? Too much money for one guy.
Carter and Anderson were great. Werent they? What was the problem there?
They at least tried with Ochco and Hainesworth. No risk since they were both cuttable. Nobody knew Ochco would suck so bad. At least they tried? I know they diddnt get Fitz...Can they?
Regardless, you think they should just pay top end talent and then do what with the rest of the 53? Dont bother getting guys like Fells and Hooman and Stallworth because they dont meet the standards you set?
Ahhhh I think you need Roster min guys for just in case scenarios. Right?
And seriously, you correcting my typos is funny?
Are you 17?
A homer is someone who thinks WW is the greatest WR of all time. Or Curtis Martin was a better Pat than Jet....or that Kevin Faulk was better than Marshall...
That is a homer.
People on this board who show knowledge about everything football from the game side to the business side of things who support management are APPRECIATIVE because of two things.
They measure their team against the others
They measure their team against how it could be, used to be.
I hate to tell you. Your fantasy world, where the team missed out on all this glory because we diddn't sign Julius Peppers dosen't exist.
The only people acting this way are people with unrealistic, ridiculous unattainable, expectations stemming from following this team only when the going got good.
That is fair weather.
What would you be like if they were a 500 team? I remember it like yesterday. You guys cant even handle this?
Great response. How has signing jags helped the wr and pass rush woes?
Next season, 6 players for the Miami Dolphins will take up more than $50 million in cap space. How do you think their depth will look?
Players get injured. That's reality. Back in 2003, the Pats became the first team ever to have all 7 inactives be injured starters. They didn't lose a game after that. Do you really think that would be possible if they hadn't saved some money for the bottom half of the roster?
I'd like to have Dumervil. However, if I had to choose between him and having Abraham AND Vollmer, I'll choose Abraham and Vollmer every time.
Yes ... those other 31 teams competing for players and coaches do not exist in the minds of some here. They also do not factor into the NFL salary market. The ignorance of those who call the team cheap astounds me. No other local team has had this success except the Red Auerbach Celtics and they operated as they wished back then without a cap.
I concur!!! This may be the best run in pro sports history (cap related) and even non cap up there with the best.
But we diddnt get Julius Peppers...he could have made the difference.
People are conflating two separate issues regarding the Patriots and their spending habits. The Patriots are not cheap as a franchise, they routinely spend to the cap and are never 40 and 50 million under, like the truly cheap teams like Cincinnatti. On the other hand the Patriots are very tight and tough when it comes to individual deals with players. Other than a few players, like Brady, they don't want to give market deals to their players and almost always go lowball when dealing with both their players and free agents.
The Patriots way of spending can obviously be frustrating as a fan when there's a free agent you like and know they probably won't get them.
That being said, I very much prefer the Patriot way over a team like Dallas, who spends a truck load of cash on Brandon Carr, then has to restructure his contract barely a full calender year into it so they can get a couple $100,000 above the salary cap. Is that smarter? Does signing players one year and apparently not paying any attention to what things will look like the following year a smart thing?
Again, of course there's been free agents I would have liked to see us get, I'm human. But while the majority of the league was cutting players left and right a couple weeks ago, the team that was in the AFC Championship last season was sitting on $18 million BEFORE Brady restructured.
And for those that think we for sure would have another Super Bowl title or two had we dished out the money for a top free agent recently, JR Redmond, David Tyree, Tracy Porter, Mario Manningham and Jacoby Jones say hello.
This is what happens when there is no money left to pay for depth.
Right me calling people like you homers is worse than you just stating everyone who doesn't agree with your opinion is stupid. Get off your high horse.
Actually many posters here for years have stated that we need a CB, WR, and pass rush and that signing old cooks won't get it done, before the fact. And guess what? Every year it doesn't get it done because we come to the offseason saying we need corners, receivers, and a pass rush. Funny how that works?
That has nothing to do with cheap. It has to do with deciding where to spend and where not to. You act as if they spent less on an older guy so they could pocket the difference. That is simply flat out wrong.
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I don't know what a homer is? Aren't you the guy who can't even spell hypocrite? You're actually one the biggest going to every thread calling all people that see the obvious flaws with this team morons while spouting how BB is the best. He's the best coach, his GM side has let him down the last 5 years.
And don't give you that TB crap? Matt Cassel with one of the easiest schedules we have ever had as a team with essentially the same team that went 18-1 accounted for 7 less wins. TB was worth 7 wins EVEN THEN.
Umm, Cassell led them to an 11-5 season, and Brady came back the next year to lead them to 10-6. Your argument is senseless.
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The defense has fallen off even worse since you put Matt Cassel on last year's team they win 3-4 games MAX. TB is the team.
Lets just make stuff up and argue
The defense was 9th in points allowed.
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They spend to the cap they aren't cheap in terms of dollars. They are cheap in terms of getting top end talent when they desperately need it and opportunities to do so were there this off season for reasonable years and $$.
Brady
Wilfork
Mankins
Gronkowski
Hernandez
Mayo
Talib
These are big money longer term contracts. The Patriots have as many or more big money long term contracts as any team. You whining is because instead of chasing overpriced free agents they instead keep their own.
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Also all those contingencies this team tried to make, how'd the tight end or wide receiver contingencies work out? The ones they were sooo smart about signing by "spreading the wealth" which I call being cheap.
Oh ya here's how it worked out
Shianco- cut
Hooman- garbage player
Winslow- cut
Fells- lucky to play 5 snaps
Gaffney - cut
Stallworth - cut, resigned, IR after 1 game!
You are seriously complaining about the 3rd TE? The 5th WR?
Ok so lets go out and sign 10mill a year players for these 2 spots.
Who do you cut to save 20 mill, Mr Big Spender.
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Guess what bit you in the ass in the AFC championship game? No Gronk, no receivers besides Welker.
So, every team that lost because of a lack of something was cheap?
So since the SB Champs have let all their players walk does that mean all 32 teams are cheap?
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This is what happens when you become too obsessed with spreading the wealth you pay for a bunch of marginal talents that get cut because they suck or hurt because they're old.
How many starters on the Patriots in 2012 were 'marginal talents that get cut because they suck'?
Your argument is now turning into the Patriots are cheap because they don't spend $5,000,000 on backups in case someone gets hurt, and they bring in guys who may or make not make the roster for the bottom of the roster spots.
Brilliant.
I've got a general question about this: Does anyone know of a site that can show how much teams have spent towards the salary cap over the years?
I saw the spotrac.com page today and that's what I'm looking for, except with more historical information. That site showed last year's cap info, but not before that.
I want to a better handle/rebuttal for the "The Patriots don't spend money" line of thinking.
Who should they be signing this offseason, and which signings shouldn't have taken place or shouldn't happen (to offset those signings)?
btw, the first few things I see on google regarding the Pats' supposed offer to Peppers say it was worth $10mm annually -- which obviously implies that it wasn't a 1 year deal
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Originally Posted by Brady2Moss
They are trying, but the solution is always washed up old guy. I don't want to be the redskins, but think what this team could have been if they did sign Julius Peppers. His price went extremely high when the Bears decided to go crazy so its fine they didn't get him, but from what I read they offered him a 1 year 10 million dollar deal. What prime player hitting FA wants a 1 year deal?
This year there were pass rushers available yet we're in some 5 day negotiation fora 35 year old who hasn't done crap against a good o-line in 2 years (credit to Deus Irae for digging that nugget up).
This team is real close they have the dollars go get some impact players. Especially this year when a good corner and pass rusher would cost you 10 million combined for 1 year! You're done with the guy after a year it isn't a huge burden on future cap.
I'm a fair weather fan because I realize this is more likely than not the best time for the team we love to get SBs because we have arguably the greater HC and QB of all time?
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Re: Measuring "Cheap"
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